Confused to start with!!

[Dan1983]

When we did ours I just trawled through new builds on Rightmove for a floor plan that suited us.

Was thinking most new builds are efficient when trying to maximise space etc.

Found one we liked and took it to the local architect.

They upscaled it to our maximum allowable floor space, then did a few nice tweaks like relocated downstairs wc and revised upstairs bathroom dimensions to give 4 double bedrooms etc

[CharlieKLP]

8 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Yes a number - and the standard insulation levels are bare minimum to meet BRegs. Also seen them fail air tests (this was down to approved installer issues) and they have (or had) a standard air tightness target of 5 ACH which is woeful - if you wanted anything more then it had to be paid for.

 

Have you personally asked for a Condensation Risk Analysis on any of your designs ..?? And have they provided it other than the standard design elements ..??

Yes. Not sure where you got this information from. The insulation of a standard frame was always above the building regulations and was recently improved. 
Standard ultima is 0.13W/mkU. That’s above BR isn’t it. Seems fine to me but choose your own adventure.

 

of course you get better if you pay for it lol, isn’t that a given? I wouldn’t get TeK anyway, passive house is overrated.
 

[PeterW]

46 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

Yes. Not sure where you got this information from. The insulation of a standard frame was always above the building regulations and was recently improved. 
Standard ultima is 0.13W/mkU. That’s above BR isn’t it. Seems fine to me but choose your own adventure.
 

I got the information from running a business that does M&E design and inspection services for a number of new build and architect practices … and as I said - have you ever actually seen one built as the quality used to be appalling as the accountants got hold of the build quality when Potton were purchased and it went seriously down hill. 

 

48 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

I wouldn’t get TeK anyway, passive house is overrated.

Is it ..? Is your view of fabric first that it takes away from your artistic licence to produce a unique one off design for a client that represents your design soul ..??
 

Or giving a client a house that overheats in summer and is cold in winter unless they take a 2nd mortgage to pay the fuel bill ..? Or are aesthetics more important than practicalities ..??

[CharlieKLP]

5 minutes ago, PeterW said:

I got the information from running a business that does M&E design and inspection services for a number of new build and architect practices … and as I said - have you ever actually seen one built as the quality used to be appalling as the accountants got hold of the build quality when Potton were purchased and it went seriously down hill. 

 

Is it ..? Is your view of fabric first that it takes away from your artistic licence to produce a unique one off design for a client that represents your design soul ..??
 

Or giving a client a house that overheats in summer and is cold in winter unless they take a 2nd mortgage to pay the fuel bill ..? Or are aesthetics more important than practicalities ..??

No, I don’t think that’s true at all. Yes of course I’ve seen a lot of them being built. They also do open days if you want to see one in construction, they are doing a few of mine right now. They are good quality.
 

You mean when they were bought by kingspan? Like +50 years ago? That’s a long memory lol. 

not sure what you’re talking about, artistic design sensibilities? No I just don’t think you need to live the passive house lifestyle to get a nice house. 
 

you can get exactly the same design from sips as standard timber frame, the difference is cost. I don’t find a passive house any more pleasant than Ultima and it’s still well above building regs. To me it’s like buying the latest mobile phone, not really worth it unless you’re a show off with money to burn.

[joe90]

4 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

To me it’s like buying the latest mobile phone, not really worth it unless you’re a show off with money to burn.

I presume you are talking about “passiv”, well, although my design and build follows passive principles I did not go for certification, it was built to be good to look at, comfortable and cheap to run (well insulated and airtight with modern heating) I would suggest those with money to burn buy architects “statement houses” rather than those that fit the owners needs.

[SteamyTea]

6 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

I don’t find a passive house any more pleasant than Ultima and it’s still well above building regs.

Just had a quick look at passivhaus standards, 0.8 W.m^-2K^-1 for walls and 0.6 ACH.

