Critique my house design

[Moonshine]

I have put together an indicative house design that went into my (now delayed pre-app), as attached. Note this is not a self build for me, but one that i could build and sell.

 

I might take this design as one possible option to an architect, and also to get their ideas too, and develop for a full planning application, but I would be appreciate some input to see if there is anything obvious that is crap design or could be improved.

 

Some points about the design;

 

• The overall style is a 1930 house and have tried to pick up elements of the existing house in the proposed external build, with the roof pitches and bay windows matching the existing house.
• The house is going on a sloping site, hence why there are no windows doors on the southern facade at ground level (see section)
• The upside down layout is to have the living areas open out into the garden which is on first floor level to the south. 
• The long thin rooms on the first floor at designed like that to get the most of the sun from the southern facade.
• I am concerned the hallway will be too dark as i have put a small WC on first floor, which would be the most ideal place to put a big window to light up the hallway, i would want a WC on first floor and not sure where else i could put it.
• The ground floor en suite would be sized for a wheelchair user, i am thinking M4(2) requirement.
• There is an odd alcove in the bathroom (left as you come in the door), which i think that i would put a washing machine / tumble dryer in (to free up space in kitchen), and maybe the boiler at higher level.
• Given the roof pitch and height there is space to put a room in roof (not sure whether or not to show it at this stage of planning), but i have  allowed for insulation at pitched roof level and a stair upwards, this would mean i could put two bedrooms up there, and maybe a en-suite, this would free up the ground floor and mean that i wouldn't have to dig into the slope at ground floor  by circa 2m.
• The first floor window on the east facing facade looks crap and i should move it to line up with the ridge line

 

Do you think that this type of drawing would be good enough for a full planning application, and any comments on the design?

Proposed House design.pdf

Edited October 30, 2018 by mike m

[ProDave]

A few little things

 

The two upstairs rooms, put the doors to them opposite each other on the landing, not staggered. Make them double, glass doors so you can open up the space as one when you want to and let light into the landing.

 

Make the upstairs loo slightly larger, to allow you to bring a solar tube down inside it (boxed in) that will come out just in front of the downstairs cupboard to give some light to the back of the hall.

 

A window above the loo door for a bit of borrowed light as well.

 

You might need to push the stairs a bit nearer the front door for some of that.

 

The proportions of the downstairs bathroom and en-suite need some work to properly use that awkward redundant space behind the wardrobe.

[Moonshine]

I don't think that i can move them directly opposite, as i seem to recall there is a 300mm / 800mm spacing requirement in Approved document M for doors to a landing, thought they could get closer.

 

Thanks, good shout on the solar tube, that would help that area

 

Just now, ProDave said:

A window above the loo door for a bit of borrowed light as well.

 

The loo at first floor?

 

yes you are right that cupboard can go back wards to make the wall flush with the en suite, but in that space i think i would put a washing machine / tumble dryer in (to free up space in kitchen), and maybe the boiler at higher level in the  redundant space behind the cupboard

 

[Mr Punter]

The upstairs rooms will look mean unless they are 4.0m wide.  What is the upstairs corridor for?  Family bathroom looks wrong.  Can you show adjacent ground level on elevations and sections?  Lose the extra furniture in the bedrooms as it is distracting (beds, bedside cabinets and built-in cupboards only).

[PeterW]

49 minutes ago, mike m said:

Note this is not a self build for me, but one that i could build and sell.

 

Thats key..!

 

Doesn’t matter what you want, you need to aim it at your target market, research the local area then hit that square on. 

 

Other option is to get PP and sell on the uplift - always going to be some daft self builder ready to buy a plot with PP for over the odds ........ oh wait ...... ?

[Moonshine]

37 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

The upstairs rooms will look mean unless they are 4.0m wide.  What is the upstairs corridor for?  Family bathroom looks wrong.  Can you show adjacent ground level on elevations and sections?  Lose the extra furniture in the bedrooms as it is distracting (beds, bedside cabinets and built-in cupboards only).

 

I don't think I can go over a 10m wide house on the site, so those rooms are limited in size once you take out .65m for external walls and 2.2m for internal corridor and walls. I would love to get them wider but don't don't think I can. I have a min ceiling hieght of 2.45m so hopefully doesn't feel closed in, internal floor allowance is 250mm so may be able to raise ceilings if I can slim down the floor build up. If the walls around the corridor are structural masonry the joists don't need to span that far and maybe smaller. 

The upstairs corridor is to allow a room in roof option (tbc) to get another flight of stairs in. If the room in roof option is a none starter due to planning ridge hieght, then this can go and space used better.

Yeah the family bathroom needs work!

Will do some sections tomorrow.

 

Edited October 30, 2018 by mike m

[Gav_P]

Same question as above... why such a big upstairs hallway? It seems like a huge waste of space.... shift the stairs to the right and have a wider lounge. 

 

Also the upstairs toilet... wouldn’t it be better at the front of the house? (Forgetting the plumbing having to cross the house) but that would give more space to open out to the garden. 

