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Everything posted by JohnMo
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The ASHP install. Lots of heating on/heating off then fingers crossed.
JohnMo commented on TheMitchells's blog entry in Renovation of Ellesmere Bungalow.
I would set that so it's only 2 degs below normal day time setting, otherwise being a low temperature system, it will take a long time to recover. If it recovers quickly you have the flow temperature set way too high. The way Grant do things from what I read, normal gas engineers install the heat pumps, Grant Corporate Engineer does the commissioning. -
I would definitely split system. If you are fixed on oil. Get a 100-150L buffer for heating and or WC capable boiler. Then an UVC for DHW. If you wanted you get a coil in the buffer and use as cold water pre heat for the DHW cylinder.
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Heat pumps like Daikin, Panasonic have inbuilt algorithms where you add tariff, CO2 intensity details and it controls the heat pump and boiler as needed. You need the CO2 output as the default setting and make it difficult to change. The average consumer would have zero interest in changing from the default settings anyway. Looking at Daikin schematic the heat pump is just added to the heating circuit return line, so you don't even need a tee or check valve
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Trouble is it will not really work like that as the system is a closed loop with a blending valve. The return water from the UFH as you say will need to be heated by say 10 degs. So you start with the water going through the coil, hot water coming out say at 70 Deg say at 20L/min. This water will be mixed with cooler return water say at a 25-75 ratio. So now via the mixer, you have water returning from UFH at 35 less 10 degs, so at 25 degs, 75% of this goes in to the bottom of the mixer and has hot water added by the coil to be at 35 for the UFH. The other 25% of the return water goes through coil. So you have a 5 L/min of 25 Deg water entering the coil to be heated back to 70 degs. So now the centre of the cylinder is cool and the stratified cylinder is no more, because that water will want to sink and cause lots of heat currents in the cylinder. Not really sure it will work that well. Think you will just end up with warm DHW most the time. For the period we are heating the UVC we have only warm water, as it completely destroys stratification. You will have this continually. Just do a thermal store?
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I did nearly exactly the same. Not BnB, but increased insulation to 200mm and slab above that to 100mm concrete instead of screed.
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Read the rules and state where it says anything with respect cooling not being allowed. Some rule about 10 years ago did exclude cooling but not the current ones.
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I would be concerned with continuously running out of DHW. You are basically running the cylinder as thermal store but with DHW in it instead of heating circulation water. You would have to be careful with the coil placement to get meaningful energy available for the floor and DHW. New build, why an oil boiler and not a heat pump?
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Why not posi rafters? Then either in fill or insulation on top.
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Some photos of mine, left hand side are an inlet and out water connection. The controller is on the right hand side. Bottom image is the cover on
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A paper sponsored by the government Hybrid_heat_pumps_Final_report-.pdf
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No need, so why would you. You just need a small 4kW heat pump and it tees into existing system.
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Depth of Hearth in front of Wood Burning Stove
JohnMo replied to benben5555's topic in Stoves, Fires & Fireplaces
Bottom line is you have to follow manufacturers instructions. If the manufacturer says 600mm, as an example, that's what you have to do. Manufacturer instructions trump building regs. Choose log burner you are going to install follow those instructions. -
That would work for me I'm on about my 10th house. But many just don't move from one decade to the next. So they would just stay as they are, no incentive for the many. What makes you say that? Zero need to switch to boiler until it hits about 3 degs. How many days a year do you get below that? daikin hydro split pump tee'ed to the existing system. Parts just over £2k. No need for a cylinder either.
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The ASHP install. Lots of heating on/heating off then fingers crossed.
JohnMo commented on TheMitchells's blog entry in Renovation of Ellesmere Bungalow.
The traditional way to operate a boiler (in the UK) was to run a boiler at an elevated temperature, have hot radiators and bounce of a the thermostat. So heating on heating off, repeat. When timer stops house gets cold repeat the next day. Boiler efficiency is dire, the boiler doesn't condense, so gets 80% if you are lucky. A heat pump operated that way takes a large hit in running costs. The best way is either Weather Compensation, so flow temp changes with outside temperature. The heat pump ticks away at a very high efficiency keeping the house at a stable temperature 24/7. The other version of this is to have a small setback at night, but essentially the same strategy for flow temp varying with outside temp. Your installer should really have left the heat pump operating this way. Search on here for weather (see attached) Heat-Pump-Guide.pdf -
Really it makes very little difference with UFH. Once your at that level of output your talking 1 or 2 degs difference in flow temp. We have 300mm centres across 190m², just 7 loops, -6 last night our flow temp was 32. UFH spacing is more about reaction time to heat input. Chart to allow you to compare different spacing flow temps and outputs
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https://en.econostrum.info/uk-homes-could-adopt-boiler-heat-pump-hybrids/ So at last the UK can use hybrid systems, hopefully with a proper grant. Easy to get the rubbish housing stock to reduce the CO2 emissions by a big margin. No internal heating system changes needed, 80 to 90% of the heating is done by heat pump the cold period by gas etc. No defrosting required on the heat pump killing efficiency and making it more expensive to run. Discuss
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Can't see why they couldn't, floor output is just a matter of average flow temperature. So if they put 100mm centres in the heat pump doesn't really care, you just flow at close to 25 degs, even though they had a design flow. They would insist of heating in all room and all heated by the heat pump. Think you would get blank looks from a lot of installers if you mention fan coils.
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Yes. You need to split some of thought processes out. New build is covered by express planning permission, a retrofit is normally covered by permitted development. Permitted development does not allow cooling. Permitted development is not applicable to a new build until sign off is complete. Also permitted development is not applicable if you want cooling, you need planning permission. None of the above has anything to do with grant. For grant applicability read up of Ofgem website. You need to read source information. If you find cooling isn't allowed I will happily eat my hat.
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Spreadsheet is targeted at well insulated pretty airtight. But it's about being in the right ballpark, you will not get to exactly the heat losses to match the heat pump output. In 24 hrs you have moved from is 16kW plus ok, to now knowing that about 5 to 6kW is a better estimate. The 2 hrs off time for DHW gives you wiggle room, you can always flick the immersion on for DHW They will need as built test data to even consider it, some will not from what I have seen. So will not be interested in target figures. So everything just happens in the wrong order for the grant and getting a well sized heat pump. Just buy a Panasonic heat pump.
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But can have damp, really good heat loss, especially when coupled with poorly installed PIR insulation. Any badly built building, is just that badly built. Seems a strange preference, you don't want a badly built anything, and accepting you may end that way is poor start to project.
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Yes Correct they are different, PH is ACH, building regs is m³ per m². Can be very different numbers.
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That's the figure to use, base on site exposure prevailing winds and exposed area. So number of Watts used will be very small.
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2. Permitted development does not exist under planning permission. So if doing a new build permitted development only come after build control sign off. 5. Yes 6. Some need a widget adding such as Valiant, most will do it out the box, Daikin some will cool some will not. So be careful with choice. 7. You need to size for heat pump flow temps. 9. Yes 10. Thermostats mean you need a buffer, because you restricted flow from heat pump. Buffers unless very big are useless. Floor insulation, the more the better with UFH. Your floor is hotter than the room, so downwards heat loss can be high.
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75mm Radial Ductwork
JohnMo replied to benben5555's topic in Mechanical Ventilation with Heat Recovery (MVHR)
Why not to ads section? -
I use a simple assumption You allow two hrs for DHW. So on the coldest day you need 4.5kW for 24 hrs, so 108kWh. To do this in 22 hrs you need 4.9kW of energy. So you need at heat pump that can put out 4.9kW at your lowest design temp.