Quick look at the same info on the Potton site, Ultima 1.3-1.5 W.m^-2K^-1 and between 1 and 3 ACH.

 

Not in the same league. Like saying a Ford Fiesta STi is fast, then being taken out in a Zonda.

[CharlieKLP]

9 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Just had a quick look at passivhaus standards, 0.8 W.m^-2K^-1 for walls and 0.6 ACH.

Quick look at the same info on the Potton site, Ultima 1.3-1.5 W.m^-2K^-1 and between 1 and 3 ACH.

 

Not in the same league. Like saying a Ford Fiesta STi is fast, then being taken out in a Zonda.

 

TEK would be the one for Passivehouse, Ultima is the standard frame.

 

ultima is fine for most people and is better than BRegs.

 

Ultima is between 0.15 and 0.13w/m2k depending on cladding.

 

https://kingspantimbersolutions.co.uk/ultima-build-system/

 

Edited October 6, 2022 by CharlieKLP

[joth]

4 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Quick look at the same info on the Potton site, Ultima 1.3-1.5 W.m^-2K^-1 and between 1 and 3 ACH.

"Between 1 and 3 ACH". What does that even mean? So they guarantee it's no worse than 3?  Why  bother mentioning ab upper limit of 1? What happens if they exceed that, they come around and poke a few holes in the walls to bring it back within tolerances?

 

[Carrerahill]

On 04/10/2022 at 13:21, Jack757 said:

Where to start!!!!

I have an 1/2 acre serviced plot with a bungalow to be demolished. Found an Architect that I seem happy with, however..... I'm so confused and we are not really off the starting blocks yet.

We were adamant we wanted a traditional block/brick house. 4 bedroom about 220/240sqm with a useable but not habitable loft, Mid spec, budget approx 500k.

Following a recent house builders exhibition, we are now thinking is a wood framed house (like Potton), oak framed or SIP better.  Previously having a new build I hated the paper thin walls hence why we like our current old brick built house but for what I'm led to believe self builds are not like this and the alternatives may be a better way to go?  

Advice please. What are people's opinions? We seem to take one step forward and ten back..

SIP look to be future proof but then I worry about reading of a 65year timescale on these and this house I potentially want to live in for the next 30 years and pass to my children being no good further down the line. 

Oak framed look lovely but seen to incorporate an awful lot of glass to most of them which we do not want and are we paying the extra just for the 'oak effect'.

Potton and the likes of do not fill me with confidence and reviews do not seem that great.

Brick/block.... Is it not worthwhile anymore, we were looking at solar panels with battery, underfloor heating, air pump etc but would this lose too much heat.

Since originally thinking of this project pre Covid prices have also considerably increased and is this size property doable still on our budget? 

Help a girl out please

It depends what you mean by better.

 

If it was me, my forever house I would build it in block/brick.

 

I've done TF and I am happy with it, but I would have been happier with block.

 

There is a recent thread on this topic and the pro's and cons where we have all chipped in the 10's of pros and cons.

 

 

[SteamyTea]

2 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

TEK would be the one for Passivehouse,

Much better at 0.18 to 0.09 W.m^-2K^-1 and between 0.05 to 3 ACH.

Bet then have never, ever managed 0.05 ACH, or 0.09 W.m^-2K^-1 for that matter.

[Carrerahill]

3 hours ago, CharlieKLP said:

If you want to use timber frame with Potton, use your own architect and ask for ‘frame only’ as it’s cheaper, no need to pay two design fees. You will get a kingspan insulated frame which I consider the best value for money.

 

I don’t adhere to the ‘oh architects spend your money and ruin your design with their input’ slander, simply not true. 
 

a good architect will improve your design and help you avoid costly build errors. People who say this are know it all’s.
 

@SarahG £2800per sqm is actually a very high build cost. 

Libel even?

 

Not met an architect yet who doesn't spend clients cash like it is going out of fashion and that's from working with local independent one man band firms through to Snohetta/Fosters & Partners and many the in-betweens! 

