Are any TV 'Architects', Architects?

[SteamyTea]

1 hour ago, MikeSharp01 said:

There is perhaps nothing wrong with discussion but I would hope we don't chase them away as they do add value in those dimensions of this business where their expertise has direct impact

 

We have had a couple of architects on here, one does not seem to post anymore and the other only lasted a few days.  This is a shame as we cannot 'educate' them.

 

I think part of the problem is that people have a mental image of an architect, and that is generally based on well known ones (Rogers, Wren, Foster).

I suspect that a normal architect can only be an expert in one or two aspects of building, so the complete package has to be done by a team of specialists.

Personally, I would place my trust in a good mechanical engineer, the building regs and some pictures of a house or features that I would like to incorporate.

 

@PeterW I missed your reply, but I generally agree.

 

Edited April 8, 2017 by SteamyTea

[Jeremy Harris]

It is a shame, but it's no good trying to pretend that some architects aren't that interested in one-off, mid-budget, self builds.  Quite apart from anything else, I doubt this is a sufficiently large market sector to build a profitable business from.

 

A total of thirteen architects have been to look at our build, not quite sure why, I can only assume that there's a forum or Facebook group for architects where it got a mention.  Out of those thirteen,  two were people I could have worked with, one had a commercial practice and wanted to use the integrated design and systems approach he used in commercial architecture to the design of dwellings, the other was a local architect with a particular interest in low energy homes (and had I met her when I was looking around I'd have used her practice, I'm sure).  The remainder were a bit of an odd mix, but had one common feature; they just had no real understanding of why a low energy home has to be designed from the ground up with energy conservation as the primary influence on every decision process.  Some reminded me of one of the architects I originally approached, who suggested we shouldn't have East and West gable windows on the first floor, but should fit four large roof lights in the South facing roof...........................

[Ferdinand]

Hmm. My initial question was neutral. I asked it because I was musing on the use of the word and the self-definition of the profession.

 

For TV, I would say:

 

1 - It is a lot about how you get to be on TV or advising, and that is very much about who you know and being in the right place at the right time.

2 - The skill set needed is different to that of a construction professional, in that being a TV presenter you need TV presenter, and also have to be photogenic or 'interesting', and have a "Face that Fits" That latter involves a whole set of prejudices and assumptions.

3 - I think it is also about "architects" being stereotyped. Part of that is us, audiences, and the TV companies not having a clear understanding, and part of that is lack of clarity on the professional side. For example how many here would be able to write a 100 word description of the professional competence / role of an architect. I think we could all try, but would all miss parts out with which we are not acquainted.

 

For self-build I would say:

 

1 - We are overwhelmingly inexperienced clients, and there is no opportunity to gain experience in the typical self-build career of one or two builds. How long does it take for a new self-builder to gain the 'hinterland' to become a proficient client?

2 - We have difficulty sometimes interpreting how paper / cad relates to what we will get. That brings in the usefulness of models and other tools etc.

3 - The result is that it is easy to end up with a fairly standard build, which doesn't reflect our dream because we do not know how to articulate our dream and use our architect to deliver that.

4 - So we end up with our architect/designers interpretation of some aspects of our dream that we have been able to articulate, which is an intelligent estimate.

 

There is also something in there about the role being so massively broad, that it is almost impossible for any one person to fulfil all aspects. So we need to see a lot of people who's profile does not fit what we need before we find the right one, and perhaps have a lot of extra expectations.

 

Just me thinking aloud. What did Mark Brinkley say about this?

 

Ferdinand

 

Edited April 8, 2017 by Ferdinand

[MikeSharp01]

It feels to me that we must acknowledge their training and experience as they should ours. It is perhaps this tension that, when not 100% focused on creative synergy between architect and client, creates the perception of arrogance and aloofness often alluded to here as the problem with architects.  In the end if you are not a trained and practising architect you will need an open mind and a very large quantum of empathy with their drives and motivation to get the very best out of them. In their training they are taught how to elicit thoughts, ideas and feelings from clients and then interpret them in the designs that have been commissioned of them. As with the rest of us they do not know what they do not know (or have not been told) and in terms of best practice in aspects of construction, such as highly insulated homes where solar gain plays a bit part, many will not be versed. This does not in itself detract from their wider value in driving forward the built environment albeit at the behest of clients. Aye there is the rub!

 

As in all soft systems, those constructed by humans, the CATWOE acronym, coined so aptly by Peter Checkland (et al) tells us, how we might come to understand one another and create solutions to problems once they are mutually understood with clear root causes identified and shared.

 

CUSTOMERS, ACTORS, TRANSFORMATIONAL PROCESSES, WORLD VIEWS, OWNERS & ENVIRONMENTAL CONSTRAINTS.

 

As self builders we are often very clear about what we want and this is a constraint architects are trained to work with, why, because knowing what you want is not always what you should have or need. There is, after all, often a fundamental difference between what you need and what you want. As a professional I was always trained to give the customer what they needed rather than just what they wanted, unless the two were 100% coincident. They wanted a degree, they needed an education. In the end they, formerly the state, were paying me to improve things for them and they acknowledged that they were employing me to support, explain and curate their journey. In taking them off piste you had to be able to justify the choice, show them things they had never considered and make the case for driving it home.

 

8 hours ago, SteamyTea said:

Personally, I would place my trust in a good mechanical engineer, the building regs and some pictures of a house or features that I would like to incorporate.

