Handling transition into garage on raft foundation

[jack]

Morning.

 

Work begins on our driveway and front garden today.  As usual, I've forgotten to discuss a critical aspect of this with the guy in charge of the work, and he isn't available at the moment.

 

So the problem is this: I have an attached garage.   It sits on an insulated raft, like the rest of the house.  This is a section (sorry it's blurry):

There are three issues:

1.  Because I wasn't here when it was measured up for and later installed, the door frame has been installed flush with the surface of the slab.  There's no slope off the concrete, and quite a large area of slab sticking out under the garage door.  As a result, when we get heavy or driving rain, it tends to get under the door and into the garage.  

2.  I need a way of allowing a car to traverse the EPS upstand.

3.  We'll have gravel outside the garage, and will need have some sort of ramp up to the garage level.  We can only bring the gravel up to within about 100mm of the slab level.

 

Here's a photo of one side:

 

 

I was thinking about building a reinforced strip of foundation across the front of the garage, incorporating a ramp ending up level with the slab.  I could then bridge the gap with galvanised checker plate with a slight upward lip on the garage side to go up under the seal of the garage door.  I might be able to work in a slight fall off the check plate by scrabbling a bit off the concrete that's outside the door, and lifting the DPM and cutting back the EPS a bit - not sure.

 

Anyone have any feedback (or better ideas)?  

 

Many thanks

[ProDave]

I will throw this in for discussion, I might be wrong:

WHY do you need to keep the EPS upstand at the entrance to the garage?  I would consider cutting it away so your concrete ramp from the drive up to the garage abuts directly to the concrete slab of the garage. yes it creates a cold bridge to the garage slab, but it's a garage, does that matter?

As for water under the garage door. That's a problem in our present house. I kept thinking what's needed is a substantial rubber strip or something, on the lines of a TINY sleeping policeman, perhaps just an inch tall. I am sure I have seen such things screwed to floors where a roller door comes down to meet it, but I have never found anything for sale (but I didn't look very hard)

The side door, lay your paving level, but incorporate a drainage channel between the slabs and the garage floor.

 

[Mikey_1980]

This stopped the water ingress into our old garage.

http://www.weatherstop.co.uk/

[PeterW]

We have a rubber ramp on ours and it does stop some rain but it does struggle sometimes like at the weekend when we had 30mm inside around 90 minutes ..!

Was this I think http://www.garagedoorseals.co.uk/p-black_rubber_garage_threshold_seal.htm

I would grind off the first 40/50mm as a slope to give the door a chance first though and remove the EPS and replace with a linear drain. 

That does create a thermal break of sorts too

Edited June 14, 2016 by PeterW
Added link

[jack]

1 hour ago, ProDave said:

WHY do you need to keep the EPS upstand at the entrance to the garage?  I would consider cutting it away so your concrete ramp from the drive up to the garage abuts directly to the concrete slab of the garage. yes it creates a cold bridge to the garage slab, but it's a garage, does that matter?

 

I was more concerned about managing the DPM than introducing a cold bridge.  This is definitely something I need to think about though.

[jack]

1 hour ago, PeterW said:

I would grind off the first 40/50mm as a slope to give the door a chance first though and remove the EPS and replace with a linear drain. 

Yes, that makes sense.

With all of these ideas, I'm concerned about what to do with the DPM.  I can lift it up and cut away the EPS without damaging it, but still need to make sure that I manage water at the DPM/slab junction.  That's the hardest part of all this!

[PeterW]

Which DPM are we talking about..? the one that sits inside the EPS..? I would be inclined to cut it back and bond it to the front of the remaining slab using a decent liquid DPM product and not worry about it.

[jack]

3 hours ago, PeterW said:

Which DPM are we talking about..? the one that sits inside the EPS..? I would be inclined to cut it back and bond it to the front of the remaining slab using a decent liquid DPM product and not worry about it.

Yes, that's the one.  It goes under the ringbeam from the insulation side then up between the upstand and the slab, then over the upstand and down the outside.  I was considering at least waterproofing the top surface of the slab, but hadn't thought about liquid DPM (I have half a largish tin of that lying around somewhere actually).  Makes sense, thanks.

[Roger440]

All rather relevant! Having done and faced exactly the same problems, i pretty much came up with similar solutions.

I see no possible way not to have a thermal bridge of sorts. In the end i accepted this, but not happy about it. I cut the EPS away to a depth of 50mm, and then laid the block paving over it (50mm thick blocks).

As PeteW suggested, stick the dpm to the slab just below the surface. Sure, i guess over time some water will get in, but surely not enough to worry about.

Now the bit where i really got it wrong. Like you, my slab came forward of where the door ended up. Ie the door is recessed into the building approx 6 inches. Leaving 6 inches of slab outside. What i should have done is stepped the slab in here, but due to a chronic lack of planning by me i failed to take this into account. So now i have 6 inches of the slab outside

If its not too late, have you considered cutting it back? Id there steel reinforcement i it?

Last, but not least, because of my 6 inch sticky out bit, and to prevent water ingress, i took one of those hilti hand diamond floor grinders to the 6 inch bit and ground it such that it slopes away from the door. Also gave it a rather nice finish, which i then sealed with some sort of whizzo sealer. The reason for the last bit was so i could bond down the the door threshold strip, which in my case is the lowr door runner (see pic). So far not a single drop

So yes, water right, but thermally a bit of a pigs ear.

