Basic cement/ ballast Q

[PeterW]

@redtop I would just make a catch trough for the mix you need and ask the plant to put a retarder in it - even with a machine you will struggle to mix consistently. 

[redtop]

32 minutes ago, PeterW said:

@redtop I would just make a catch trough for the mix you need and ask the plant to put a retarder in it - even with a machine you will struggle to mix consistently. 

thats not a bad idea!

[Russell griffiths]

30 minutes ago, redtop said:

thats not a bad idea!

Can you not use a dumper, there cannot be a lot in each pile cap. 

[redtop]

Just now, Russell griffiths said:

Can you not use a dumper, there cannot be a lot in each pile cap. 

yes, can get a 3T dumper on site. but it would need to be driven around 800M from the bottom of the hill. each cap is 450X450X300 mm and there are 41 of them

 

re pumping. i can get a concrete wagon close (ish) to other end of the site.  Probably within 60 to 100M of the piles, and it would be a downhill pump from the estate road down footpath and onto the site.. this might be the easiest option

[zoothorn]

On 25/08/2019 at 18:39, PeterW said:

@redtop I would just make a catch trough for the mix you need and ask the plant to put a retarder in it - even with a machine you will struggle to mix consistently. 

 

Hi chaps- thanks for the replies/ back from b'hol break & seen replies.

 

Hi PeterW- sorry I'm not understanding catch troughs, retarder, or the talking to plants bit..

 

Yesterday the big b'stard pillars, low-down @ stream side, have been set!! 2x 1m high (x 2ft dia) drainage tubes solidly dug into my bank down to stream bed level. Took all day of a pro & me helping. Today PM we concrete: mixer used here obviously. Rebars in too.

 

Pro said only 2x needed on stream side as pretty damn big [3x would be OTT: log cabin's corners @ 2.3m.. so a 2.5mx2.5m cabin, smaller than orig idea of a 3mx3m job]. So if I use the now spare 3rd 1m tube, halved, for the 2x upper side corner footings.

 

Pro outlines idea of 1/2 sleeper uprights (IE 'ripped in half' lengthways), set into resin-bolt-set brackets fixed in the 4x concrete tops > very sturdy 9x2(?) beams coach bolted etc > joists across > Cabin on. So if this idea is seconded/ ok'd perhaps by you guys..

 

I have 2x 0.5m high (x 2ft dia) concrete corner footings to do myself.

 

 

[zoothorn]

Pro chap & me did these two bigger/ tricky/ low stream-side 2x footings last 2 days. 1m deep (2ft dia). Very happy/ less obtrusive than I worried they'd be.. & we put well into bank so side of cabin will be the 2m away from my boundaryline (other thread).

 

So the 2x upper corners to do myself. Easier @ 0.5m deep (but still a big job myself- esp as 1st time using a mixer). Pro chap has left me his mixer, tamper bar, angle grinder, shovels.. v.good of him. I have mixer set ready, barrow to pour in > then shovel or pour in me' ole.

 

We put 3x rebars in each big'un. He's told me once I get my two 0.5m holes dug out on the top-side of slope (tops ~1m above lower 2), to 1st tamp the base as won't be as 'stream bed' solid as lower 2 we did.

 

Do I need to add the rebars in these top 2 too?

[Onoff]

Same mixer as mine I think. I bought the last 6 genuine belts a while back.

 

 

[Onoff]

I wonder if it's worth cantilevering the "floor beams" out the extra 2m when you build the cabin to create a balcony. Worst case you get pulled ref the 2m rule and you have to cut it back.

[zoothorn]

Just now, Onoff said:

I wonder if it's worth cantilevering the "floor beams" out the extra 2m when you build the cabin to create a balcony. Worst case you get pulled ref the 2m rule and you have to cut it back.

 

Hi Onoff- yes that's bang-on my new plan in fact: now I have the 2m to stream centreline (boundary) I needed, pro chap suggested exactly this too. All good ideas- but 1st I need to do these top 2 footings: tricky for me alone.

