MortarThePoint Posted July 29, 2023 Author Share Posted July 29, 2023 On 23/06/2022 at 08:31, Nickfromwales said: It is the worst, sack of shit advice, any manufacturer could have given anyone. Categorically avoid doing this, please. If Hepworth has a bad point, it’s in giving that bit of naff information. They’d do a LOT better just posting a link to the fitting I showed you. 🙄 I spoke to Wavin Technical yesterday and they said they don't get complaints about using Hep2O with compression fittings and it should be fine. They reiterated the preference of using a copper rather than brass olive and importance of using the insert. True knowledge comes from experience, of which I have very little. Can you share some of your experiences here? Have you had leaks with Hep2O and compression fittings in the past (grey pipe of white pipe?)? Have the leaks presented themselves straight away or worse after some time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted July 29, 2023 Share Posted July 29, 2023 On 29/07/2023 at 09:48, MortarThePoint said: I spoke to Wavin Technical yesterday and they said they don't get complaints about using Hep2O with compression fittings and it should be fine. They reiterated the preference of using a copper rather than brass olive and importance of using the insert. True knowledge comes from experience, of which I have very little. Can you share some of your experiences here? Have you had leaks with Hep2O and compression fittings in the past (grey pipe of white pipe?)? Have the leaks presented themselves straight away or worse after some time? I'll wrap this up for you, as I do not have capacity to recall all the insurance jobs I've been through and everything in between. Apologies if this is a little concise. A 'plumber' with 30+ years of experience, now working mostly in 7 figure properties (very few have a 1 or a 2 as the first digit) is telling you something is a very bad idea, stop questioning it . Ringing a manufacturer to ask if there's a problem with their fittings / or a way it's fitted...........surprise!! They said it's fine. That's because their competitors spout the same shart and they want the sale. If I am saying you can avoid this with 50p worth of copper pipe and you wish to seek advice elsewhere then of course that is your prerogative, so, for the last time (please) do not do what you're suggesting. End transmission 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 8, 2023 Author Share Posted October 8, 2023 Hep2O Clipping Distances Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 9, 2023 Author Share Posted October 9, 2023 On 29/07/2023 at 21:43, Nickfromwales said: I'll wrap this up for you, as I do not have capacity to recall all the insurance jobs I've been through and everything in between. ... End transmission Sorry, I do very much appreciate your help and am naturally inquisitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 21 Author Share Posted October 21 (edited) A major weakness in the Hep2O system is the lack of a brass wall plate elbow. They use to do them, but now only do the plastic ones (£7.90) which just aren't up to the task in my mind. JG Speedfit do a brass wall plate elbow (£11.23) and I have seen installations that use these with everything else being Hep2O. JG Speedfit make a slightly mixed statement about compatibility, but that feels like the lawyers got involved when in reality they are compatible. An alternative would be to use a Hep2O straight coupler onto a short length of copper pipe and then a brass wall plate elbow (e.g. compression). That's extra joints and expensive if you're buying copper pipe just for that bit. If you have lot's to do, then you would be looking at: Hep2O Plastic Push-Fit Equal Coupler 15mm £1.75 100mm of copper pipe £0.30 Brass Compression Adapting 90° Wall Plate Elbow £2.80 So £4.85 total which is £3 cheaper than the Hep2O plastic wall plate elbow. It has two extra joints though which is not ideal as adds two extra potential failure points. I used a Hep2O Plastic Push-Fit Adapting Male Coupler 15mm x 1/2" (£4.85) into a 1/2" x 1/2" wall plate elbow (~£4) which was hard to find. Edited October 21 by MortarThePoint Add other JG Speedfit image (toolstation) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russell griffiths Posted October 21 Share Posted October 21 Why the compression wall plate, end feed and solder it. then straight coupler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 21 Author Share Posted October 21 (edited) 4 hours ago, Russell griffiths said: Why the compression wall plate, end feed and solder it. then straight coupler. Yes, could do that way too. Probably better as I have just seen that some people advise against inaccessible compression fittings which makes sense. Edited October 21 by MortarThePoint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceverge Posted October 21 Share Posted October 21 What exactly is this wall plate for? The only thing I've used one for is an outdoor tap and then it's been MDPE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy_wafer Posted October 21 Share Posted October 21 transitioning from hep to copper and bringing pipework out of the wall neatly at a guess. Well it was when I was playing at plumbing! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 22 Share Posted October 22 When fitting these in bathrooms, I use the compression ones with a short piece of copper and then Hep2O on to the copper. The pressure there is low because it’s feeding an open-ended outlet, so it’ll never see static cold mains pressure anyways. I use brass for strength, but I’ve also used a brass compression 15mm tee with a 1/2” centre Link with a 4-6” piece of copper in each side. One side as the feed, and then the other end to a hep cap end with 2 clips either side of the tee to hold it all steady. That was for a heavy shower arm where I wanted a bit more ‘beef’ to the fixing methodology. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 22 Share Posted October 22 10 hours ago, crispy_wafer said: transitioning from hep to copper and bringing pipework out of the wall neatly at a guess. Well it was when I was playing at plumbing! You’d just use a Hep elbow for that and then clip the pipe where it’s on show to keep the pipe from moving? