200+ metre utility connection

[Oz07]

The plot I am looking at has an easement through a neighbouring field for the utility connections. Unfortunately the route is approx 220m long and has 3 90deg bends in it. I am trying to get an idea for utility costings. I can do the work on the field side but obviously need the utility companies for the small bit at the road connection.

 

Water isn't too much of an issue. Long trench with long pipe. Albeit a few joins. Maybe a duct and maybe have the welded joint if possible. Shouldn't imagine cost is any more than usual for the actual connection.

 

Elec presents more of an issue. I had a service put in once where I had dug and installed the duct and it made me ill when I spotted the 63mm cable they had rolled up ready to pull through. Luckily it was straight trench and my duct laying must of been okay because it pulled through fine. They did lift up half the digger and use one of the tracks as a winch to pull the drawcord. How would you go about it in this case? I can't see a cable threading through a 90 deg bend very well and 220m is a hell of a distance. What is the usual procedure? Leave holes every so often and at bends? Leave the trench open and let the utility company (western power) just lay the cable straight in? Would they even let you do this or would they want to back fill so cable isn't exposed?

Does anyone have any idea of costs when it comes to a connection like this? Do they charge by the metre or is each job individual? I would guess the connection at the road end makes up the bulk of the cost with the digging and traffic management.

 

Telecom I am guessing is not too bad. I have had Openreach supply me duct and cable before and I have buried this and installed the cable ready for the engineers to come and connect up.

 

Thanks

[ProDave]

Get a quote for the electricity supply, then you will know for certain where it actually has to connect to.  

 

Then see if once you have accepted the quote they can issue the cable for you to bury in the field.  It does not have to be in duct is is usually suitable for direct burying.

 

If you do go for duct, put large diameter twin wall flexible with gentle bends, don't put elbows.  Then never contemplate using the provided drawstring, use that just to pull through a larger bit of rope as your drawstring.

[joe90]

When I had a lekky cable pulled in on a previous build the guys used talcum powder down the duct to ease the pull.

[garrymartin]

15 minutes ago, ProDave said:

Then never contemplate using the provided drawstring, use that just to pull through a larger bit of rope as your drawstring.

Top tip there. The drawstring in ducting is always to pull your own suitable drawstring through. Very rarely suitable for actually pulling cable.

 

7 minutes ago, joe90 said:

When I had a lekky cable pulled in on a previous build the guys used talcum powder down the duct to ease the pull.

I wouldn't advise that. Get a proper cable pulling lubricant; it will be well worth the small expense. Ideal Yellow or Ideal AquaGel II are great for pulling cable.

[saveasteading]

I think it needs intermediate draw points at the corners, whether pits or chambers.

I've seen a 32mm cable stick in an official  duct with just a slight bend in it.

OR these 90° bends are indicative and very slow bends are allowed.

Straight into trench would be so much easier, as long as you don't have to fence it off for safety.

[TommoUK]

..you pay per lm for the cable..I was quoted £17 per lm last year.  The lions share of the cost was bringing the supply to the property boundary from the other side of the public highway which also involved a road closure, traffic diversion etc. All in all it was about £9k for a 15 lm on site connection and 6 lm of offsite connection.

 

..off grid options?

 

 

[IanR]

1 hour ago, Oz07 said:

Unfortunately the route is approx 220m long and has 3 90deg bends in it.

 

Mine is a gently curving 130m, across a field. As mine was judged to be a potentaily deep-ploughed field I had to adhere to the extra depth, 1,100mm iirc rather than 750mm for power and water.

 

I put the water pipe in the trench, you can get long coils of the pipe to save having connections in the field, but they wanted to see the pipe before I back filled to ensure depth. Power wanted to pull the cable through, but were happy for me to put the ducting in and backfill without them inspecting it.

