VAT reclaim where invoices are through builder's account

[JosieC]

Has anyone had any success with reclaiming VAT on invoices from the builder's accounts?

 

We paid our builder for sanitaryware and tiles and we ordered them on his accounts. All the invoices have the VAT on and we paid the full amount including VAT to the builder. We have payment evidence. The builder said he would refund us the VAT, but he is now refusing to. 

 

I wasn't going to include these invoices in my VAT reclaim, as I thought all invoices had to be in my name and my expectation is that the builder has claimed the VAT already, just not passed it on to us. 

 

However, when going through the HMRC VAT reclaim form, it says that if the invoice is not in your name, please explain why. I was wondering if that meant HMRC do accept invoices that aren't addressed to the owner, depending on the circumstances. 

 

I'm trying to avoid getting my whole claim thrown out by HMRC, so would appreciate any advice. 

 

Many thanks, Jo. 

 

 

 

 

[ProDave]

Unlikely to be successful.

 

If the builder supplies stuff "supply and fit" on a new build it must be zero rated for VAT.

 

If he supplies stuff but does not fit it, he is right to charge VAT but you will be unlikely to be able to re claim that.

 

If buying stuff for self install, buy it in your own name so your name is on the VAT receipt so you are guaranteed to be able to claim it.

[Temp]

Can you get the builder to issue you invoices? I mean for materials supply only not supply and fit? 

 

HMRC might still question it if they see its a builder supplying materials but if marked "supply only" might get away with it.

 

Edited July 31, 2023 by Temp

[Dave Jones]

why is he refusing ? could always mention you will complain to hmrc for vat fraud, an audit from them no one wants!

[JosieC]

16 minutes ago, ProDave said:

Unlikely to be successful.

 

If the builder supplies stuff "supply and fit" on a new build it must be zero rated for VAT.

 

If he supplies stuff but does not fit it, he is right to charge VAT but you will be unlikely to be able to re claim that.

 

If buying stuff for self install, buy it in your own name so your name is on the VAT receipt so you are guaranteed to be able to claim it.

Thank you for your advice. The contract we had with him included fit only. In hindsight we should have purchased the sanitaryware directly.

[JosieC]

8 minutes ago, Temp said:

Can you get the builder to issue you invoices? I mean for materials supply only not supply and fit?

 

Hello. Unfortunately the builder isn't willing to do anything with the invoices to help us. 

[JosieC]

11 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

why is he refusing ? could always mention you will complain to hmrc for vat fraud, an audit from them no one wants!

Hello, the issue with him is that we have a small amount of money on retention until the contracted works are finished. He wants the retention money before finishing the job and so refuses to enter into a discussion about the VAT. 

 

Obviously we can't do what he is demanding, because then we'll be further out of pocket, with no guarantee of him finishing the work and no guarantee of getting our VAT back. 

[Blooda]

Have you got proof of payment ? bank statement etc, that matches the amount ?   and a copy of the original invoice ?  or even a few invoices including that one, that total the same amount.

 

 

 

 

[Temp]

How much work is left? If its clearly identifiable as say 4 weeks work perhaps offer to pay weekly if you see progress on schedule.

[JosieC]

1 minute ago, Blooda said:

Have you got proof of payment ? bank statement etc, that matches the amount ?   and a copy of the original invoice ?  or even a few invoices including that one, that total the same amount.

 

 

 

 

Hello, yes I have proof of payment, the amounts match, copies of the invoices. The invoices were emailed to me directly. 

[JosieC]

Edited 

Edited July 31, 2023 by JosieC

[JosieC]

3 minutes ago, Temp said:

How much work is left? If its clearly identifiable as say 4 weeks work perhaps offer to pay weekly if you see progress on schedule.

Thank you, that is an idea to consider. 

[Rob99]

The builder can't refund you the VAT as he is not able to zero rate the supply of the goods (if he did, that would be VAT fraud!) Remember VAT is never money your builder gets to keep, it goes to HMRC. It's a clever system to make all businesses unpaid tax collectors (bit like PAYE).