[Moonshine]

3 minutes ago, Gav_P said:

Same question as above... why such a big upstairs hallway? It seems like a huge waste of space.... shift the stairs to the right and have a wider lounge. 

 

Also the upstairs toilet... wouldn’t it be better at the front of the house? (Forgetting the plumbing having to cross the house) but that would give more space to open out to the garden. 

 

See above ?

 

The upstairs corridor is to allow a room in roof option (tbc) to get another flight of stairs in. If the room in roof option is a none starter due to planning ridge, then can shift the stairs and put toilet at front from kitchen / dining

 

 

Edited October 30, 2018 by mike m

[Gav_P]

Ah should have paid more attention!! ?

 

Another thing to to think about that I learned whilst building is to really consider the views from each window. I changed 2 in the end (one moved by 300mm and widened one by 600mm) when the openings became visible as it framed the countryside much better. Really glad I did it now as it has total transformed the rooms.

[ProDave]

1 hour ago, mike m said:

I don't think that i can move them directly opposite, as i seem to recall there is a 300mm / 800mm spacing requirement in Approved document M for doors to a landing, thought they could get closer.

 

I would want to research that to find out the details.  It seems a bit bonkers that building regs can stop you having doors opposite each other on a landing?

 

In some ways your house is an upside down version of ours. We have a familly room one side of the hall and a snug living room the other, double doors to each directly opposite each other across the hall. If you wan to, open both doors and it opens it up as a big space.  I would need to see a GOOD reason why you can't do that upstairs.

 

How about moving the stairs right to the back and have as we have 2 flights with a half landing.  It could give you a large (tall) cupboard on the half landing, free up more hall and landing space for doors, and allow an 1800mm wide hall and landing to make the other rooms bigger. You would have to relocate the upstairs loo though.

[Jeremy Harris]

We have doors opposite each other on our landing.  No problem with building regs as long as the doors don't open out on to the landing, IIRC. 

[Moonshine]

It's not the opposite issue, it's having 3 doors in close proximity on a landing, and I am mistaken as this is only a M4(3) requirement, so I could do as you suggested and have them opposite.

Edited October 30, 2018 by mike m

[ProDave]

^^ That's an issue with door opening swings.  As I assume the doors to the living room and kitchen open into their rooms, not onto the landing, it does not apply anyway.

[AliG]

I think this is quite an old fashioned design, especially if you are looking to sell. I cannot remember the last time I saw a house with a long lounge/dining room like that.

 

A lot of the issues are around whether or not the stairs have to be their to allow a room in the roof. Clearly that will need cleared up before you proceed as to maximise value you should either be building that room or not have it impacting the design, so to some extent we have to ignore that issue a bit for the moment.

 

I would look to have a large kitchen/dining room across the back of the house facing south. This would need the stairs a little further forward, but I think would still allow a second stair above them to access the roof. There are a lot of things you could do in terms of turning the stairs etc depending on the final layout.

 

I would then have a lounge on the north side, possibly with doors opening into the dining area that is part of the kitchen.

 

This would then allow a study where the dining table is currently shown as part of the kitchen, or a family area in a large l shaped kitchen/dining/family room. 

 

The WC could either cut into this space or go across the hall window at the front. You could get light into the hall from glass doors into the kitchen which would benefit from facing south.

 

This effectively gives the house an extra room, either a study or family area (probably the most sellable option) in the kitchen with a separate lounge. At the moment too much of what is a modestly sized house is given over to eating space, a family would prefer two separate relaxing spaces.

 

Downstairs I would be looking to have an actual separate utility room. It won't need a window, so can be positioned towards the back, maybe where the cupboard is.I would want a larger wardrobe in a master bedroom, you could do a walk in in that awkward space which probably adds value(again stair position dependent).

 

I would look to add wardrobes to the other bedrooms, indeed the house does not have enough storage, you could put wardrobes on the wall between the other two bedrooms and a cupboard next to the utility room at the back. Basically I would move all the doors in the downstairs hall as far forward as possible and utilise the dark area at the back for storage//utility room(I'd check you can get the gas flue out though)

 

Design wise, this is just personal preference, but that style of bay window is very old fashioned. It would also add costs to the build, I would just make the house longer and square it off or do something more contemporary. I would also want a lot less roof if I wasn't using the space under it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Moonshine]

Some very interesting suggestions @AliG and especially the room running down the south facade, with extra room on the dining area. I will have a look at this as an option! Nice idea on the in built wardrobes running down the bedroom separating wall.

Yeah the bay window is old fashioned and not straight forward, however the external look reflects the area and hopefully the planners see it being more acceptable.

 

[Triassic]

All that loft space, why not add a study, extra bedroom, man zone up there?

[Moonshine]

55 minutes ago, Triassic said:

All that loft space, why not add a study, extra bedroom, man zone up there?

 

There is a plan to as an option, but at this stage I haven't shown it on the drawing depending on planning response to ridge hieghts.

[Moonshine]

@AliG i was interested in your proposals as there was some significantly different ideas, and i have drawn up your suggestions, and i think that it does work pretty well.

