self build VAT on a 'rural worker's dwelling'?

[sunflower]

Can anyone assist - we recently gained planning permission for an 'Equestrian Worker's Dwelling' at our equestrian business.

 

The house will be our family home, and the land is privately owned (not by our company)

 

Our builder thinks we're not eligible for VAT reclaim as it's a 'worker's dwelling' - might anyone have experience of this and be able to help us clarify?

 

Thanks so much for your help

[Russell griffiths]

Talk to Andrew Jones ,THE VAT MAN look him up on Facebook. 

[joe90]

https://www.vat431.co.uk   I used him like others here and he was very good.

[sunflower]

Thanks guys, very helpful

[joe90]

Just found in tinternet…..

 

If you are providing domestic accommodation to an employee to make running the business easier, any repair and maintenance costs to the farmworker's cottage is a cost that is wholly for business purposes. Where the accommodation is provided to the farmworker free of rent, 100% of input VAT on expenses can be reclaimed.

[SteamyTea]

  On 04/10/2023 at 09:04, joe90 said:

providing domestic accommodation to an employee to make running the business easier

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Don't tell @Pocster, he will have all his tenants 'working'.

[Pocster]

  On 04/10/2023 at 09:07, SteamyTea said:

Don't tell @Pocster, he will have all his tenants 'working'.

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They do work for me 

 

Gun running

People trafficking 

Alcohol smuggling

Prostitution ring 

 

I keep them busy .

[Adrian Walker]

Andrew Jones is the man. Call him for FREE good advice 

[LSB]

  On 04/10/2023 at 12:27, Pocster said:

They do work for me 

 

Gun running

People trafficking 

Alcohol smuggling

Prostitution ring 

 

I keep them busy .

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what about drugs

 

[Temp]

  On 04/10/2023 at 08:12, sunflower said:

The house will be our family home, and the land is privately owned (not by our company)

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I see no reason why it wouldn't be zero rated to you.

 

It would definitely NOT be zero rated if you rented it out before living in it. That's down to a subtle difference between "zero rating" and "exempt". 

 

 

[Pocster]

  On 04/10/2023 at 13:14, LSB said:

what about drugs

 

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Thanks for that !

I now have more work them 👍

[Temp]

  On 04/10/2023 at 13:29, Temp said:

 

I see no reason why it wouldn't be zero rated to you.

 

 

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Scratch that. It depends on the exact wording of the condition....

 

https://www.buckles-law.co.uk/library-news/agri-occupancy-planning-conditions-beware-the-vat-sting/

 

Quotes..

 

It is now established that where there is an  agricultural occupancy planning condition or obligation restricting occupancy of a dwelling to the agricultural use of specific premises (or similar specific business operational use) then such development will not be entitled to VAT reclaim under section 35 of the VAT Act 1994 (“the 1994 Act”).

 

But...

 

The Upper Tribunal distinguished between the cases with specific link to agricultural and business premises and those will a general agricultural tenancy condition. The later being entitled to VAT refund (assuming all other conditions satisfied)...

 

[Temp]

@sunflower If the above is still the case it might be worth trying to appeal the condition to get it changed to any equestrian business before you start?

[sunflower]

  On 04/10/2023 at 13:41, Temp said:

 

Scratch that. It depends on the exact wording of the condition....

 

https://www.buckles-law.co.uk/library-news/agri-occupancy-planning-conditions-beware-the-vat-sting/

 

Quotes..

 

It is now established that where there is an  agricultural occupancy planning condition or obligation restricting occupancy of a dwelling to the agricultural use of specific premises (or similar specific business operational use) then such development will not be entitled to VAT reclaim under section 35 of the VAT Act 1994 (“the 1994 Act”).

 

But...

 

The Upper Tribunal distinguished between the cases with specific link to agricultural and business premises and those will a general agricultural tenancy condition. The later being entitled to VAT refund (assuming all other conditions satisfied)...

 

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This is terrifically helpful, thank you!

[Temp]

  On 04/10/2023 at 14:13, sunflower said:

This is terrifically helpful, thank you!

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Jolly good. If it ends up saving you a fortune consider a modest donation to the forum running costs, let us know and I'll send you a Buildhub key fob..

[Shanemac]

I have experience of this, feel free to PM me if need be. 

[gavztheouch]

Hello, I have a similar problem. Here is my condition..

 

Restrict Occupation: The occupation of the dwelling hereby approved shall be limited to a person solely or mainly employed, or last employed, in connection with the Hay Barn on Land 255 Metres North of (Parents) Farm or a dependant of such a person residing with him or her, or a widow or widower of such a person.

 

Pretty nasty as it connects my shed to my new house and makes it impossible to sell the house by itself which is the definition of an issue. The second part of the below bullet points is new, i've been checking this for years on the HMRC website and never seen this before.

 

 

You are not eligible to use this scheme if you’ve:

• constructed a property that, because of a condition in the planning permission (or similar permission such as a planning agreement), cannot be disposed of or used separately

• constructed a property that either you, or your relatives, do not intend to live in but intend to sell or let out or use for any other business purpose — a business purpose also includes a dwelling built because you need to live where you work

 

What really bugs me is my house is the only one in my area that has this specific condition. All my peers who are also building now on their parents farm land have no conditions attached. I think I caught my local areas planning department in a transition phase when they moved from applying general ag tie to now zero ties. Somewhere in the middle they decided to make their own custom and specific ties which look to be very hard to reclaim the vat on.

 

My plan was to get the condition removed via a section 42 form, I have 1 month left before my 3 year window of opportunity closes to do this. My fear is, if I get the condition changed, it will trigger a new planning approval and hence I may not be able to claim vat back on all purchases I have made to date, roughly £100k.

 

@Shanemac I would love to hear your experiences