 

Power did specify Ø160mm duct, but my "expereinced" ground workers said that wasn't needed and Ø100 would be OK. It really wasn't, and Power Networks nearly gave up on the pull-through. The loads were beyond the limit of their cable puller, but they only just achieved it in the end.

 

I couldn't convince Power Networks to come right up to the curtilage with the large, public network cable, they said their rules were to stop 35m from the property and join to a domestic cable. This was still installed by Power Networks, but meant a joint in the field.

 

For yours, I'm sure it will need to be done in 3 pulls, maybe in seperate lengths with joints.

 

My power installation (for 3 phase) was around £4,500 (in 2017) for the pull-through, and connection at either end, then another £3K for a transformer upgrade.

 

Edited August 22 by IanR

[Dave Jones]

2 hours ago, IanR said:

 

Power did specify Ø160mm duct, but my "expereinced" ground workers said that wasn't needed and Ø100 would be OK. It really wasn't, and Power Networks nearly gave up on the pull-through. The loads were beyond the limit of their cable puller, but they only just achieved it in the end.

 

 

 

 

flexi duct is the work of the devil. I ran all ours in 110 sewer and left a couple m of flexi at the end for paperwork/nonsense. Zero issues pulling the 3-phase through it.

[Mr Punter]

20 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

 

flexi duct is the work of the devil. I ran all ours in 110 sewer and left a couple m of flexi at the end for paperwork/nonsense. Zero issues pulling the 3-phase through it.

 

Where we are it is likely UKPN would refuse to use sewer pipe as cable duct.  They can even get snitty if the duct is not marked with the right BS EN number.

[Dave Jones]

5 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

 

Where we are it is likely UKPN would refuse to use sewer pipe as cable duct.  They can even get snitty if the duct is not marked with the right BS EN number.

 

how will they know ?

[IanR]

3 hours ago, IanR said:

Power did specify Ø160mm duct,

 

Just checked, and I've mis-remebered, UKPN stipulated Ø125 rigid ducting for Network 3 phase cable, which could have reduced to a Ø50 "service" duct for the last 30m of domestic supply.

[Oz07]

11 hours ago, TommoUK said:

..you pay per lm for the cable..I was quoted £17 per lm last year.  The lions share of the cost was bringing the supply to the property boundary from the other side of the public highway which also involved a road closure, traffic diversion etc. All in all it was about £9k for a 15 lm on site connection and 6 lm of offsite connection.

 

..off grid options?

 

 

Sounds like sub 4k for the bulk of the private work then and whatever the usual connection cost is. Round here its usually the same again 3 or 4 k. I would be happy to get change from 10k at that length. 

[Oz07]

11 hours ago, IanR said:

 

Mine is a gently curving 130m, across a field. As mine was judged to be a potentaily deep-ploughed field I had to adhere to the extra depth, 1,100mm iirc rather than 750mm for power and water.

 

I put the water pipe in the trench, you can get long coils of the pipe to save having connections in the field, but they wanted to see the pipe before I back filled to ensure depth. Power wanted to pull the cable through, but were happy for me to put the ducting in and backfill without them inspecting it.

 

Power did specify Ø160mm duct, but my "expereinced" ground workers said that wasn't needed and Ø100 would be OK. It really wasn't, and Power Networks nearly gave up on the pull-through. The loads were beyond the limit of their cable puller, but they only just achieved it in the end.

 

I couldn't convince Power Networks to come right up to the curtilage with the large, public network cable, they said their rules were to stop 35m from the property and join to a domestic cable. This was still installed by Power Networks, but meant a joint in the field.

 

For yours, I'm sure it will need to be done in 3 pulls, maybe in seperate lengths with joints.

 

My power installation (for 3 phase) was around £4,500 (in 2017) for the pull-through, and connection at either end, then another £3K for a transformer upgrade.

 

Whats that a 600 bucket been used? Is that for separation between services? I would go for longer continuous water pipe if available. The easement is shaped so its along the edge of the field presumably away from ploughing area. Maybe still have to go deeper who sets the depth rules water board? Did anyone see the pipe burier clarkson had in clarksons farm? Great bit of kit just went on back of his tractor. Not sure how would cope with bends though. 

