Brink Flair 300

[Olf]

CVC stocks only Flair 325  but going through PHI database I found Flair 300 - actually quieter and of slightly better performance. On top of that it can be sourced for £1600 (incl. delivery), so 1/3 cheaper than 325.

Judging by the fact that all the manuals are in Dutch only, I think it is version for Brink's domestic market, but comparing side by side with manual for 325 I could not find any massive differences.

 

Has anybody got experience with this model?

 

 

[Levo]

Anybody?
@Olf Did you manage to find any more info on this?

[Conor]

@Olf @Levo I've just asked m friend that installs MVHR system on what he thinks - he often sources units like this from Denmark and Germany. Will report back. I'm keen as well as it's coming in a fair bit cheaper than the Zehnder equivalent I'm looking at.

Edited November 17, 2020 by Conor

[Levo]

1 hour ago, Conor said:

@Olf @Levo I've just asked m friend that installs MVHR system on what he thinks - he often sources units like this from Denmark and Germany. Will report back. I'm keen as well as it's coming in a fair bit cheaper than the Zehnder equivalent I'm looking at.

?

If the PHI table is correct, the Flair 300 also looks to be quieter than the Zehnder and the Flair 325.

[Levo]

I have done some more investigation on this:

On the technical side, the Flair 300 and 325 on the physical side are the same, same part codes except for one item; the 300 has Wifi for app control in Dutch, whereas the UK/Interrnational version 325 has a touch display unit. If you want wifi, you will need to buy R Home for 250-300. 

I have also spoken to CVC, the official UK distributor. He wasn't aware of the new UK shop fronts selling the Dutch version and contacted Brink and the Brink's position is that they are grey imports and will not be covered by warranty. Probably they can't refuse currently and one would be OK until December but who knows what will happen in the New year, especially with a no deal Brexit?

I will try and get the UK version from CVC if I can negotiate an acceptable price. If there are others interested, we may be able to gang up?!

[Olf]

@Conor, @Levo thanks for your input - at 2/3 of the price for the lack of warranty, it still seems to be a fair deal to me. Wifi control being free perk

I donwnloaded the app and it can be set to English as well, so no issue here.

The only problem I can see is using it for new builds, as it doesn't have SAP numbers and if someone sniffs at using Flair325 figures instead, that may end up as some non-compliance - but correct me if I'm wrong. In case of refurb, that doesn't matter.

I'm actually about to go ahead with it, once I finally finish my battle with BPC and have some pipes to connect.

[Levo]

Hi Olf,  I will be installing into my 1970s house and SAP numbers only matter if you need some new build certification, as far as I am concerned.

For new builds, the PHI certification should count for something though.

I have asked CPC for a quote and got an almost reasonable discount but if you are about to order and would like to buy the UK version, we can ask for a better discount.

[Levo]

I went with the Brink 325 from the dealer at the end.

I turned up at the shop and they were quite helpful and also gave me an extra discount off the bottom line for the order which includes Lindab attenuators and Ubbink ducting and Plenums in addition to the Brink Flair.

[Levo]

On 18/11/2020 at 19:42, Olf said:

.... and have some pipes to connect.

I've been checking the prices for pipes and how to convert 160mm to 150mm.

There are some sites selling "ventilation pipes" at quite high prices but I came across the 160mm underground pipes sold at Toolstation.

https://www.toolstation.com/plumbing/160mm-underground-drainage/c267

The elbows are 87.5 degrees but if you are using opposing bends, you can compensate for it and the radius seems a lot rounder than the regular PVC pipes.

Has anyone given a thought to these? Any reason not to use them?

[Olf]

Good idea - as long as you can insulate the stretch running through the cold space, then a pipe is a pipe - if it's watertight, it will be airtight too and of course you can treat any connection inside and outside just to be 300% sure.

[Levo]

" ... to be 300% sure. " ?

I am thinking of digging some of the existing insulation to make grooves and than put a 200mm layer on top, whichever pipe I use.

Still not sure if I should do the bendy bits out of the unit using the round 160mm pipes and than the long runs using the rectangular ducts.

I think these will be a lot more compact and easier to cover. The pressure loss in these is very similar to 150mm round pipes.

Wonder if anyone had any experience with these? Good or bad?

[willbish]

3 hours ago, Levo said:

Has anyone given a thought to these? Any reason not to use them?

The browns ones are not UV stable as they are for underground use. Black should be fine.

