Struggling with timber to steel

[ToughButterCup]

@pocster, by chance this morning I'm doing the same job as you . And by chance I remembered the guidance I downloaded from the manufacturers.

Here's (the German version) the company guidance with formulae (FFS)

[Pocster]

  On 03/03/2022 at 11:37, ToughButterCup said:

@pocster, by chance this morning I'm doing the same job as you . And by chance I remembered the guidance I downloaded from the manufacturers.

Here's (the German version) the company guidance with formulae (FFS)

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I think you need more practice- come and do my job 😁

[redtop]

I had loads of these to do. Well in excess of a hundred. I bought a bulk pack of mixed drill bits from screwfix. Then used the 5mm ones to make the pilot hole. 2 or 3 holes and its blunt, but they are dead cheap. Then use those self tappers and it works a treat. I just used my cordless drill and it was fine.

[dangti6]

I screwed a wall plate to a 254 x 146 x 143 UB which had a flange thickness of 12.7mm. I used these which have a long enough cutting end bit to go through material of that thickness and possibly a bit more - I have the box somewhere and I'm sure it listed the max material thickness 

 

 

[ToughButterCup]

  On 03/03/2022 at 11:57, redtop said:

...Then used the 5mm ones to make the pilot hole. 2 or 3 holes and its blunt, but they are dead cheap. Then use those self tappers ...

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Wish I'd thought of that method   😏

[redtop]

  On 03/03/2022 at 12:07, ToughButterCup said:

 

Wish I'd thought of that method   😏

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If you see my other thread for calculating size of a soakaway when you cant get a digger in you would realize my brilliance in all things...

[Thorfun]

  On 02/03/2022 at 15:51, pocster said:

Yeah. I think I read that before. For some reason I see that as an accident waiting to happen i.e. don't trust myself....

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+1 for a nail gun. I hired this https://www.jewson.co.uk/p/nail-gun-JTH03300 from Jewsons. did the job perfectly and no injuries were sustained. was fully PPEd up with ear defenders, goggles, gloves etc. just be careful and you'll be fine and it'll do the job in a fraction of the time. 

[saveasteading]

Hilti gun warning. For 15mm steel you need the strongest bullets. I took a shot for interest. Even with a warning the recoil was a shock  and if let go would be very dangerous. I always specced screws where possible....and you know they are fixed.

Speak to a proper fixings supplier and tell them what you are fixing. A box of very good screws is cheaper than hilti nails too, let alone hire charges.

Edited March 3, 2022 by saveasteading

[Pocster]

  On 03/03/2022 at 12:34, saveasteading said:

Hilti gun warning. For 15mm steel you need the strongest bullets. I took a shot for interest. Even with a warning the recoil was a shock  and if let go would be very dangerous. I always specced screws where possible....and you know they are fixed.

Speak to a proper fixings supplier and tell them what you are fixing. A box of very good screws is cheaper than hilti nails too, let alone hire charges.

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Yeah I ain’t going down the gun route . You should see the damage I can do with a ‘harmless’ foam gun 

[saveasteading]

Harmless foam gun indeed. They are banned by me because of collateral damage.

[ToughButterCup]

So come on @pocster which method are you (in your madness) going to use?  I recon @redtop's is best ...

[Pocster]

  On 03/03/2022 at 12:55, ToughButterCup said:

So come on @pocster which method are you (in your madness) going to use?  I recon @redtop's is best ...

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As in that video I linked .

teq drill bits . Wd40 , Jack . Give that a try tomorrow 💪💪💪🇺🇦

[redtop]

  On 03/03/2022 at 13:06, pocster said:

As in that video I linked .

teq drill bits . Wd40 , Jack . Give that a try tomorrow 💪💪💪🇺🇦

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Even water helps, but tbh it wasn't too hard with the pilot bit first. Not for me anyway.....

[Pocster]

  On 03/03/2022 at 14:09, redtop said:

Even water helps, but tbh it wasn't too hard with the pilot bit first. Not for me anyway.....

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I’m guessing my current drill bits aren’t man enough . Even trying to get a decent pilot hole is hard work .

[redtop]

  On 03/03/2022 at 14:11, pocster said:

I’m guessing my current drill bits aren’t man enough . Even trying to get a decent pilot hole is hard work .

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I just used cheap as chips multi pack from screwfix,    ERBAUER STRAIGHT SHANK HSS DRILL BIT TRADE PACK 150 PIECES, 30quid for 450 pieces. Couple of holes and chuck it in bin.

[Onoff]

How big a hole do you need to drill as a pilot?

 

No.1 use decent bits. DeWalt Extreme are superb.

 

Use a cutting compound. Dip the drill end in before you start then periodically as you drill.

 

I'd post links but can't seem to paste them in now???

 

 

 

 

[markc]

Always handy to have a big bag of assorted holes in your tool box.

[Onoff]

  On 03/03/2022 at 16:33, markc said:

Always handy to have a big bag of assorted holes in your tool box.

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Don't joke. "Holes" are a thing. An ex boss was apprenticed at Redpath, Brown & Co. Was sent to get some "holes" and thinking they were taking the pi$$ refused. Got docked a day's pay etc. "Holes" as they were colloquially known, were punchings where a few were saved for welding up incorrect holes. 

[markc]

  On 03/03/2022 at 16:39, Onoff said:

 

Don't joke. "Holes" are a thing. An ex boss was apprenticed at Redpath, Brown & Co. Was sent to get some "holes" and thinking they were taking the pi$$ refused. Got docked a day's pay etc. "Holes" as they were colloquially known, were punchings where a few were saved for welding up incorrect holes. 

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Sounds similar to when I did a lot of timber engineering, especially Glulam, if you found a rotten bit, find a suitable sized knot from the saved bin and routed the beam to accept the knot and glue it in then sand flush

Edited March 3, 2022 by markc

[ToughButterCup]

  On 03/03/2022 at 16:43, markc said:

... routed the beam to accept the knot and glue it in then sand flush

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Genius. The number of knots I have thrown away 🤪 - not any more

[markc]

  On 03/03/2022 at 16:54, ToughButterCup said:

 

Genius. The number of knots I have thrown away 🤪 - not any more

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The timber structures were often over boarded with T&G boards and loads of knots fell out, at 12,15 or 18mm thick they were perfect for snot holes in the sides or faces of beams. You did get the odd eagle eyed smart ar#& who spotted a knot crossed a couple of laminations but not often

[Simplysimon]

  On 03/03/2022 at 14:11, pocster said:

I’m guessing my current drill bits aren’t man enough . Even trying to get a decent pilot hole is hard work .

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said previously, you favourite black and yellow extreme drill bits

[Pocster]

  On 03/03/2022 at 18:50, Simplysimon said:

said previously, you favourite black and yellow extreme drill bits

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Funnily enough I ordered them from eBay and the seller never sent them !!! Dewalt scammer !!

[Pocster]

Glued those noggins in the steel - they ain’t going anywhere.

 

Regarding this method with drill , timber and clamp ….. It will work but … when I properly workout how many holes I have to do and access to the steel then it’s not going to be much fun . Also ( sad to say ) my Dewalt drill died ; smoke ; splutter ; dead 😞

So had to order to new one .

 

Realising as usual a man fails whilst trying to save pennies I also ordered a cheap mag drill . Not Dewalt ; but it’s yellow 💪

[saveasteading]

Low-tech is often best.

 

You can glue the board onto the bottom flange, and is tidy to lap the side boarding over it, and glue or screw the lap.