[CharlieKLP]

2 minutes ago, Carrerahill said:

Libel even?

 

Not met an architect yet who doesn't spend clients cash like it is going out of fashion and that's from working with local independent one man band firms through to Snohetta/Fosters & Partners and many the in-betweens! 

Well I’ve never seen a novice design a house that didn’t make me wince. Prove me wrong guys! 

[Carrerahill]

Just now, CharlieKLP said:

Well I’ve never seen a novice design a house that didn’t make me wince. Prove me wrong guys! 

Lets stick to the topic of architects spending lots of cash. 

 

DIY design is another topic for another day. However, while you mention that, practically everything Zaha Hadid did makes me wince.

[joe90]

6 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

Well I’ve never seen a novice design a house that didn’t make me wince. Prove me wrong guys! 

Very happy to do that.

[CharlieKLP]

11 minutes ago, Carrerahill said:

Lets stick to the topic of architects spending lots of cash. 

 

DIY design is another topic for another day. However, while you mention that, practically everything Zaha Hadid did makes me wince.

I don’t really like her stuff either. 

If you’re hiring Zaha Hadid no wonder you think trained designers are a waste of money.

[Carrerahill]

4 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

I don’t really like her stuff either. 

If you’re hiring Zaha Hadid no wonder you think trained designers are a waste of money.

Merely making a point. It goes two ways. 

 

Don't put words into my mouth either. I didn't say anything of the sort. I responded to a comment YOU made, and now you're accusing me of something quite different.

Edited October 6, 2022 by Carrerahill

[Kelvin]

Other half’s dad was an architect as was her uncle. The uncle in particular did some incredible designs but all commercial. When he retired he decided to build his own house. Two very accomplished architects with a catalogue of great work behind them. He went to Huf Haus and built an off the shelf house and made very few changes to it. 

[CharlieKLP]

10 minutes ago, Carrerahill said:

Merely making a point. It goes two ways. 

 

Don't put words into my mouth either. I didn't say anything of the sort. I responded to a comment YOU made, and now you're accusing me of something quite different.

I thought you said architects spend lots of cash? 
sorry if I misread that, but it looks like you said it to me.

[Carrerahill]

Just now, CharlieKLP said:

I thought you said architects spend lots of cash? 
sorry if I misread that, but it looks like you said it to me.

Re-read the conversation and you will see your error. You are conflating things. 

 

 

[PeterW]

1 hour ago, CharlieKLP said:

You mean when they were bought by kingspan? Like +50 years ago? That’s a long memory lol. 

Charlie Boy … stick to crayons and not facts please, they were bought in 2006, restructuring happened in 2008.. and then quality declined thereafter. So probably around when you left primary school.

 

[CharlieKLP]

13 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Charlie Boy … stick to crayons and not facts please, they were bought in 2006, restructuring happened in 2008.. and then quality declined thereafter. So probably around when you left primary school.

 

wow that’s pretty rude. Kind of typical though.

[SteamyTea]

55 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

Well I’ve never seen a novice design a house that didn’t make me wince

Should that not have read "I would not have done that".

You really don't help your cause do you.

[SarahG]

I think the original post has been lost over some tit for tat arguing! Poor @Jack757wont ever want to post anything on here again! Good luck with your plans and look forward to hearing your progress 😊

[SteamyTea]

3 minutes ago, SarahG said:

I think the original post has been lost over some tit for tat arguing

Yep.

 

@Jack757

Don't worry about the bickering, post away.

[joe90]

57 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

thought you said architects spend lots of cash? 

No, he (and others) are of the same opinion that architects rarely stick to budgets.

37 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

Kind of typical though.

Again No, as a professional in the building industry @PeterW has brought a wealth of knowledge to this forum.

28 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Yep.

 

@Jack757

Don't worry about the bickering, post away.

Yes ignore the comments that do not help you answer your questions 👍