Is planning permission required to *remove* chimney from approved plans

[nikotime]

Hi there,

 

First time poster!

 

We have had an offer accepted for a piece of land - hurrah! Our land is part of a wider plot of 7 properties all with detailed planning permission, and the landowner is building one of the plots themselves to live in. All houses are to be built in a common style and the landowner does not want any changes to the exterior of the house if it requires planning amendments (including material). This is because the council were quite challenging and very particular about various planning elements, but more importantly, are affected by the Natural England nutrient neutrality advice. 

 

We are fine with the outside of the house, and the plot is in the perfect location, but the internal layout doesn't fit us 'out of the box' so we are going to be speaking with an architect to make tweaks to it. Something I wanted to check is whether you can remove a chimney breast without informing the planning authorities? This is the only plot with plans for two chimney breasts, the rest all have one, and with potential internal changes it really doesn't make sense for us to have them both. Can we simply not build one without informing, or would it be considered as a non-material  or material amendment?

 

Thanks!

[Russell griffiths]

If it’s a planning thing then you can build a false one on the roof, for the look, just don’t continue it down through the house, a lot of chimney stacks are now fibreglass replicas that just sit there doing nothing. 

[nikotime]

1 hour ago, Russell griffiths said:

If it’s a planning thing then you can build a false one on the roof, for the look, just don’t continue it down through the house, a lot of chimney stacks are now fibreglass replicas that just sit there doing nothing. 

Ah great thanks, that would save a bit of money but didn't think about a replica. Appreciate it!

[joth]

Think carefully if you want either chimney. They're drafty holes in the house that let dirt in and heat out, and there's much more efficient and cleaner ways to heat a house in the 21st century

[nikotime]

14 hours ago, joth said:

Think carefully if you want either chimney. They're drafty holes in the house that let dirt in and heat out, and there's much more efficient and cleaner ways to heat a house in the 21st century

Yes I agree! We wouldn't have chosen to put them on but unfortunately from a planning perspective we just can't change anything externally if we want this plot. And if they are there it kind of bothers me that we couldn't utilise them at all - the plan was for a single wood pellet burner as a secondary heat source - rest of house will be under floor heating powered by ASHP. 

 

Is there any advice on how to build them to lose as little heat as possible? I had a little Google and struggled. 

 

 

[Simplysimon]

if you are going with an ashp then you want to be really well insulated and as air tight as possible. if you achieve those objectives as well as an oversized ashp so it doesn't run at full bore, you should need very little extra heat input i.e a wood pellet burner, which would require a very dry store to house the pellets. @ProDave has a small wood burner as do others and by doing so an external air vent straight into the stove will stop the air lost with a normal chimney.

we keep harping on about insulate, insulate, insulate, pay once for that or pay monthly for energy.

[SteamyTea]

17 hours ago, Russell griffiths said:

fibreglass replicas

Why go to that expense.  Plywood and paint.  Then let the first storm blow it away.

[SimonD]

18 hours ago, nikotime said:

Can we simply not build one without informing, or would it be considered as a non-material  or material amendment?

 

Planners asked us to add one into the design of the house. We added it to the design and have not built it. As our kindly architect pointed out, there's no requirement or date in the planning approval to finish the build.....so it's going to remain unfinished in perpetuity.

[CharlieKLP]

Have you thought about making the changes you want, then getting retrospective planning or section 73? 
 

I wonder if that counts as an amendment. 
 

I do dislike this kind of thing, I do a fair amount of Custom Build and small developments, and I think people should be able to tweak as much as they like, it’s their money their house. 

[SteamyTea]

20 minutes ago, CharlieKLP said:

I do dislike this kind of thing, I do a fair amount of Custom Build and small developments, and I think people should be able to tweak as much as they like, it’s their money their house

Have you seen the older parts of Toronto? They had no planning control until the late 1970s.

[CharlieKLP]

4 hours ago, SteamyTea said:

Have you seen the older parts of Toronto? They had no planning control until the late 1970s.

I meant within planning requirements.

 

As long as you don’t change the footprint and internal area. Blocking you is just being awkward, it’s not even difficult to do a minor amendment or S73.
 

If I was selling my garden land off to a self-builder I wouldn’t force them to build what I wanted, and I wouldn’t buy a plot where it was so restrictive either. Even Plot Passports for custom build are a bit much imo.
 

 

[nikotime]

Appreciate all the thoughts. It certainly isn't an ideal situation but we are happy overall with the exterior of the house and the location and land it sits on are just ideal for us - the main frustration for me is the too many chimneys! 

 

The reason they are not allowing changes is down to the experience they had getting the planning permission for the 7 plots. They've just had a minor amendment to the plot countered with a large number of additional conditions placed upon the plot (all landowners to pay x for green space, council legal fees) which could delay by up to 6 months - and were advised by a consultant that changes to one of the 7 plots could require changes to all. We're happy to operate under these conditions due to all the positive elements. 

 

I will speak to our architect regarding S73. We are completely fine to put any planning requests in we would like after the rest of the plots are built! This is the only house on the plot with two rather than one chimneys, typically...

[Mr Punter]

Just build it without the chimneys as @SimonD has done.

[nikotime]

On 24/04/2022 at 11:46, Mr Punter said:

Just build it without the chimneys as @SimonD has done.

Gonna do exactly that with the one I didn't like!  But we are going to build one of them as my wife really does love fire...I'm going to explore if a back boiler stove makes sense as the ASHP and utility room will be directly next to the chimney, would be nice to think the heat can hopefully power the UFH too. Might be a waste of money though, research required clearly!