Why is so much plumbing stuff such utter rubbish?

[ProDave]

Tenant in our rental house phones this morning, water dripping through the ceiling.

 

It's the expansion vessel in the top of the Telford UVC leaking AGAIN.

 

It has rusted through at a weld where the threaded coupling is welded to the body of the vessel. No doubt rusted from the inside,

 

 

This is less than 2 years old, replaced when the previous one leaked in the same place.  I was shocked when the previous one rusted through and started leaking.  Even more shocked that this one, failed at less than 2 years old.

 

Of course the plumbers merchant I bought it from is shut, otherwise I would be arguing with them (I probably will when they re open)

 

And I can't find a plumbers merchant open today.  I will be trying again on Monday to find anybody open in Inverness that has one.  Until I get a replacement the tenants have no hot water (they do have an electric shower they can use)

 

Screwfix have one listed but not in stock and saying Friday.  Can't get to speak to them.

 

Utter shambles we are in, but the point of the thread is my disgust at the lack of quality of much of the stuff being sold.  And yes it was an expansion vessel rated for potable water.

 

Toolstation have one but don't say it's for potable water so I assume not.

[Russell griffiths]

I keep having the same problem with electronic stuff, 3-4 years and bang gone. 

 

I wonder what what the law is with fit for purpose regs, it might only have a 1 year warranty, but would you not expect something to last longer than 2 years. 

 

Maybe we should start pestering the stockist to actually find where this tat is made. 

[Big Jimbo]

32 minutes ago, Russell griffiths said:

I keep having the same problem with electronic stuff, 3-4 years and bang gone. 

 

I wonder what what the law is with fit for purpose regs, it might only have a 1 year warranty, but would you not expect something to last longer than 2 years. 

 

Maybe we should start pestering the stockist to actually find where this tat is made. 

Bosch, i believe, is now all made in UAE. Tools in the last 25 years have become much cheaper, just like washing machines, dishwashers etc. Most beople, i believe, would no longer consider getting a washing machine repaired if it is over a couple of years old. £200 will buy you a new one. You can buy a new combi boiler for £400. Things have got much cheaper. On the basis that they are made to a price point (Crap)

[joe90]

This is why I love mechanic ing (playing) with my 54 year old car, 60 year old tractor and 64 year old dumper, fully repairable, all bits available and no “specialist tools” to work on them. (Just finished re building the dumper engine with thanks to @scottishjohn for his help).

Edited April 25, 2020 by joe90

[Big Jimbo]

3 minutes ago, joe90 said:

This is why I love mechanic ing (playing) with my 54 year old car, 60 year old tractor and 64 year old dumper, fully repairable, all bits available and no “specialist tools” to work on them. (Just finished re building the dumper engine with thanks to @scottishjohn for his help).

I can also help Joe with advice. Tidy the bloody workshop.?

[joe90]

2 minutes ago, Big Jimbo said:

I can also help Joe with advice. Tidy the bloody workshop.?

haha, that’s exactly what I am doing today, all stuff out on the drive, sweeping up, crap on the trailer ( for when the tip opens) and all tools back in their proper place, gosh it’s great being retired, think I will walk the dog after lunch ?.

[ProDave]

@joe90 Is the dumper now working?

[joe90]

50 minutes ago, ProDave said:

@joe90 Is the dumper now working?

oh yes, rings were knackered =no compression, glaze busted the bore ( which was not too bad) new rings, and lapped the valves in. Was surprised the injector was ok, pitted with rust and seized into the head but the spray pattern was good. Straightened a few bent bits and it started first turn !!!!!! It lives again ?

[scottishjohn]

6 hours ago, ProDave said:

Tenant in our rental house phones this morning, water dripping through the ceiling.

 

It's the expansion vessel in the top of the Telford UVC leaking AGAIN.

 

It has rusted through at a weld where the threaded coupling is welded to the body of the vessel. No doubt rusted from the inside,

 

 

This is less than 2 years old, replaced when the previous one leaked in the same place.  I was shocked when the previous one rusted through and started leaking.  Even more shocked that this one, failed at less than 2 years old.

 

Of course the plumbers merchant I bought it from is shut, otherwise I would be arguing with them (I probably will when they re open)

 

And I can't find a plumbers merchant open today.  I will be trying again on Monday to find anybody open in Inverness that has one.  Until I get a replacement the tenants have no hot water (they do have an electric shower they can use)

 

Screwfix have one listed but not in stock and saying Friday.  Can't get to speak to them.

 

Utter shambles we are in, but the point of the thread is my disgust at the lack of quality of much of the stuff being sold.  And yes it was an expansion vessel rated for potable water.