 

The best you could do would be to ask him nicely if he will invoice you for the goods, or at least provide you with a VAT receipt in your name.

[Blooda]

 

1 hour ago, JosieC said:

Hello, yes I have proof of payment, the amounts match, copies of the invoices. The invoices were emailed to me directly. 

 

So... we had invoices / receipts in the name of the plumber and joiner, where we had paid the supplier direct, they had our name or first line of address or something that referenced it was for our job.

 

We added in our covering letter to the VAT man, something like,

 

"invoice numbers x,y,and z, are in the account name of our tradesman, as the suppliers would only deal with the trade, but let us order through their account.  We paid for these ourselves, and if requested we can provided evidence of payment be it bank statements or credit card statements." 

 

First rule:- if you don't ask you don't get.  

Second rule:- Don't include anything you definitely know is incorrect as this is fraud.  This includes VAT on delivery, tools, other stuff, that you can score out on a receipt.

If you are unsure, include, including offer to include supporting evidence if required.

 

There is a slight difference, inasmuch as you paid "the builder" and not the supplier, but if HMRC knock it back you, then have the clout to go to the builder and get him to sort it out, by supplying a VAT invoice for the amount you paid him for the goods.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 31, 2023 by Blooda

[nod]

Is he vat registered 

Many arnt 

[Blooda]

2 hours ago, ProDave said:

 

 

If he supplies stuff but does not fit it, he is right to charge VAT but you will be unlikely to be able to re claim that.

 

 

If he reinvoices to you and you pay him, then there should be no problem.

 

This is what we had to do with our ground worker; who bought all our Bricks, Sand and Cement, and roof tiles, and then reinvoiced us including VAT. 

I paid him before he paid the builder's merchant.

 

Got it back in the claim.  

 

 

 

[Blooda]

2 minutes ago, nod said:

Is he vat registered 

Many arnt 

 

That would be a different story then....  I assumed this was a turnkey build, either through a VAT registered builder, or through a not VAT registered builder [who should have then pointed the op in the direction of labour only, and paying individual trades].  

[Adrian Walker]

3 hours ago, JosieC said:

Has anyone had any success with reclaiming VAT on invoices from the builder's accounts?

 

We paid our builder for sanitaryware and tiles and we ordered them on his accounts. All the invoices have the VAT on and we paid the full amount including VAT to the builder. We have payment evidence. The builder said he would refund us the VAT, but he is now refusing to. 

 

I wasn't going to include these invoices in my VAT reclaim, as I thought all invoices had to be in my name and my expectation is that the builder has claimed the VAT already, just not passed it on to us. 

 

However, when going through the HMRC VAT reclaim form, it says that if the invoice is not in your name, please explain why. I was wondering if that meant HMRC do accept invoices that aren't addressed to the owner, depending on the circumstances. 

 

I'm trying to avoid getting my whole claim thrown out by HMRC, so would appreciate any advice. 

 

Many thanks, Jo. 

 

 

 

 

Jo

 

 

Have a free chat with my friend Andrew at https://www.vat431.co.uk/.  He has processed 100s of VAT claims and will know the solution for you.

 

 

[nod]

2 hours ago, Blooda said:

 

That would be a different story then....  I assumed this was a turnkey build, either through a VAT registered builder, or through a not VAT registered builder [who should have then pointed the op in the direction of labour only, and paying individual trades].  

You would be surprised how are not 

Even buying off eBay You have to ask does the price include vat Are you Vat registered So many says it includes vat but can’t supply a vat invoice 

 

[newhome]

Depends what your invoice says. If you have a completely separate invoice for materials and evidence that you paid the full amount to the builder then you can add the invoices to your VAT claim and add a covering explanation that your builder had to order the materials on your behalf as they had a trade account with the company. Also say that you paid the invoice in full and have payment evidence if needed. HMRC have definitely been refunding VAT paid on this basis (I know a couple of people who got it back). 
 

If your invoice shows both labour and the supply of materials then you will not be able to get the VAT refunded as a ‘joint’ invoice counts as supply & fit and must be zero rated.