In the security window world, is PAS24 a con? What’s better?

[Adsibob]

After a nasty burglary, I need to further strengthen my defences.

 

I had a PAS24 window broken into by the burglars simply crow baring it so that it twisted almost of its frame. It probably took them all of 5 minutes to do it and as the glass is laminated it didn’t shatter and cause a noise. Is PAS24 a con? Any stronger security standards for the replacement window I will have to order?

 

Our window is an aluminium crittall style window.  The company that supplied and fitted our window also makes steel windows. Is a steel version of this window going to be significantly stronger?

[mike2016]

Security Cameras with people/pet detection are pretty cheap and accurate these days with app alerting. Almost eliminates false alarms when integrated into the alarm system so it triggers only when you are out. At least you can call the police. 

They will get into any window eventually, does the one they got into open? Would it make sense to replace with a non opening version so no hinges / weak areas to exploit without taking out the entire window? Any alarm with a shock sensor should have gone off though, did it just have a break glass sensor? 

Ask about European Standard EN 1627 RC4+ (1-6 rating) when replacing, you're heading into military levels at 5 or 6. 

[Russell griffiths]

Internal sliding grilles. 
ugly but the only thing I know that works well. 
 

[Big Jimbo]

As I said on the other thread. I think Banham do them in the London Area.

[Mr Punter]

That is poor.  I thought PAS24 was supposed to prevent this type of thing.  I would ask the supplier and their accreditation company to give their view on why the window failed and what should be done for future.

[Adsibob]

  On 22/02/2025 at 10:52, Mr Punter said:

That is poor.  I thought PAS24 was supposed to prevent this type of thing.  I would ask the supplier and their accreditation company to give their view on why the window failed and what should be done for future.

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That’s exactly what I thought too. It was several thousand more to have the whole house kitted out to PAS24 standards. I have gone back to the retailer to complain, and this is what he said (the reference to steel is because although our windows are aluminium, the same supplier does a very similar window, though not thermally as efficient, in steel which was more expensive):

 

In terms of PAS24 this is a standard that is determined by the government and has a set or rules for the devices used for breaking in, this is designed to help prevent break ins but does not claim to be unbreakable. The Pioneer system passed these tests. However burglars do not adhere to a set of tests and so if they have the inclination and time they can force their way into anything (including steel).

He subsequently suggested I look at other suppliers who do European Standard RC4 or RC5 which is commercial grade. For the utility window I will just put metal prison style bars in. I need to research which type but hopefully not too expensive or difficult to do.

 

 For the other windows, metal bars would really make our place look like a prison, so I’m going to avoid that. 

[Russell griffiths]

If you look at all the YouTube videos on how to pick a euro style cylinder, and then the link to buy the tools, I’m afraid you can only do so much. 
with the scum cutting off bike locks in broad daylight, until the courts start locking them up for a longtime you are just waiting for it to happen to you. 
there’s absolute scum everywhere and it should be totally legal to shoot anybody you find on your property. 

[Nickfromwales]

  On 22/02/2025 at 13:27, Russell griffiths said:

If you look at all the YouTube videos on how to pick a euro style cylinder, and then the link to buy the tools, I’m afraid you can only do so much. 
with the scum cutting off bike locks in broad daylight, until the courts start locking them up for a longtime you are just waiting for it to happen to you. 
there’s absolute scum everywhere and it should be totally legal to shoot anybody you find on your property. 

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A bit harsh on the postman lol. 😂 

[Adsibob]

My buildings and contents insurer sent a window surveyor to have a look at the broken in window. By this point another agent of the insurer had already been around to “secure” the property by removing the top hung part of the casement window that had been forced open by the scumbags with a crow bar. He took one look at it and quickly concluded that the whole thing needed complete replacement. I have two concerns about this:

 

1) The window was fitted prior to us installing the EWI and ceresit render. Although the EWI is only about 45mm thick, it will still be quite a destructive job to remove the window and patch up the EWI and Ceresit. It will result in an evident patch-up rather than the beautiful render I had before, as the render is largely continuous. Could they also damage the EWI?
 

2) the window surveyor works for a window company - doesn’t this risk that they won’t from an objective view? Given the window is only a couple of years old, it would be straightforward to contact the manufacturer and ask them whether it’s possible to fix. I mentioned that to him and he didn’t seem interested.

 

 

[Mike]

  On 22/02/2025 at 13:27, Russell griffiths said:

I’m afraid you can only do so much

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Indeed, But preferably do a bit more than your neighbours to lower your relative risk!

[Nickfromwales]

  On 24/02/2025 at 23:41, Mike said:

Indeed, But preferably do a bit more than your neighbours to lower your relative risk!

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[Nickfromwales]

  On 24/02/2025 at 23:10, Adsibob said:

The window was fitted prior to us installing the EWI and ceresit render. Although the EWI is only about 45mm thick, it will still be quite a destructive job to remove the window and patch up the EWI and Ceresit. It will result in an evident patch-up rather than the beautiful render I had before, as the render is largely continuous. Could they also damage the EWI?
 

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You should go for a cash settlement, and do the work yourself, pragmatically. These are all just a bunch of c888s who care zero about you or your property, they just want a resolve and to get it as quickly and as cost-effectively as possible.

 

My recommendation is, that you then change the window from inside and leave the external façade untouched. Done it a good few times on thin-coat rendered properties where the client wanted the new bathroom to have a bigger window etc etc. We can talk you through this here. Just get a settlement and put the money in the 'fund to fix it properly'.

[craig]

Pas24 security in dwellings is all about the length of time it takes an attacker to circumvent/defeat the security, just the same as RC1, RC2, RC3, RC4 etc. It is becoming standard and it will become an insurance aspect (if it isn't already) for new homes, to prevent them having to pay out. 

[Adsibob]

Good advice, thanks.