 

Toolstation have one but don't say it's for potable water so I assume not.

how much more is a SS one or one made in EU,not china

Edited April 25, 2020 by scottishjohn

[ProDave]

I have not yet found a SS one.

 

The original one, supplied by telford with the cylinder lasted about 10 years, and the bladder went.

 

If I could buy a SS one, with a replacable bladder I would (or would if I expected to be owning the house for very much longer)

 

It seems daft that the UVC is SS and let down by a bit of mild steel rubbish. How anyone thinks that is going to last a long time with potable water (i.e. there won't be any rust inhibitor) beats me.

 

The local plumber recons the merchant  where this one came from less than 2 years ago will be open on Monday.  If so we will have a discussion.

[dpmiller]

water alone won't rust it- where's the air coming from, or is there something galvanic going on?

[ProDave]

It's mains water so there is bound to be a certain amount of air in it.

 

It's mild steel screwed into stainless steel.

[dpmiller]

earths all good, anode (if so fitted) in good nick?

[ProDave]

Earth bonding all good.  No idea if there is an anode, no mention of one in anything that came with the cylinder.

[Jeremy Harris]

Looks like weld corrosion from that photo.  We had something similar with a small 8 litre pressure vessel, failed in the same location.

 

You can get stainless ones that I'd guess might permanently fix this, and one might be a good option for where you are, as I suspect that the water there might be slightly acidic.  Slightly acidic water may well make the corrosion problem worse.  I bought one of these stainless steel pressure vessels, and so far (~5 years) it's been fine: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/8-litres-1-thread-stainless-steel-pressure-vessel-accumulator-water-tank/174144644679?hash=item288bd46647:g:0pUAAOSw6GJeD0n0

 

The other advantage of these PVs, is that the bladder can be changed if it fails.

[ProDave]

There's an 18L SS one on the bay just now for a good price.  I will have a chat with the tenant tomorrow and see if he is prepared to wait a few days to get a better one posted here rather than the tat the local merchants sell.  But it will likely be the end of the week before it gets here.  That's the trouble when you are fixing a breakdown of something that is urgent and the local suppliers don't stock the quality stuff.

[Jeremy Harris]

I

5 minutes ago, ProDave said:

There's an 18L SS one on the bay just now for a good price.  I will have a chat with the tenant tomorrow and see if he is prepared to wait a few days to get a better one posted here rather than the tat the local merchants sell.  But it will likely be the end of the week before it gets here.  That's the trouble when you are fixing a breakdown of something that is urgent and the local suppliers don't stock the quality stuff.

 

I've bought from Highland Pumps a couple of times, and found them pretty helpful.  They are not far from you, so it might be worth giving them a ring to see if they stock them: https://www.thehighlandpumpcentre.co.uk/

[ProDave]

10 minutes ago, Jeremy Harris said:

I

 

I've bought from Highland Pumps a couple of times, and found them pretty helpful.  They are not far from you, so it might be worth giving them a ring to see if they stock them: https://www.thehighlandpumpcentre.co.uk/

Thanks I didn't know them, I will phone them tomorrow.

 

Not looking too promising as all they have on the website have feet to make them free standing.  And they don't state they are SS

The one I want just screws into a female G3/4 thread on the top of the tank so needs no mounting of any sort.

 

I guess I could grind the mounting legs off and invalidate any warranty.

[Jeremy Harris]

TBH, I'm not sure what they stock, but the chap that runs the place was very helpful when I spoke with him on the 'phone (got a feeling his name may have been Willie).  If they don't stock stainless ones, I suspect that what they do stock might be slightly better than you might get from the local plumbers merchant, perhaps, as their main business is selling stuff for private water supplies, where reliability is pretty critical.  The other thing is that they are local to you, so probably know what the local water does to stuff.

[SteamyTea]

What always surprises me with plumbing stuff is the ridiculous amount of fittings.  Most are a minor variation on a theme.

Is that really necessary?

[ProDave]

Okay found one.  Only one in Inverness it seems.

 

For those wondering, a summary of my findings:

 

Highland pump centre, no answer assume shut

City plumbing, open but don't have it in stock

Plumbase, no answer so assume shut

Plumbstore, open to account holders only, no flexibility.

Dobies, no answer, assume shut

Plumb centre, dud phone number on yell.com

William Wilson, no answer, assume shut

And finally Wolseley, open for contactless collection, only 1 in stock, paid for and going to collect it shortly.

 

 

[ProDave]

Just back from fitting the new one.

 

I have to say this new one is an order of magnitude better.  It is the sort that has a flange that can be removed to replace the bladder. I still don't think it's stainless steel, it looks more like galvanised or some other plating.