Sorry @SteamyTea, I cannot agree - design, architectural or otherwise, is at the core of our environment be it good or bad, engineering delivers great designs based on leveraging sound science only if the initial design is sound. In most things it is not difficult to see the juxtaposition between form and function and perhaps which follows which is the fulcrum upon which this discussion balances. Houses, Le Corbusier said, are machines for living in and he was right but living is a human construct, back to CATWOE, not an engineering one, well thankfully not yet anyway!

 

Perhaps its sharing our ideas and allowing others to show us as yet untravelled paths we find hard to do?

 

[Onoff]

I've sat in meetings with some of the stellar names in the world of architecture and some of the anal requests they make and that come to fruition are mind boggling. One was concerned at seeing the end of a series of 2mm wall / 18mm dia st/st tubes that sat inboard of the curtain wall facade 3m apart.....FIVE FLOORS UP! "Pinpoints of light" was the phrase used I believe. I just said we could heat treat to colour the st/st but wouldn't guarantee it wouldn't affect the properties of the 316.

 

Another ignored a B.S. COP and the major builder etc all just bowed down to it. (The system doesn't comply to this day). I've had drawings covered in their red pen comments batting back our design suggestions. We do what they ask then when it doesn't work change it later and charge the earth.

 

They're often treated like Gods the big names.

[Jeremy Harris]

I think the flip side is that we can all benefit from the art of design that a good architect contributes.  I know that, when I decided to not use an architect (only because I couldn't find a local one that understood low energy house design) I really struggled with getting the house to look right.  My solution was to spend the best part of a year doing several iterations of the design, making models and changing things until I thought the design was about as good as I could make it.  No architect would have the luxury of taking such an approach, and I'm sure my design could have been significantly improved by input from someone with a far better eye for design than me. 

 

I approached the design from a performance standpoint primarily, fitting in the spaces we wanted within the bounds of what would work for good energy efficiency.  Every single element of the design was driven by the desire to reduce heat loss and excessive solar gain, whilst giving us the features we wanted.  Doing that and making the house look good is a difficult challenge, as the performance requirements place significant constraints on the design.

 

I've said this before, but I'm convinced that there is a need to join together the engineering skills needed to build a house with a good level of performance with the artistic design skills of architects.  This seems to happen in commercial design; my last programme when I was working had a lab and office build project of around £96M as a part of it, and the design team were very integrated, with architects and engineers working side by side, on an equal footing, driven by our requirement that the building should meet or exceed the BREEAM Excellent rating (it was the first public sector building in the UK to achieve this, in fact).  I've met one former commercial architect who wants to adopt the same approach to house design, but sadly I encountered around ten times that number who seemed to have the view that design came first and performance was something for an engineer to sort out afterwards.  One of the architects even openly said this to me; the one that suggested fitting four large roof lights in the South elevation.  I questioned whether the house might overheat with such an arrangement and the reply was that "the engineers will sort that out".  Interestingly, the one architect I've met who is very interested in low energy house design has a very good understanding of the engineering and physics needed to model house performance.

 

[curlewhouse]

On ‎08‎/‎04‎/‎2017 at 08:44, divorcingjack said:

Our architect is a saint. I honestly don't know how he's put up with us as clients. He is calmest chap I've ever met, and always, always, eventually right about things. 

 

God, I must be irritating to work with. 

Ours was really helpful when we were having our difficulties with the planners and was a calming influence. He explained everything and didn't assume just because if I knew what he was talking about that my wife necessarily did, and did that without seeming condescending. I'd say he certainly did a lot more than design the house ( he even arranged for me to go to a site and actually have a go with ICF to see if it was something we wanted to do).  

[Adamantium]

BBC Northern Ireland - BBC house of the year guest judge Des Ewing - he's an architect - top guy.

[Adelaide]

Hi everyone. 

 

I will just start by saying, this is all so new to me. I have had a read through, and still getting used to using the site.

 

I am looking for an architect in the Hertfordshire/Bedfordshire area. 

 

This is the only forum I have joined. Could anybody send some recommendations please. 

 

Thank you in advance. 

[Temp]

On ‎1‎/‎1‎/‎2018 at 11:28, Adelaide said:

I am looking for an architect in the Hertfordshire/Bedfordshire area. 

 

PM sent.

[Hecateh]

I'm so glad this thread was reactivated - reading it has helped raise my awareness of the issues regarding architects that many people have come across.  My job - pretty small and aiming for as economical as possible, clearly was never going to attract a decent architect inexpensively.  

 

Te 'design' my architect came up with was inspiring to say the least, my requests were either done or not done, if pushed she would just say 'it doesn't work' or can't do that' rather than telling me why or trying to find how to get me what I wanted.

 

I've highlighted issues on other threads, along with thes her design shows a hump in my drive, in front of the front door and no provision for underfloor heating despite reminding her this requirement prior to her doing her final drawings.  

 

Feeling a bit less as though I've been stupid now (I had seen 3 others before her) mediocre would seem to be the norm at the cost level.

[MikeSharp01]

On 08/04/2017 at 10:33, JSHarris said:

had no real understanding of why a low energy home has to be designed from the ground up with energy conservation as the primary influence on every decision process. 

This is the essential point about low energy home design in that function, how good it is at keeping the energy requirements down, has to go hand in hand with form otherwise you get a house that wont have low energy as its primary functional focus beyond being a machine fir living in. As I have said above I was happy with our architects but I acted as the energy consultant and kept a model in PHPP for each design to ensure they were in the envelope and where not they adjusted the design. So in the end we worked up three designs all of which were in the energy ball park before we chose the final design. 

Edited September 10, 2019 by MikeSharp01
Sense clarification