Low or Medium Gas Pressure

[iMCaan]

We need to install a gas meter in a new build. We already have a supply from footpath to the meter box. I contacted a Scottish Power for new meter connection. They asked whether it's Low or Medium pressure.  I didn't know so I contacted Northern Gas Networks who said it's Low pressure. What does Low pressure actually mean? Should I be requesting Medium pressure (the more the better)?

 

Thanks

[JohnMo]

Medium pressure is usually used to move gas down larger pipes, it is the let down in pressure at towns or housing estates, to low pressure.

 

Medium pressure cannot have smart meters, low pressure can.

 

We installed gas a year or so later we are asking for it to be removed. Have you not considered ASHP?

[jayc89]

5 minutes ago, JohnMo said:

Medium pressure is usually used to move gas down larger pipes, it is the let down in pressure at towns or housing estates, to low pressure.

 

Medium pressure cannot have smart meters, low pressure can.

 

We installed gas a year or so later we are asking for it to be removed. Have you not considered ASHP?

 

+1

We've already removed all our gas fires, the gas hob will be going when we finally get around to the kitchen, all that'll be left is our gas boiler, which we'll replace with an ASHP when it gives up the ghost. 

[Mike]

Agree with the above - go all-electric.

[iMCaan]

Thank you.

 

We need gas in the kitchen for cooking. We have no gas fires.

 

Before the build, I considered all kinds of renewable energy systems. I was considering ASHP and Solar Panels but took them off the list as most of my budget was eaten up by long delays in building the shell. Furthermore, I'm not sure what the return on investment is on ASHP. However, that was then but now, I've been reading up on ASHP again and was considering getting some quotes.

 

What are the drawbacks of placing ASHP 5 meters away (near the boundary fence) from the house wall? Or does it has to be next to the house wall? It'll be in way if it on ground next to the wall and will spoil the looks of the stone built house if it's on the wall. I prefer it to be away from the house, near the boundary wall, surrounded by hit and miss fence.

 

Thanks

 

 

 

 

[SteamyTea]

Induction hobs are so much better than gas hobs.

 

1 minute ago, iMCaan said:

I'm not sure what the return on investment is on ASHP

Do you do the same calculation on a gas boiler?  Or just assume because it is a bit cheaper to install, it must be a better return.

I don't know of anyone that does an ROI on a holiday, or bathroom.

[JohnMo]

11 minutes ago, iMCaan said:

What are the drawbacks of placing ASHP 5 meters away (near the boundary fence) from the house wall?

Mine is 10m away, zero issues. As long as noise isn't the issue on the boundary.

[iMCaan]

 

Not disagreeing with induction hobs being better but unfortunately, I don't have no  choice it has be a gas hob. My other half demands it.

 

On social media people are saying ASHP cost around £5k that's with government grant (I'm not entitled to it). Just want to know what is the life expectancy of an ASHP and how long does take to get the money worth?

 

Thanks JohnMo. That means cost is the only issue. Does ASHP really cost ~£10k?

[SteamyTea]

10 minutes ago, iMCaan said:

choice it has be a gas hob. My other half demands it.

Never used an induction hob then.

 

10 minutes ago, iMCaan said:

Does ASHP really cost ~£10k

Some might, all depends.

Be easy to make a gas boiler cost that much.  Just add some money to it.

I think there is confusion between doing a direct boiler swap, an easy job, and replumbing a whole house and adding an ASHP.

Bit like replacing a car tyre or replacing all the tyres and the wheels.

[JohnMo]

6 minutes ago, iMCaan said:

On social media people are saying ASHP cost around £5k that's with government grant (I'm not entitled to it). Just want to know what is the life expectancy of an ASHP and how long does take to get the money worth

Social media, well who believes what that says. Do your maths. Assuming you are a new build, so you need a heating system anyway. Any new install should be using heat pump ready sized radiators and cylinder. Difference in cost for a gas boiler and ASHP install is just the boiler or ASHP. You need a cylinder radiators or UFH for both.

 

Again assuming you can install a 6kW heat pump, so ASHP will cost £2-3k, gas boiler £1-1.5k. so really about £1k difference, without any grants. Shopping around can save as well.

 

Retrofit is a little different.

[iMCaan]

6 minutes ago, JohnMo said:

Again assuming you can install a 6kW heat pump, so ASHP will cost £2-3k, gas boiler £1-1.5k. so really about £1k difference, without any grants. Shopping around can save as well.

ASHP for £3k is that including installation? and does the installer needs to be MCS certified?

[JohnMo]

2 minutes ago, iMCaan said:

ASHP for £3k is that including installation? and does the installer needs to be MCS certified?

No, but neither is the gas boiler installation, both take the same amount of work. MCS is needed for grant.

[iMCaan]

Thanks JohnMo, I'll get couple of quotes to see what it'll cost to install ASHP. 

 

We have planned to use the boiler unvented cylinder for UFH and hot and cold supply to the bathrooms.

Does it mean that we don't need a boiler if we go with ASHP?

