Bath TUB kaput.. help!

[zoothorn]

Got this McAlpine one. https://www.toolstation.com/mcalpine-bath-wasteoverflow/p59080
 

Must say, Screwfix in town.. you feel like a number, fodder. Toolstation, new in town (far fewer folks in, helps every time) is the reverse: all staff are very helpful & very friendly. Every time. 
 

I am hoping to win a screwdriver in their prizedraw, yes it's true, but I'm impressed, & that helps a panicking idiot like me.

 

Z

[zoothorn]

Actually chaps, I'm not out of the woods yet on this.

 

I'm only assuming the innitial blockage, was a frozen outside bath drainpipe section. So, I could fit the new section today as it's a few degrees above 0.. & the bath still may not drain of course.

 

This detatched U-bend trap section, as said is brim-full of bath drain water. Is this normal? Or does this high level suggest something's amiss?

 

Thanks zoot

[ProDave]

Yes the trap should remain full of water, that is it's purpose to stop drain smells coming up your plug hole.

[zoothorn]

3 minutes ago, ProDave said:

Yes the trap should remain full of water, that is it's purpose to stop drain smells coming up your plug hole.

Yup understood ProDave thanks. The level today in the u-bend, is in fact lower by an inch, than it was at brimfull yesterday. So this might suggest the blockage -was- ice, & now it's clear.. & settled to it's normal level in this u-bend. But I don't know.

 

So, I still need to rule out any debris blockage, in the u-bend... or along the long bath-length pipe gradually sloping down & exiting the wall.. & lastly within the outside 500mm vertical pipe leading to the drain.

 

Afaict, I can't determine if there are any blockage in these 3 pipe sections, unless I connect my new bits to it, the bath connected too.. fill a bath somewhat full, & pull the plug for a test run. Then if it's still blocked, Im back bailing out & swearing alot.

 

Or am I missing a trick here? 

[Pocster]

57 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

Yup understood ProDave thanks. The level today in the u-bend, is in fact lower by an inch, than it was at brimfull yesterday. So this might suggest the blockage -was- ice, & now it's clear.. & settled to it's normal level in this u-bend. But I don't know.

 

So, I still need to rule out any debris blockage, in the u-bend... or along the long bath-length pipe gradually sloping down & exiting the wall.. & lastly within the outside 500mm vertical pipe leading to the drain.

 

Afaict, I can't determine if there are any blockage in these 3 pipe sections, unless I connect my new bits to it, the bath connected too.. fill a bath somewhat full, & pull the plug for a test run. Then if it's still blocked, Im back bailing out & swearing alot.

 

Or am I missing a trick here? 

If blocked try a ‘ mr muscle ‘ type drain cleaner product . They produce a foam in the pipe and eat through any organic stuff . In my rentals ; shower gel / soap seem to be a common sink / shower blocker . 

Edited December 17, 2022 by pocster

[zoothorn]

18 minutes ago, pocster said:

If blocked try a ‘ mr muscle ‘ type drain cleaner product . They produce a foam in the pipe and eat through any organic stuff . In my rentals ; shower gel / soap seem to be a common sink / shower blocker . 

I don't know if it's blocked is the point though. How do I determine if it is or not?
 

Bent u-shaped cost hanger in the u-bend trap section? I can't then get at the next long bath length pipe section, & I also can't get at the final vertical outside section exiting the water into the drain grate.

[Pocster]

1 minute ago, zoothorn said:

I don't know if it's blocked is the point though. How do I determine if it is or not?
 

Bent u-shaped cost hanger in the u-bend trap section? I can't then get at the next long bath length pipe section, & I also can't get at the final vertical outside section exiting the water into the drain grate.

Yeah - you can’t tell if it’s blocked . Stick mr muscle down there ; wait 30 minutes and see . Worst case no difference and you’ve wasted 5 quid or so . Much easier ( if it is blocked ) than coat hangers etc. and faffing around .

[twice round the block]

Best trap blockage I came across was a radiator valve control cap.

Installed by a plumber who had a big bag of loose fittings and this made its way inside a trap that he just hooked up.

[Pocster]

7 minutes ago, twice round the block said:

Best trap blockage I came across was a radiator valve control cap.

Installed by a plumber who had a big bag of loose fittings and this made its way inside a trap that he just hooked up.

I can beat that !

My in the ground soil pipe 110mm was filling up with 💩. So I rodded it to the next access chamber . What came out was a round head disc used on a rodding fixing !!! 

[zoothorn]

Chaps, 

 

finally removed the u-bend trap section. Cleaned up ( no blockage) & refitting to the long underneath bath pipe, the black ring seal thing has fouled/ split. Much swearing.

 

Can you get new black seal rings?? Or do I have to now replace the whole u-bend trap section?

 

 

 

 

[Pocster]

4 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

Chaps, 

 

finally removed the u-bend trap section. Cleaned up ( no blockage) & refitting to the long underneath bath pipe, the black ring seal thing has fouled/ split. Much swearing.

 

Can you get new black seal rings?? Or do I have to now replace the whole u-bend trap section?