 

Is the only reason you are not using the semi rigid insulated duct to save a few pennies?

https://www.phstore.co.uk/insulated-foam-duct-160

 

BTW Ive been following this thread with interest having the 325 plus spec'd for my build but not yet parted with the cash for it. 

[Nickfromwales]

40 minutes ago, willbish said:

The browns ones are not UV stable as they are for underground use. Black should be fine.

 

Is the only reason you are not using the semi rigid insulated duct to save a few pennies?

https://www.phstore.co.uk/insulated-foam-duct-160

 

BTW Ive been following this thread with interest having the 325 plus spec'd for my build but not yet parted with the cash for it. 

Very good units, PH certified, and nice and quiet in operation. Easy to maintain and now with smart home assistant connectivity and remote diagnostics too. ??
 

CVC Direct have been outstanding for support and after sales service so I don’t go anywhere else now ( after being burnt by ESaveP ? ). If they fell into a bucket of tits they’d come out sucking their thumbs..... 

I fitted a cheap unit from ESaveP for a previous individual and the build quality vs cost saving was not an economical choice.

You’ll be fine with Brink, and they are now my weapon of choice ( going forward from earlier issues with said penny-pinching ). 

[Levo]

15 hours ago, willbish said:

Is the only reason you are not using the semi rigid insulated duct to save a few pennies?

Unfortunately yes ☹️ but having said that I could have got a really good price for them, I might still try.

It is one of these things, you look at the price and it seems high and one ignores them. Now that I am looking at the PVC prices, they are not exactly cheap either.

On another note, they are real clunky at around 20cm diameter and being soft, need to be handled with kids gloves. At least feels that way. Obviously once you lay them, you can forget about them.

"... brown ones are not UV stable..."

They will go in the loft and also under rock wool. Not much exposure to UV.

[JOE187]

https://www.plumbingforless.co.uk/ventilation/ducting    

Good source for Pvc ducting and also BES.

[Levo]

On 22/11/2020 at 14:26, JOE187 said:

https://www.plumbingforless.co.uk/ventilation/ducting    

Good source for Pvc ducting and also BES.

Thanks Joe. Got distracted with other stuff at the moment, will follow up on this later.

[Triassic]

Remind me, which of the ducts (Inlet or outlet) needs to be insulated?

[PeterW]

1 minute ago, Triassic said:

Remind me, which of the ducts (Inlet or outlet) needs to be insulated?

Inlet if it’s in a warm space as the cold inrush air will chill the duct and you get condensation on the outside. 

[Pete]

30 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Inlet if it’s in a warm space as the cold inrush air will chill the duct and you get condensation on the outside. 

I am doing inlet and outlet just to reduce heat loss from the building. ( I have the materials leftover so might as well use them)

 

33 minutes ago, Triassic said:

Remind me, which of the ducts (Inlet or outlet) needs to be insulated?

 

[Triassic]

57 minutes ago, Pete said:

( I have the materials leftover so might as well use them)

So have I.

 

The insulation is on my job list (very long job list). However I need to get the plasterboard finished, so its come up the priority list.

[larry]

Really interesting thread: also come across the 300 via the PHI database, has anybody actually fitted it, and does it have an internal humidistat?

 

And, levo how did you get on getting the pipes down from 160 ? Do you mind me asking what plenums and vents you used? Interested in the soil pipe idea so would love to know how this worked if you ended up doing this

[larry]

Ps The 300 now seems available for just over £1400 from https://www.ventilationland.co.uk/brand/94/brink-climate-systems.html currently , who knows what will.happen to EU prices over the next few weeks though as it seems this is a Dutch site with an english front end 

[larry]

And... Are these units as quiet as you'd think from the dB ratings on PHI? Would love to hear any real world experience

[Conor]

@larry @Olf @Levo I've been looking in to this a bit more. None of the standard Brink units come with a built in RH sensor - just temperature. So only boost option is single contact push button for a 30min boost. Also, if you want a RH sensor, you need to buy the "plus" version, so that's another £180 or so. And sensor seems to be another £140... so not so cheap after all.

Edited December 16, 2020 by Conor

[Olf]

My cunning plan is to hack the speed controller socket (X14): it's a bunch of volt-free contacts wired to RJ12 plug. Added benefit is that the humidity sensor can be made smart: response to spike of the level above average, rather than fixed level - which if set low, on some damp days can trigger MVHR to boost all the time.