 

 

I have put a quarter turn at the top of the stairs to save space and moved them to the front door a bit more. This arrangement allows for the option of the room in roof as the stairs will still

fit (with a quarter turn at the bottom), but the corridor now also goes to the first floor bedroom / study. Also in the case that there is no room in roof the front area where the second stair would be could be utilised as a small open office area with computer desk.

 

I have put a fold-able partition in between the kitchen and dining, just to allow some segregation of the space.

 

Downstairs i have done the walk in wardrobe, and have made the cupboard at the back bigger to be a shared laundry and storage space, however i think that the boiler is going to have to go in the kitchen as much easier to deal with flue requirements.

 

It now feels like there is a lot of space that is well utilised, but the livingroom / dining room seem odd. I

 

If the room in roof option is a goer for two bedrooms, i might cull the back half of the ground floor to save on the costs of ground works and retaining walls.

 

Edited October 31, 2018 by mike m

[AliG]

That seems a lot better.

 

i was actually thinking the dining area would be part of the kitchen and the lounge separate or maybe with connecting doors. I haven’t checked the dimensions but ideally you’d want an eating and informal sitting area in the kitchen then a separate lounge. It looks like there is probably space for this.

 

Then I’d have a door to the lounge in front of the stairs.

 

The WC would be better accessed off the hall.

Edited October 31, 2018 by AliG

[Moonshine]

 

17 hours ago, AliG said:

That seems a lot better.

 

i was actually thinking the dining area would be part of the kitchen and the lounge separate or maybe with connecting doors. I haven’t checked the dimensions but ideally you’d want an eating and informal sitting area in the kitchen then a separate lounge. It looks like there is probably space for this.

 

Then I’d have a door to the lounge in front of the stairs.

 

The WC would be better accessed off the hall.

 

@AliG again thanks for your input, the WC off the hall is better and makes more usable wall space and area in the kitchen. The bedroom / study is getting a bit small but should be just o.k. I could move the WC and separating wall upwards, however i think that a tall combined fridge freeze would fit just north of the WC which would be good

 

In terms of windows i have removed the middle window on the south facade, and made the kitchen window wider, allowing for a two person breakfast bar below, looking out to the garden. Also i have added another window to the east, to get some morning sun into the kitchen / dining.

 

I haven't gone for a separate door to the lounge at the moment but could be added if the room in roof doesn't work out.

 

 

 

Edited November 1, 2018 by mike m

[the_r_sole]

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Edited September 26, 2019 by the_r_sole

[Mr Punter]

It is looking better with each iteration.  I would lose the back door and have this in the living area - maybe bifolds or sliding.  Extend the worktop and return a short 900mm deep peninsula so you can still have the breakfast bar.  The kitchen units backing onto the internal wall are likely to be tall - fridge / oven / larder type.  Perhaps make the dining area slightly bigger.

[Moonshine]

41 minutes ago, the_r_sole said:

if this is something to sell I think you need to consider exactly who your target market is and then work backwards to the design.

 

tbh not something that i haven't really done an detailed analysis on, other than looking for it to be a family home though does have a smallish garden. Something to do some work on!

 

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only one is comfortably fitting a double is a concern

 

fair point

 

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the kitchen/dining/sitting doesn't really work for me, there's too much space between the kitchen and dining. If you are aiming for young families they like to have a visual connection between where they are preparing dinner and where the kids might be playing etc.

 

The area between the kitchen and dining does seem a bit of a 'no mans land', due to the slight narrowing of the space limited by the stairs, however i think that this can be partly be used as a useful area with a book case or cabinet on the southern wall, and why i took the middle window out to allow full height usage.

 

In the case of an adult supervising and visual connect with young children while doing meal prep, i don't think that is a big issue as the living room area can be divided off (glazed by fold doors), and really young children (0-2) could be set up playing in 'no mans land' on the floor / activity area. Slightly older children (2-4) can be sat at the dining table, doing crafts, writing etc. 4+ would have the freedom of the house to cause mayhem and mess (mine do!). Though in regard to the visual connect, if meal prep areas and activities are laid out in the kitchen in the south west corner (just to the right of the breakfast bar), this would allow easy viewing of most of the dining room area.

 

The plus about having the dining area slightly at a distance from the kitchen, is you would be able to see the kids and not necessarily be bombarded by the noise of them

 

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what you've got really seems a bit like a barrat number

 

not really what i as going for, as an architect can you define what you mean by a Barrett number, small and boxy trying to cram to much in?

 

Cheers

Edited November 1, 2018 by mike m

[Moonshine]

 

38 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

I would lose the back door and have this in the living area - maybe bifolds or sliding.  Extend the worktop and return a short 900mm deep peninsula so you can still have the breakfast bar.  The kitchen units backing onto the internal wall are likely to be tall - fridge / oven / larder type.  Perhaps make the dining area slightly bigger.

 

i can't do it, as the ground slopes away to the north, at first floor the only facade which is level with the ground is the southern facade. 

Edited November 1, 2018 by mike m

[the_r_sole]

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Edited September 26, 2019 by the_r_sole