3M VHB Tape to affix Corten steel cladding

[thefoxesmaltings]

Has anyone got experience of using solely 3M VHB Double Sided tape, or steel grade liquid adhesive (if that exists?), to affix a non-structural corten steel facade panel.

 

We have a requirement to clad some external walls & columns in corten steel, but want to avoid showing any fixings (rivets/screws etc.). My thought process is to purchase the 2mm thick corten as sheet metal, already cut to size, and then affix to the flat structure using the 3M VHB tape.

Fixing required indoors & outdoors.

 

I'm aware of the various cassette facade systems with hidden fastenings, but these come at a significant additional cost.

 

Alternative ideas welcome...

Edited May 3, 2022 by thefoxesmaltings
More context

[saveasteading]

1 minute ago, thefoxesmaltings said:

to affix a non-structural corten steel facade panel.

Is it flat? how big, how thick? And fixing to what?

Indoors?

If multiple panels will you be able to seal the joints?

 

More questions than answers. 6 : 0. 

[thefoxesmaltings]

24 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

Is it flat? how big, how thick? And fixing to what?

Indoors?

If multiple panels will you be able to seal the joints?

 

More questions than answers. 6 : 0. 

Edited the original post with further detail. Also below. Apologies for the ambiguity.
 

• 2mm thick corten steel sheets
• Not sure yet what fixing to...battens etc.
• Indoors and outdoors
• Multiple panels, have not intended to seal the joints. Would you say this is necessary?

[saveasteading]

10 minutes ago, thefoxesmaltings said:

have not intended to seal the joints.

If you don't, whatever is behind will get wet. 

That is going to be quite heavy. I would worry that any adhesive might work but gradually allow creep.

 

I like screws. Rather as rivets do, they show how the construction is done and they work.

An Architect might  call that 'honesty' if trying to justify it.

Edited May 3, 2022 by saveasteading

[Conor]

Weld a couple lengths of U section to the backs and hang them.

[thefoxesmaltings]

1 hour ago, saveasteading said:

If you don't, whatever is behind will get wet. 

That is going to be quite heavy. I would worry that any adhesive might work but gradually allow creep.

 

I like screws. Rather as rivets do, they show how the construction is done and they work.

An Architect might  call that 'honesty' if trying to justify it.

Screws/rivets is the obvious choice, yes. But trying to avoid any visible fixings as it doesn't look good with corten steel.

[thefoxesmaltings]

1 hour ago, Conor said:

Weld a couple lengths of U section to the backs and hang them.

What would you hang the U section backing on the steel onto? i.e. What surface would there need to be instead of battens? 

Just trying to visualise how this would work...

Edited May 3, 2022 by thefoxesmaltings

[Conor]

Another length of U section or a set of these

 

https://www.toolstation.com/flushmount-fitting/p60564

 

I think the biggest challenge would be welding the sections on to the steel sheets without burning through.

 

Edited May 3, 2022 by Conor

[Miek]

Depending on how flat you want the panels, welding could warp the 2mm sheet.

 

 

[Radian]

I don't know if it's specified for you application but for a liquid adhesive you could test sikafast-2590 which is a fairly serious two-component super glue. Sika say It has gap filling properties up to 5 mm. I've not tried it myself but eyed it up for fixing some aluminium cladding to plywood. In the end I used Stixall and it worked a treat.

[saveasteading]

2 hours ago, Conor said:

welding the sections on to the steel sheets

Corten is a form of stainless I believe. so welding may require some homework.

[thefoxesmaltings]

10 hours ago, Radian said:

I don't know if it's specified for you application but for a liquid adhesive you could test sikafast-2590 which is a fairly serious two-component super glue. Sika say It has gap filling properties up to 5 mm. I've not tried it myself but eyed it up for fixing some aluminium cladding to plywood. In the end I used Stixall and it worked a treat.

Yeah I've come across these acrylic adhesives which look like they could be suitable - https://www.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/bonding-and-assembly-uk/substrate/metal/
"Structural bonding of metals" apparently.

 

The cure time of 10mins or so could be a bit tricky to keep the panels in place for that amount of time.

[markocosic]

- Fold the top of the sheet to that you have a "french cleat" (like the flush-mount firings listed earlier from toolstation) to hook it onto some clips? No. the bottom will flap and it will fall off.

 

- Fold the top AND bottom of the sheet with the bottom one LONGER than the top one; hook over the bottom clips, slide up, hook over the top clips, allow to fall. Can't come off the bottom clips without lifting it up and over the top clips. Same effect can be achieved using the flush mount clips and same size flanges on the sheet.

 

If you don't want the edges being different?

 

- Fold all found edges

 

- Weld the clips on. Not with a farmer's arc welder all in one go out in a field but an automotive type MIG welder in short bursts that isn't going to blown through or distort 2 mm plate. Spot welding would leave marks both sides. Could be a design feature. Could be ugly.

 

I wouldn't want an arm / head sliced off by a piece of 2 mm steel plate and wind / gravity.

[Mr Punter]

Is it too late to back away from the Corten?  A world of pain and may cause issues with financing and resales.

[thefoxesmaltings]

Just now, Mr Punter said:

Is it too late to back away from the Corten?  A world of pain and may cause issues with financing and resales.

Not really, but the alternatives we've looked at either aren't suitable or 5x the price. Open to suggestions though.

[Mr Punter]

Brick, block, render, slate, tile.  All can look traditional or ultra modern.

[TM1500]

Hi,

 

what solution did you use in the end? We are planning to use adhesive to battens with a lip over the top and bottom edges. I sent samples to Sika to test their tape/adhesive and they said it was not suitable.

[thefoxesmaltings]

On 20/06/2023 at 20:29, TM1500 said:

Hi,

 

what solution did you use in the end? We are planning to use adhesive to battens with a lip over the top and bottom edges. I sent samples to Sika to test their tape/adhesive and they said it was not suitable.

Mechanical fixings. Black Torque screws. Wasn't worth the gamble relying on tape/adhesives.

[JohnMo]

Not worth the court case if a panel was to be pulled of by the wind or "just" fell off, damaging something or someone. Use mechanical fixings. 

On 04/05/2022 at 11:47, markocosic said:

Weld the clips on. Not with a farmer's arc welder all in one go out in a field but an automotive type MIG welder in short bursts

If you go this route use the correct filler material (mig welding wire) for corten, mild steel welding wire is not the correct material and will lead to premature failure of the welded area.

[Alan Ambrose]

>>> Mechanical fixings. Black Torque screws. Wasn't worth the gamble relying on tape/adhesives.

 

Well steel is heavy - about 16 kg per m^2 at 2mm thick and I'm guessing you have 10s of m^2? It strikes me that thinner steel would be easier to support.

 

I rather liked @markocosic 's idea of supporting all the weight on a top fold though.

 

Your SE has OKed the fixings? As, say, 20m^2 (i.e. 320 kg) on typical timber battens sounds a bit iffy.

 

There's a structure at Snape Maltings btw which doesn't have obvious fixings, I always assumed it was carefully welded along the seams. I will have a closer look next time I'm there:

 

https://www.dezeen.com/2010/02/14/the-dovecote-studio-by-haworth-tompkins/

 

FYI: "the steel was welded together to form a watertight box"

Edited June 27, 2023 by Alan Ambrose