Self-Build with UK outside the EU

[Ferdinand]

Now that the EU-UK Trade Agreement is finalised, and due to be signed, this new thread is about self-build in the new environment.

 

There is a decent summary of the agreement here: at the Institute for Government, which has both the salient points of the agreement and an interpretation in human-ese:

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/publication/future-relationship-trade-deal

 

We will keep the focus a little (!) more tightly on self-build than the previous threads.

 

Ferdinand

 

[ProDave]

For me, the deal is good news. I will hopefully shortly be ordering the windows for our Sun Room, something I was unable to manage in 2020.  I was not looking forward to the prospect of having to pay tarrifs on windows imported from the EU.

 

Hopefully this deal means everything remains the same with no cost impact on our window purchase.

[joe90]

I do think that some will raise their prices and blame Brexit (rightly or wrongly) I think some did this with decimalisation (fir those old enough to remember it ?).

[newhome]

6 minutes ago, joe90 said:

I do think that some will raise their prices and blame Brexit (rightly or wrongly) I think some did this with decimalisation (fir those old enough to remember it ?).

Certain organisations are still blaming Covid where others have managed to move forward and adapt. As an example, many dog breeds should have their hips X-Rays and checked prior to breeding from them. The British Veterinary Association that grades the X-rays shut down completely and only reopened recently. They have a huge backlog. They have now shut down again and cite that they can’t do the grading unless on site. X-rays are submitted digitally so there is no reason why they couldn’t have adapted in the 9 months since the initial lockdowns but they’ve done nothing. Now UK breeders are sending their x-rays to be graded in the US or Australia as they have managed to sort themselves out to work remotely and returning the grading in under 3 weeks. They are a lot cheaper too. It’s just pathetic how many organisations (I don’t say businesses as most businesses have had to adapt or go under) are still blaming everything on covid. 

[Temp]

The Brexit deal means there won't be tariffs on imports from the EU but the VAT rules are still changing. This will effect you if you buy direct from an EU based company rather than through a UK based agent. 

 

Currently you can reclaim VAT paid in an EU country but I doubt that will continue. You should/will probably pay UK VAT on arrival at a UK port and reclaim that. 

 

I doubt this will affect many people though. Some buying from German suppliers on ebay might get caught out and have to pay UK VAT.

Edited December 28, 2020 by Temp

[SteamyTea]

16 hours ago, joe90 said:

I think some did this with decimalisation

This happened when we were out of the country (lived in France then), and I had a bit of an argument on our return with a shop keeper (Martin's Newsagents) that there were 240 old pennies in a pound, not 200.

Thieving bastards.

[Oldsteel]

Thanks for this thread @Ferdinand. I have been dipping in and out of this forum for a good while because I was due to start in March last year ('nuff said) and then again in October but the builder and groundworker then didnt fancy the timing. We are on a sloping site and previous ground clearance work in Feb saw machinery sliding down the hill though the mud! Would have reluctantly postponed again with no-deal but now we have a deal the planned start date is April 1st (!). Will be on a bridging loan so time is money and I am concerned about material delivery delays. Nearly all the suppliers I am asking for requotes (last quotes were Autumn 2019) are putting prices up by 10%. Timber seems to be in the spotlight as most of it is imported from Eastern Europe, but hopefully by April things will have settled down a bit. Nevertheless I will ask the builder to pre-order more than he would normally (and he has a yard to store it) to ensure we are not sitting waiting for anything. My roof tile supplier is quoting orders now for October delivery! That order has gone in (no deposit thankfully).

Anyone else looking at a start within the next 6 months? How are you feeling about it? Most builders are up to their necks in work so I see no option than to lock them in for the April start based on their availability. In any case I want to finally get this house built!

Edited December 29, 2020 by Oldsteel
reword

[Temp]

23 minutes ago, Oldsteel said:

 Nearly all the suppliers I am asking for requotes (last quotes were Autumn 2019) are putting prices up by 10%. Timber seems to be in the spotlight as most of it is imported from Eastern Europe, but hopefully by April things will have settled down a bit.

 

£ is down a bit over the past year..

 

[Oldsteel]

Hmm yes I hadnt thought of the £ falling. I think the exchange rate with the € will probably stay where it is so there will be an immediate increase on anything imported, plus the cost of the extra paperwork. But we have no choice but to suck it up. I am resigned to a 5-10% increase in material costs overall, hopefully labour will be about the same.

[Temp]

Have seen mention that the deal doesn't cover all goods. Apparently  there are some things we can no longer sell to the EU. No idea if there are things that they can't sell us. 

 

Edit: Found a list here..

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/list-of-goods-imported-into-great-britain-from-the-eu-that-are-controlled

One thing that might be relevant is this section..

 

Anti-dumping duty and countervailing dutiesProducts subject to anti-dumping duty and countervailing duty measures. This covers a range of goods, including but not limited to products from the following sectors:

• fertilisers
• biodiesel
• ceramics
• steel
• aluminium

 

Presumably that's mostly raw materials not things like aluminium windows.

Edited December 30, 2020 by Temp

[Ferdinand]

@Temp

 

I think that list is things which is subject to customs control. I read that as "declare as it may be liable to duty".

 

Ferdinand

[Temp]

3 hours ago, Ferdinand said:

@Temp

 

I think that list is things which is subject to customs control. I read that as "declare as it may be liable to duty".

 

Ferdinand

 

Yeah its mostly dangerous stuff but its the only list I can find.

 

So far sausages are the only thing I've seen we can't export to the EU. I recon it in retaliation for..

 

https://youtu.be/OzeDZtx3wUw?t=90

 

 

 

[joe90]

14 minutes ago, Temp said:

sausages are the only thing I've seen we can't export to the EU.