 

 

 

 

You can get a new ring . I always worry it won’t be the exact size . So I buy a new fitting entirely as to be certain .

[zoothorn]

No problem- new trap £4 so off to buy one. Z

[zoothorn]

RIGHT.

 

Got the new trap & plug stuff above on, put some silicone on the tub underside at this rubber washer.. but otherwise just screwed a to b etc. 

 

Please can I now have a bath please? Or do I need to wait until this silicone has cured?

 

I still don't know if the blockage has shifted mind you. Can only think it -was- ice in the outside section.
 

 

[zoothorn]

JesusHchrist.

 

Left the silicone overnight, now dry enough. Tested everything by a bucket of water into bath, undone plug..

 

constant drips from the trap lowest section. So tightened it up 1/8 turn as much as I could.. drips still happeneing,

 

FFS!!!

 

 

 

[Onoff]

Where the white meets the black? 

 

Going to be a bitch to get any PTFE tape around there for instance.

 

In the white bit there should I think be a black rubber O ring and a solid backing washer? The backing washer compresses the rubber. 

 

Think I'd try and smear the threads with say Jet Blue Plus.

[ProDave]

Adding sealant is a bodge and avoiding finding the reason.  Find WHICH joint is leaking, where the black joins the white?  Where the outlet from the trap joins the white pipe?  Or the white cap on the trap below that?

 

Or is is still leaking where the bath waste joins the bath or where the overflow joins into the black bath waste fitting?

[Onoff]

8 minutes ago, ProDave said:

Adding sealant is a bodge

 

I agree but Jet Blue isn't a sealant per se but a joint compound.

[dpmiller]

Looking at the levels and the location of the drip, I'd say it was drainoff/ rodding point dooberry. Perhaps someone forgot to stick an O-ring on the cap...

 

unscrew the cap and see what's behind, and either shove a suitable O-ring there or wrap the thread in tape. DO NOT OVERTIGHTEN!!!

[Marvin]

Use kitchen roll or tissue to find the source of the leak as it leaks. then sort out.

[zoothorn]

1 hour ago, Onoff said:

Where the white meets the black? 

 

Going to be a bitch to get any PTFE tape around there for instance.

 

In the white bit there should I think be a black rubber O ring and a solid backing washer? The backing washer compresses the rubber. 

 

Think I'd try and smear the threads with say Jet Blue Plus.

No, if you can zoom in.. leak's @ the lowest part, @ where there's a small extra screw cap thing. The drip is from here, & it's not from the white/ black junction further up, nor onward at the junction to the main long white pipe.

 

I can visibly see it's coming from this extra small screw cap/ whatever the damn thing is.

[ProDave]

2 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

No, if you can zoom in.. leak's @ the lowest part, @ where there's a small extra screw cap thing. The drip is from here, & it's not from the white/ black junction further up, nor onward at the junction to the main long white pipe.

 

I can visibly see it's coming from this extra small screw cap/ whatever the damn thing is.

So unscrew it, make sure it has a rubber seal washer, make sure it is all clean, no foreign objects, re fit and re tighten and try again.

[Onoff]

That's an access/rodding point for cleaning the trap out. Try turning the rubber washer around. 

 

You need to be 100% sure it's not leaking from higher up and running down to there. 

[zoothorn]

35 minutes ago, dpmiller said:

Looking at the levels and the location of the drip, I'd say it was drainoff/ rodding point dooberry. Perhaps someone forgot to stick an O-ring on the cap...

 

unscrew the cap and see what's behind, and either shove a suitable O-ring there or wrap the thread in tape. DO NOT OVERTIGHTEN!!!

Im going to have to redo the whole thing dpm. I dont have ptfe tape, I cant get a hand to it to undo/ do up anyway even if I could. Its just junk made, stupid design as you could never access this extra fk knows what screw cap anyway. So another trip & 2 hours work.

 

At least I had a bath, just had to, but dreading draining it as I cant get anything shallow enough under to catch these drips. So another bailing out first then. Damn bloody job.

[zoothorn]

1 minute ago, ProDave said:

So unscrew it, make sure it has a rubber seal washer, make sure it is all clean, no foreign objects, re fit and re tighten and try again.

I can't unscrew it, the design means access isn't feasable. All I could logically do, is just about with all my strength to access & contort my hand, tighten it up, which I did  1/8 turn expecting this slighty loose aspect to fix it. Exactly the same. But now it's even less possible to unscrew even if I had some ptfe tape.

 

I need a new one simply without this stupid ass extra lower section.

[zoothorn]

5 minutes ago, Onoff said:

That's an access/rodding point for cleaning the trap out. Try turning the rubber washer around. 

 

You need to be 100% sure it's not leaking from higher up and running down to there. 

Hi Onoff. Understood thanks.

 

I am 100% sure, before posting this new problem exactly where, & where not, the leak is coming from.
 

Its simply dry at the black/ white junction above. And I can see it coming out the low thing screw cap. And it's dry onward at the junction to main 2m bath sloping pipe (dry on the underside of the sloping pipe too, just as confirmation).