 

Its the rebars- whether to add, say I lump hammer 3x in each ~0.5m into ground/ so 3x 1m rebars in each foot.

 

What you think- may as well, or not neccessary (I can rtn if so/ helps £save beans).

[zoothorn]

29 minutes ago, Onoff said:

Same mixer as mine I think. I bought the last 6 genuine belts a while back.

 

 

 

Bela or s'thing? was wondering mfr in spain? he bought £180 18 yrs ago, it lives outside permenantly (that's tough here/ like rainforest moisture all year) & never has missed a beat he says, bar a crap switch design. I am scared of it- being a mixer:virgin.

 

 

[Onoff]

21 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

 

Bela or s'thing? was wondering mfr in spain? he bought £180 18 yrs ago, it lives outside permenantly (that's tough here/ like rainforest moisture all year) & never has missed a beat he says, bar a crap switch design. I am scared of it- being a mixer:virgin.

 

 

 

Belle. Means mixer like Hoover means vacuum cleaner.

 

Be afraid, be very afraid! Never be tempted to stick anything in it whilst it's going round, like a shovel or you'll go with it.

 

Mine was given to me on the usual "if you can get it going or it's going down the tip" basis.

 

Has a Schuko mains plug / socket on I believe, which was knackered on mine. Too long ago to remember how I repaired it but I think it involved Isopon.

 

Switch on mine is fine. My 4 leg stand has disintegrated. My drum has a few holes too. Last time I used it I had to reweld one of the paddles on.

 

Always wash down/out properly especially if borrowed.

[zoothorn]

@Onoff whadya reckon for my 0.5m upper 2 footings.. rebar or not to rebar? £20 each footing in £rebar, so maybe worthwhile?

[Onoff]

No.1 - Do something about those sticky out re-bars before you slip on the slope and impale yourself! Cut flush or jam a lump of timber over them with a hole drilled in a bit.

 

Are said re-bars in the picture just bits of straight rod stuck in vertically? 

 

 

Ths concrete columns I see usually have a rolled mesh cage in them or flar plate/ vertical stud arrangement.

Edited August 29, 2019 by Onoff

[zoothorn]

O

1 hour ago, Onoff said:

No.1 - Do something about those sticky out re-bars before you slip on the slope and impale yourself! Cut flush or jam a lump of timber over them with a hole drilled in a bit.

 

Are said re-bars in the picture just bits of straight rod stuck in vertically? 

 

 

Ths concrete columns I see usually have a rolled mesh cage in them or flar plate/ vertical stud arrangement.

Yup he's such a nice chap (dublin) he's even left me his angle grinder to whip these impalers off whilst off on hols. So if Onoff thinks job1 then I'll do 1st thing tmrw.

 

"Are said re-bars in the picture just bits of straight rod stuck in vertically?" Onoff, my dear chap.. this is Wales ?

 

Yup rebars in vertically- I rammed them home, me: honestly these elephants feet footings -are- overkill for a french oak sleeper upon each to go -up- 1m or so, then meet the beams etc etc.. all for a 2.5m sq log cabin (a fairly small one tbh). So I'm not too concerned rebar or not on my upper fwo footings..  but your opinion I respect the most.

[Onoff]

I'm not saying do it on the ones yet to do or that you should have done it on the ones already poured, just what I'm used to on commercial sites where I see columns and piles and actually have been involved in building machinery support plinths for 35 years...

 

Re-bar cages serve to reinforce the column against crushing loads that may otherwise fracture/crumble the column. 

 

A DIY method of installing vertical bars made into a cage:

 

https://www.instructables.com/id/Make-Rebar-Cages-On-site-For-Concrete-Piers/

 

Sometimes re-bar columns are spiral wound.

 

Dropping a couple of random rods in vertically will undoubtedly help but it's not really "designed" as such. 