Unless they are frozen, then we can ?

[Ferdinand]

I'm interested in the process that will happen with those German discount plumbing suppliers.

 

Megabad and so on.

[Temp]

11 hours ago, Ferdinand said:

I'm interested in the process that will happen with those German discount plumbing suppliers.

 

Megabad and so on.

 

I last looked at this some time ago so I might be wrong now or out of date..  As I recall the process and VAT treatment is different depending on the order value.

 

For small orders I believe they are meant to register with HMRC, charge UK VAT and remit this to HMRC.

 

For larger orders I think they they are meant to ship it VAT free (no EU or UK VAT) as you will be charged UK VAT on arrival at a port of entry. Someone will call telling you how much VAT to pay and what their handling fee is. In other cases the post man put a note in your post box with a demand for the VAT. This is meant to happen already for orders from ourside the EU (China for example).

 

I can't remember where the break point is but think its in the £50 to £150 range.

 

My guess is some small companies may not bother to make changes for the UK market. They may just continue to quote "inc EU VAT" prices to everyone that visits their web site. If you pay that beware you might have to pay UK VAT as well. 

[Temp]

Here you go.. 

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-and-overseas-goods-sold-directly-to-customers-in-great-britain-from-1-january-2021

The break point is £135.

 

 

[Temp]

Also noticed this..
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-and-overseas-goods-sold-directly-to-customers-in-great-britain-from-1-january-2021
Quote: "Low value consignment relief (LVCR), which is an import VAT exemption for goods valued at £15 or less, has been removed.."

 

Paying a bit of VAT isn't a big deal as long as the post office don't charge a £9.99 fee to process it.

 

Edit: Sorry its £8..

https://personal.help.royalmail.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/7208/~/help-with-paying-customs-fees

For items sent through the post, Royal Mail pay HMRC any import VAT and Customs Duty on your behalf. This ensures you receive your item as quickly as possible. We’ll then send you a Fee to pay card. This shows how much you need to pay before you can receive your item. The amount will include our £8 handling fee

 

So that 10p washer ordered from ebay and sent from China could end up being £8.12p.

 

 

Edited January 1, 2021 by Temp

[Temp]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55530721

 

Quote

EU firms refuse UK deliveries over Brexit tax changes

Some EU specialist online retailers have said they will no longer deliver to the UK because of tax changes which came into force on 1 January.

Bicycle part firm Dutch Bike Bits said from now on, it would ship to every country in the world except the UK.

"We are forced by British policy to stop dealing with British customers," it said on its website.

Another firm, Belgium-based Beer On Web, said it was now shunning the UK "due to the new Brexit measures".

The companies are angry because they now face higher costs and increased bureaucracy in order to comply with UK tax authorities.

However, it is unclear how many have taken the drastic step of refusing all UK orders.

At the same time, international shipping companies including Federal Express and TNT have said they are levying additional charges on shipments between the UK and the EU.

They said this reflected the increased investment they had had to make in adjusting their systems to cope with Brexit.
 

 

Edited January 5, 2021 by Temp

[Ferdinand]

5 hours ago, Temp said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55530721

 

 

 

I think I can help with this one.

 

I think the BBC are being somewhat trolled, or perhaps lazy. I have already answered some of this elsewhere a couple of days ago. I wonder if they read the site? We have MPs and at least one member of SAGE who read it, so they may.

 

The linkage about "Brexit VAT Changes" is not real afaics - those are to do with preventing VAT fraud on Ebay / Amazon etc by Chinese suppliers. Professor Murph said back in 2018 in an EU Parl enquiry that it was of the order of billions a year, and he was about right imo.

https://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2018/06/28/the-scale-of-eu-tax-fraud/

 

I believe the EU themselves will be following suit on this. No idea what overall implications would be when it pans out.

 

Dutch Bike Bits is a garden shed firm run by a very good UK expat bike blogger David Hembrow (A View from the Cycle Path), who is also viscerally passionate on the politics. I think he'll find a way, since much of his custom is here.

 

Major bike sites (eg bike24.de) seem to be up and running with things like a one euro surcharge on delivery, which is sensible.

 

On the VAT for microbusinesses I think HMRC need a separate VAT threshold of say 10k for small importers.

 

Note sure on the beer site. 

 

So yes potential issue, but other stuff going on.

 

F

[Temp]

Thanks, The FT confirms what you said.

 

Adds that the government could have left the rules for the EU the same as other countries but realised they wouldn't have the capacity to police it. 

 

Financial Times: UK VAT changes for foreign mail-order sellers create ‘chaos’.
https://www.ft.com/content/bae02f57-a648-45fd-a774-6b341aa59caf

 

 

Edited January 5, 2021 by Temp

[Mr Punter]

On 01/01/2021 at 13:16, Temp said:

So that 10p washer ordered from ebay and sent from China could end up being £8.12p.

 

I would be very happy if this happened.  As it is, the postal charges from China for these small items seem lower that those sent within the UK.

[Longjock]

So, has anyone ordered anything this year and been hit with the import vat yet?

 

I'm looking to get some Illbruck tape from a German supplier on eBay (as not only are the items cheaper than the UK suppliers but the postage costs are also - Scottish Highlands surcharge!!!

 

The value of the order will be over the £135 threshold though.

Edited February 6, 2021 by Longjock
Typo

[Temp]

Didn't i read somewhere that ebay are collecting VAT? 

 

Would you be ordering from the UK or German Ebay site?

 

 

[Temp]

Sorry ebay is only collecting it on orders under £135.

[Longjock]

Yep, I read that also. I was just wondering if anyone had actually done it yet and how hey were 'presented' with the tax bill? By the courier or what?

 

I've had a good look at the product listed and I'm not sure it's even the right one now, so will likely be buying from the UK.