[JohnMo]

Look at a Grant (as in the company) heat pump. Their scheme is quite good. The quote and MCS is owned by Grant Corporate, the work is sub contracted to a local Grant installer. Grant themselves do the full design. Think everything is done via the local agent or installer. Grant Corporate do the final commission and sign off.

[iMCaan]

Thanks I'll check it out.

[SimonD]

1 hour ago, iMCaan said:

Not disagreeing with induction hobs being better but unfortunately, I don't have no  choice it has be a gas hob. My other half demands it.

 

Go and buy a couple of cheap portable Ikea induction hobs like this one https://www.ikea.com/gb/en/p/tillreda-portable-induction-hob-1-zone-white-70493503/ or even the double one https://www.ikea.com/gb/en/p/tillreda-portable-induction-hob-2-zones-white-90497166/ and try them out for a while. Obviously make sure you have suitable pans. Once you've spent some time using them, I'm sure demands will change. I once had no choice either 😉 but we do have a permanent induction hob now. One of the best things is how easy it is to clean compared to gas!

[Conor]

Anybody that prefers gas to induction is, objectively, wrong. 

[iMCaan]

The heat that is generated by the induction hob, is it as hot as the gas hob heat? Can you cook those tougher meat/veg on induction hob (not that I'm a cook)?

[Conor]

Just now, iMCaan said:

The heat that is generated by the induction hob, is it as hot as the gas hob heat? Can you cook those tougher meat/veg on induction hob (not that I'm a cook)?

Hotter. And also cooler... I use mine as a slow cooker. The controllability and efficiency are unrivaled. 

 

Only downside is I've yet to try a wok that comes close to a traditional thin carbon steel wok on a big gas burner. With induction you can only really heat the base of a pan 

[iMCaan]

Will give the Ikea portable inductions hobs a try subject to big boss approval. Let's see if they're fit for our purpose.

[SteamyTea]

25 minutes ago, iMCaan said:

The heat that is generated by the induction hob, is it as hot as the gas hob heat

It works in a slightly different way.

With a gas hob, you get a flame of fixed temperature, to vary the 'pot' temperature you increase or decrease the flame size.  What this does is change the ratio of flame temperature to ambient air temperature, this changes the mean temperature hitting the base of the pan.  The trouble is that you can still easily burn things on the lowest flame size as that can concentrate the flame temperature onto a smaller area of the pan (usually in the middle) with the colder ambient air convection on the outer 'ring' of the pan base and up the sides of the pan.

With an induction hob it is the pan base that heats up, not the hob.  Temperature is controlled by the induction coil being switched on and off in the background.

This means that the base of the pan is at an even temperature across its width.

There is a bit of a myth that you need heavy, think based pans on an induction hob, you don't.  If people manage to burn stuff on an induction hob it is because they have the power/temperature set to high for what they are doing.

Thick based pans are a legacy of old electric cookers with a glowing spiral (but even then if you know what you are doing it was not a problem).  My pans were dirt cheap, Hell's Kitchen ones, think they were £17 for two.

My frying pan was from Aldi, it is non stick and aluminium.  To make it work on an induction hob, it has small steel inserts in the base.

One big advantage of lightweight pans is that there is less chance of dropping one and damaging the hob surface.

 

If anyone tells you that you must have really heavy pots and pans, you know instantly that they cannot cook.

[JohnMo]

I'm just off to do a stir-fry on my induction. I like, but wife keeps saying she likes gas more. But she doesn't cook every day. I always found gas way to slow to heat stuff up.

[SteamyTea]

1 minute ago, JohnMo said:

I always found gas way to slow to heat stuff up

Try my gas hob at work, think the burners are 9 kW.

Why the extractor is larger than my kitchen at home.

[iMCaan]

On 28/11/2023 at 13:49, JohnMo said:

Look at a Grant (as in the company) heat pump. Their scheme is quite good. The quote and MCS is owned by Grant Corporate, the work is sub contracted to a local Grant installer. Grant themselves do the full design. Think everything is done via the local agent or installer. Grant Corporate do the final commission and sign off.

 

GrantUK 

Supply only ASHP + cylinder + fittings = £8k

(not sure about the installation cost)

 

Local Company

Supply and install gas boiler + cylinder + 3 radiators + pipes + fittings = £10k

 

Gas Safe Engineer

Labour only £4k (gas boiler + cylinder + 3 radiators + pipes + fittings) 

My estimated cost of equipment £4k (gas boiler £1.5k, unvented cylinder 1.5k, other fittings £1k) 

 

I think, it's between GrantUK and local Gas Safe Engineer depending on ASHP installation cost. I have directly approached a GrantUK installer for a quote including installation. Will see what they quote in particular for the installation.

[LnP]

On 28/11/2023 at 13:01, iMCaan said:

 

Not disagreeing with induction hobs being better but unfortunately, I don't have no  choice it has be a gas hob. My other half demands it.

 

Gas hobs (and stoves) are increasingly being criticised for affecting air quality in the house. Nitrogen dioxide seems to be the main issue and its link to asthma.