 

For what you're doing a good strong mix with a waterptoofer in should be fine and don't sweat the lack of reinforcing cage.

 

Anyway yours is more of a pile or footing and to some extent you've the added "benefit" that they're in the ground so have lateral ground pressure acting against them.

 

Tbh yours "look right" pretty much so carry on regardless!

 

It's only a f**king shed!

 

Looking forward to seeing you bring your woodwork skills to bear.

 

Edited August 29, 2019 by Onoff

[zoothorn]

1 hour ago, Onoff said:

..It's only a f**king shed!

 

Looking forward to seeing you bring your woodwork skills to bear.

 

 

Exactly- its overkill so far hence the 1/2 arsed dublin-wales rebars! I only used these 2ft dia tubular elephant-massives (booyakasha) cos my chap had them to hand (cheaper for me), & the next-down available from jewsons etc are 6m long..... & only 1.5 ft dia = actually too slim tbh: so better go OTT dia, a bit than underdo it.

 

I'm thinking french oak sleepers going upright ~1m on these 2x stream-massives bc they're nice & square edged, to fit in to metal brackets + give a nice impression stream-side (booyakasha, again) to my nice new n'bors.

 

My 'shed' is 2.3m cubed (to peaky top bit too).. so far from a whopper: the 20% overhang/ countersink wtf idea ios great/ going with the idea.. but how do I span the 2.3m + 20%? with what kind of loooong beam-?

 

I'm really stoked up on this project tho- gonna be great, stoked up [-still-] on Stokes' 135no providing zoot's 100% pure rocket-fuel too which, no doubt about it, has helped!! wonderfuel.

 

thx- zoot

Edited August 29, 2019 by zoothorn

[Onoff]

7 hours ago, zoothorn said:

 

Exactly- its overkill so far hence the 1/2 arsed dublin-wales rebars! I only used these 2ft dia tubular elephant-massives (booyakasha) cos my chap had them to hand (cheaper for me), & the next-down available from jewsons etc are 6m long..... & only 1.5 ft dia = actually too slim tbh: so better go OTT dia, a bit than underdo it.

 

I'm thinking french oak sleepers going upright ~1m on these 2x stream-massives bc they're nice & square edged, to fit in to metal brackets + give a nice impression stream-side (booyakasha, again) to my nice new n'bors.

 

My 'shed' is 2.3m cubed (to peaky top bit too).. so far from a whopper: the 20% overhang/ countersink wtf idea ios great/ going with the idea.. but how do I span the 2.3m + 20%? with what kind of loooong beam-?

 

I'm really stoked up on this project tho- gonna be great, stoked up [-still-] on Stokes' 135no providing zoot's 100% pure rocket-fuel too which, no doubt about it, has helped!! wonderfuel.

 

thx- zoot

 

Tried the above in Google Translate but to no avail... ?

[Onoff]

@zoothorn, you're flying by the seat of your pants here by not employing a structural engineer.

 

However...a bit of half educated searching always helps. Check this out. You will have I think to sign up to Pinterest. General guidelines from the States about cantilevered decks. I'd just pick the nearest equivalent metric sized timber and maybe go one size up depth wise for good measure. Make sure the timber strength classes are the same too.

 

I too am a master of winging it!

 

https://pin.it/g4efp3374gryet

 

Just don't blame anyone but yourself if it ends up as a raft! 

 

Edit: Got a feeling you're going to love Pinterest!

Edited August 30, 2019 by Onoff

[zoothorn]

I have translated my post for you:

-----------------------------------------------------

 

"Its only a f**kn shed"..

 

Exactly- the huge (2ft dia) tube feet are overkill so far! I only used these big'uns, cos my chap had them to hand (cheaper for me), & the next-down are only 1.5 ft dia (& 6m long) so too slim tbh: so better overengineer it than underdo it.