[saveasteading]

19 minutes ago, Oz07 said:

a 600 bucket been used?

these 2 pipes need to ne 450mm apart. 

 

20 minutes ago, Oz07 said:

who sets the depth rules water board?

water at -750, electric at -450, generally. 

 

20 minutes ago, Oz07 said:

Great bit of kit just went on back of his tractor.

A plough that simply slits the ground for the pipe to go in behind it, and closes itself behind. Ok for a farm doing its own thing. I don't think they go deep enough for the water company rules, nor do they lay a warning tape above the pipe.

[IanR]

36 minutes ago, Oz07 said:

Whats that a 600 bucket been used? Is that for separation between services? 

 

I used a 1000mm bucket (13T excavator), but could have used a 600mm. 1000mm allowed me to use a big vibrating roller to compact the back-fill down.

 

It's UK Power Networks that have the "deep ploughed" depth requirement, although it's 1,200mm. Don't know why they came up with "deep plough", the field is pasture and hadn't been ploughed in 20 years. Water was 750mm minimum, up to 1,350mm

 

With Water and Power in the bottom of the trench, I back-filled around 500mm and then put in the Open Reach ducting (Ø50 rigid) + 2 more ducts for power and data to the gate.

 

This is from UKPN

 

 

And this from Essex & Suffolk Water.

 

[Oz07]

I was aware of the 750 - 1350 requirement from water utility provider just wanted clarification on the 'deep ploughed' situation cheers.

 

1M bucket no wonder the spoil pile looks massive!

 

Next step really is to get  a quote off Western Power. Just hoping they are happy to lay cable in an open trench but if they might start specifying all silly h&s rules if trench is over 1m deep due to 'deep ploughed' requirement.

[TommoUK]

11 hours ago, Oz07 said:

Sounds like sub 4k for the bulk of the private work then and whatever the usual connection cost is. Round here its usually the same again 3 or 4 k. I would be happy to get change from 10k at that length. 

Yep ..I think thats the ballpark if the offsite works are straightforward.  So it depends on where the supply runs in the road and the extent of the offsite dig (and reinstatement works) as this is outside your control.

[Temp]

If you had to pay someone to do it all I've be using a figure of about £100 a meter which would be £22k.

 

Thought I would ask ChatGPT and it suggested...

 

35-50mm^2 copper 

 

Cable: £3,300 - £6,600

Trenching & Installation: £8,100 - £14,000

Total Estimate: £11,400 - £20,600

 

Of the Trenching & Installation it thought conduit and back fill would be £30-£50 per meter and labour would be £1500 to £3000.

 

Not sure I agree with its breakdown but you also have a road to cross?

 

[Oz07]

I'm not sure if there is a road to cross or not depends what side of the road existing utilities are on. Not too fussed about that as would be within the connection quote. Was more trying to gauge the cost of the work on private land. 

[Oz07]

8 hours ago, Temp said:

If you had to pay someone to do it all I've be using a figure of about £100 a meter which would be £22k.

 

Where did you get the 100 per m figure?

[Temp]

13 hours ago, Oz07 said:

Where did you get the 100 per m figure?

 

When we were doing our due diligence for our plot in 2005 we spoke to companies about the electric connection and a 4" water main diversion. Both routes were across the plot and grass verge, none involved a road crossing. Both suggested budgeting about £100 a meter. As I recall the electric ended up a bit cheaper but the water main diversion was a bit more. The water company were so inefficient though. Some days the team turned up, waited around for the digger and were told it was needed elsewhere. The work was done in 2007 and I doubt it's got a lot cheaper. 

 

If building again I'd definitly look at doing more ourselves to try and save but I've heard some people have had ridiculous quotes when they asked for them to be split into contestable and noncontestable.