That said, i cant see you can retain a thermal envelope on a garage.

PS, not sure where you are, ut if you wanted a borrow of sad floor grinder, you are welcome.

 

 

 

 

[Auchlossen]

Telecon with couthy garage door installer tonight mentioned a point that I had not been aware of:

there should be a 'check' in the floor at the point where the door falls. Presumably to keep water out.

 

And it might have helped to resolve my neighbour's problem, which is that the snow on the vehicle melts in the relatively warm garage, flows out under the door, where it freezes the rubber foot of the roller door to the floor, with negative consequences for both user and rubber foot. They resolved by putting a piece of wood across the floor under the door when weather requires!

[Weebles]

I am digging up this old thread as we have the same issue and could do with some ideas.   I was wondering if @jack and @Roger440 had some finished photos, or even some work in progress photos please?

We have laid a rubber tiled floor in the garage (it will never be used for cars by us and creating a games room and place to work out has been invaluable recently) and were thinking about getting a weatherstop strip.  We were getting some water in but the grey mastic around the edge where the door is fitted seems to have helped.

But we haven't laid the driveway yet and have the same issue with the concrete slab sticking out further than the door.  We will only have about 10mm to play with for laying a surface on top to cover that concrete lip unless we do something......is that a problem?  A thin layer of something?

Ground level currently very similar to garage floor level though might have to dig out for driveway base.

Thanks

 

 

 

[HerbJ]

We cut out the EPS upstand in the garage door opening, pulled back the DPM and cast a level concrete infill.  The DPM  was just laid under and around  the cast concrete infill.

Looks like the same/similar approach as @Weebles

 

Looks a bit rough in the first photo but it was leveled with epoxy and a commercial resin floor finish was applied to the garage floor - see photos taken just now. The slight colour  difference on the garage floor is just sun and weather outside the garage door

ffre

 

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by HerbJ
Edited photos to remove data

[Roger440]

On 16/05/2020 at 09:37, Weebles said:

I am digging up this old thread as we have the same issue and could do with some ideas.   I was wondering if @jack and @Roger440 had some finished photos, or even some work in progress photos please?

We have laid a rubber tiled floor in the garage (it will never be used for cars by us and creating a games room and place to work out has been invaluable recently) and were thinking about getting a weatherstop strip.  We were getting some water in but the grey mastic around the edge where the door is fitted seems to have helped.

But we haven't laid the driveway yet and have the same issue with the concrete slab sticking out further than the door.  We will only have about 10mm to play with for laying a surface on top to cover that concrete lip unless we do something......is that a problem?  A thin layer of something?

Ground level currently very similar to garage floor level though might have to dig out for driveway base.

Thanks

 

 

 

 

That concrete lip thats outside looks to slope inwards? If so, that needs correcting. Nice floor grinder required.

 

Once thats done, an aluminimum strip, say 10mm high secured to the floor with countersunk screwws with a butyl strip underneath will stop it blowing under the door.

 

I used the ally strip idea at work where we had a level threshold. Did the job for 15 years

[jack]

On 16/05/2020 at 09:37, Weebles said:

I am digging up this old thread as we have the same issue and could do with some ideas.   I was wondering if @jack and @Roger440 had some finished photos, or even some work in progress photos please?

 

I haven't gotten around to doing anything with this yet, although it's only one or two tasks away at the moment. Currently, I think I'll use plastic tiles like what you've done, but still pondering how to get an outward slope to the slab. I've thought of a few ways, but none of them is perfect.

[PeterW]

I'm now considering using a 10x40mm steel bar with countersunk screws backed off by 30mm from the door and then use a standard rubber ramp in front of it. Behind will get a flow finish flooring compound

 

[Oz07]

Good idea

[HerbJ]

As you can see from my photos, my slab is flat and the transition to the  ACO drainage channel and drive is also flat/level. It is SUDS drive which gently slopes way from the garage and house.  

 

I have a 4877mm x 2125mm HORMANN electrical operated garage door, which incorporates a substantial rubber seal on the bottom of the door , which compresses slightly as the door closes..  We have never experienced any water ingress, even from driving rain, and no leaves or dirt  blow in when the door is closed.

[Weebles]

On 20/05/2020 at 14:05, PeterW said:

I'm now considering using a 10x40mm steel bar with countersunk screws backed off by 30mm from the door and then use a standard rubber ramp in front of it. Behind will get a flow finish flooring compound

 

Do you mean 30mm inside door? So door closes onto the rubber ramp? Or extending the floor out under the door?
 

On 18/05/2020 at 22:04, Roger440 said:

That concrete lip thats outside looks to slope inwards? If so, that needs correcting. Nice floor grinder required.

it’s actually level, mostly, but water will still pool I guess so we’ll need to introduce a small fall. 

 

nothing much is coming under the door (got the same seal arrangement as @HerbJ albeit a different manufacturer) but some was coming though the bit around the base of the vertical garage door runners having run down the door and pooled at the bottom. That appears ok now following sealing up the gaps though not had much rain to test it.

[PeterW]

1 hour ago, Weebles said:

Do you mean 30mm inside door? So door closes onto the rubber ramp?

 

Yes - so the door comes down onto the edge of the rubber ramp