 

I'm thinking french oak sleepers going up ~1m on these 4x feet, bc having used oak jobs before I know have nice square ends, surely a better fit into metal brackets > concrete,& give a nicer impression stream-side to my nice new n'bors (my pro chap works for ELM Wales who built the big osprey hide & big boardwalk jobs etc, so knows all about overhangs/ how the build the base/ ideal chap for job. He's sketched the basics for me so I'll ask on here once 4x feet done).

 

My 'shed' is 2.3m cubed.. so not a whopper: the 20% overhang/ countersink idea is great/ I was thinking of going with the idea anyway.. but how do I span the 2.3m + 20%? with what kind of looooooooooooooooooong beam-?

 

[I'm really stoked up on this project tho- gonna be great, stoked up [-still-] on Stokes' 135 not out (vs the crims) providing zoot's 100% pure rocket-fuel too which, no doubt about it, has helped!! wonderfuel]. This, is cricket spiel.

 

thx- zoot

[dpmiller]

how do you know that 2ft diameter is overkill but yet 1.5ft is "too slim"?

[zoothorn]

21 minutes ago, Onoff said:

@zoothorn, you're flying by the seat of your pants here by not employing a structural engineer.

 

However...a bit of half educated searching always helps. Check this out. You will have I think to sign up to Pinterest. General guidelines from the States about cantilevered decks. I'd just pick the nearest equivalent metric sized timber and maybe go one size up depth wise for good measure. Make sure the timber strength classes are the same too.

 

I too am a master of winging it!

 

https://pin.it/g4efp3374gryet

 

Just don't blame anyone but yourself if it ends up as a raft! 

 

23 minutes ago, Onoff said:

@zoothorn, you're flying by the seat of your pants here by not employing a structural engineer.

 

However...a bit of half educated searching always helps. Check this out. You will have I think to sign up to Pinterest. General guidelines from the States about cantilevered decks. I'd just pick the nearest equivalent metric sized timber and maybe go one size up depth wise for good measure. Make sure the timber strength classes are the same too.

 

I too am a master of winging it!

 

https://pin.it/g4efp3374gryet

 

Just don't blame anyone but yourself if it ends up as a raft! 

 

Hi Onoff- great link/ thanks.

 

I don't need a structural engineer tho, to build a shed base on my 4x massives. The chap's sketched me the build plan (inc 20% cantilevered extra walky bit, stream-side) & its simple enough. As I said in my translated post, the chap works building big 30 ton(?) hides/ boardwalks.. this project's small beer for him so I just follow his basic idea, even things out via help with a thread = so it should go ok, fingers x'd.

 

But I'll get to this once I've done my other 2x topside feet.. the mixer's looking at me menacingly right now! gotta lotta diggin to do 1st .For the other 2x feet I'm using same tube (we had cut it into 3x 1m tube sections, original idea 3x stream-side pillars you see) the 3rd one now unused.. which I'll saw in half for 2x topside feet.

 

Even if I don't get it perfect,  the one thing it will be is solid/ the last thing it'll be is me winging it, or it being a 'raft'.. that's not giving me much credit!

[zoothorn]

4 minutes ago, dpmiller said:

how do you know that 2ft diameter is overkill but yet 1.5ft is "too slim"?

 I put it in my zoot'puter

[dpmiller]

so you don't have any data?

[Jeremy Harris]

How many people here bother to get an SE involved, or do any sort of foundation calculations, when they put up a shed in their garden?

 

Looking at those concrete bases I'd say they are way big enough for the shed that's going to be partially resting on them.  Heck, some just stand sheds on blocks or slabs laid on the ground.

[Onoff]

When I do my 30m2, passive-esque garden room it'll incorporate details gleaned off of the various threads here with not an SE in sight. I might make reference to my mid 80s copy of Part A for the flat roof joist detail but that's about it. The walls will be in effect a timber frame detail similar to Zoot's extension but I'll work backwards from a decent U value. The floor will be up to 300mm eps with a 100mm slab and UFH. For the green roof again I'll just copy what others have done here.