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 22 Author Share Posted October 22 (edited) 11 hours ago, crispy_wafer said: transitioning from hep to copper and bringing pipework out of the wall neatly at a guess. Well it was when I was playing at plumbing! Mainly for providing a point of connection at the end of runs for bath and basin taps, loo cisterns etc. I don't want Hep2O going into a loo cistern as doesn't look so good. Edited October 22 by MortarThePoint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G and J Posted October 22 Share Posted October 22 8 minutes ago, MortarThePoint said: Mainly for providing a point of connection at the end of runs for bath and basin taps, loo cisterns etc. I don't want Hep2O going into a loo cistern as doesn't look so good. For that very reason we are hiding our cisterns in the walls. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy_wafer Posted October 22 Share Posted October 22 4 minutes ago, G and J said: For that very reason we are hiding our cisterns in the walls. same, but for basins and baths, although likely to be concealed by furniture or under the bath I just used these to keep pipework orderly, then a hep to 1/2 transition into and 1/2 to 15mm press fit (as I've got a tool for this) transition out for the bath, or to a 1/2" grohe (or similar) iso valve for the basin. Probably more complicated than it needed to be, but just looks right to my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 22 Author Share Posted October 22 32 minutes ago, crispy_wafer said: same, but for basins and baths, although likely to be concealed by furniture or under the bath I just used these to keep pipework orderly, then a hep to 1/2 transition into and 1/2 to 15mm press fit (as I've got a tool for this) transition out for the bath, or to a 1/2" grohe (or similar) iso valve for the basin. Probably more complicated than it needed to be, but just looks right to my eyes. I've used this (or similar) for one of my showers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Ambrose Posted October 22 Share Posted October 22 @G and J Stating the obvious - but you do want to be able to get at those easily. I see lots of bathrooms where that isn't the case. I thought I allowed for it in my present place, but it's not as easy to work on them as I'd thought - 2 to 3 hours of buggering about to change the tank or valve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 22 Author Share Posted October 22 5 hours ago, Alan Ambrose said: @G and J Stating the obvious - but you do want to be able to get at those easily. I see lots of bathrooms where that isn't the case. I thought I allowed for it in my present place, but it's not as easy to work on them as I'd thought - 2 to 3 hours of buggering about to change the tank or valve. Ideally I would and in most places have made some sort of provision. But for the shower valve attachment they are going to get tiled over so it would be a job, but not impossible to get at them again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 28 Author Share Posted October 28 On 22/10/2024 at 09:36, crispy_wafer said: same, but for basins and baths, although likely to be concealed by furniture or under the bath I just used these to keep pipework orderly, then a hep to 1/2 transition into and 1/2 to 15mm press fit (as I've got a tool for this) transition out for the bath, or to a 1/2" grohe (or similar) iso valve for the basin. Probably more complicated than it needed to be, but just looks right to my eyes. Using this with the Hep2o fittings / pipes at or below the surface of the blockwork means that the female thread is about level with blockwork surface. That means once tile is added, the thread is recessed quite a bit (10 - 15mm). How do you hand that so that you can then use a standard mixer bar with its offset connector thingies (shown below)? The ones I have don't accommodate going much behind the included cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 28 Author Share Posted October 28 (edited) Here's a photo of it screwed together and the cover is tight to blockwork so no space for tiles Edited October 28 by MortarThePoint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy_wafer Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 This sort or widget Tap Extension - 1/2" M x 1/2" F - 10222 Can be got in various lengths 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Laslett Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 (edited) For my shower handset connection I used the Alfie fixing which I saw on a Skillbuilder promotional video with Robin Clevett. There is an option for Hep20 compatible connection. Edited October 28 by Nick Laslett 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortarThePoint Posted October 28 Author Share Posted October 28 12 minutes ago, crispy_wafer said: This sort or widget Tap Extension - 1/2" M x 1/2" F - 10222 Can be got in various lengths Oh to have a plumbers van with all these bits in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocster Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 32 minutes ago, MortarThePoint said: Here's a photo of it screwed together and the cover is tight to blockwork so no space for tiles I had exactly this issue ! it was a pita and I brought the entire fitting forward in situ just to gain a few mm for the tiles . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy_wafer Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 11 minutes ago, MortarThePoint said: Oh to have a plumbers van with all these bits in. haha, i wish, I'm battling with a shower tray waste that came with a shower tray. These things are I think are designed just to cause lots of head scratching and multiple days worth of googling to identify the right bits just to connect a few bits together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocster Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 2 minutes ago, crispy_wafer said: haha, i wish, I'm battling with a shower tray waste that came with a shower tray. These things are I think are designed just to cause lots of head scratching and multiple days worth of googling to identify the right bits just to connect a few bits together. Wastes supplied with trays are almost universally shite ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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