concrete road

[scottishjohn]

my road has just been washed out with the monsoon we had yesterday -water coming off farmers field on upside of the road-

so yes i got to repair for time being

but thinking 

of concrete the road in bits --but what sort of surface to put on it to make it usable in freezing weather --tarmac sounds like it will be more expensive +just as slippy with the hill

suggestions 

pictures of damage to follow later 

[ProDave]

We used to go to a b&b in Wales up a steep drive.  They just laid 2 strips of concrete (don't turn up in a 3 wheel car) with grooves in the surface finish at about 45 degrees, looks like they were made with something about the diameter of a broom handle.

 

Never had any problems getting up that.

 

You need to divert the run off from the field so it goes somewhere else not down your road or it could wash out what's under the concrete.  Also a drainage channel at intervals to divert water running down the road off to somewhere else.

[markc]

Tarmac needs a good well compacted base to prevent areas sinking. Concrete is much more tolerant but sub base problems result in slabs tilting and becoming uneven etc.

Tarmac shed water as long as it has a slope or camber but must be very well rolled to prevent water ingress and busting the surface when it freezes.

Smooth concrete sheds water but is very slippery with grease and leaves etc. tamped concrete can hold water is the corrugations and form an ice sheet when frozen.

I would say tarmac will be cheaper but not as hard wearing.

[joe90]

Bugger!,! My neighbour had a (short) steep concrete drive and he left it rough tamped cross ways to create ridges fir grip and it worked well even in snow. You also need to divert the water somehow, a ditch filled with 50mm stone is usual on road sides?

[scottishjohn]

digger coming tomorrow and most of what was washed down has now been hauled back up by farmer and umped for me to work with it -get it back into place

as afras being hard you will see when I get pictures that is not a problem -we have 12" DEEP GULLY in it and its still granite waste below that and then  2 or 3 leayers of tarmac above it --so hard fill is not the problem --jusat need to divert water --but where is the problem

 to be fair is was a once in 40 year event yesterday

local farmer says last rain like that was 1954 --

 -A75 was closed in parts due to fields washing on to it further along to gatehouse  area 

[scottishjohn]

first picture was what the road was like on monday of this week.

the othe pictures are the road after the monsoon which caused a burn to burst its banks in farmers field and then cascade over his wall onto my road

 the piles on the road are what we recovered from the bottom opf the council prad and hauled back up .

today digger  arrived and we started to remake it 

 

[ProDave]

I now know why I have seen some properties with what is basically a dry moat all around the boundary with adjoining land.  To take such occasional flood water away where it won't do harm.

[joe90]

Gosh, ain’t Mother Nature cruel. Still a once in 40 year timescale is (fairly ) good news. Perhaps the farmer could be convinced to deepen his burn?????

[scottishjohn]

1 minute ago, joe90 said:

Gosh, ain’t Mother Nature cruel. Still a once in 40 year timescale is (fairly ) good news. Perhaps the farmer could be convinced to deepen his burn?????

we will behaving discussions on this very soon with him , lack of cleaning out of the burn -dead tree in it etc

[scottishjohn]

road now put back injust need roller and also remade the waterfall and culvert area where the burn crosses the road 

 

think Ii should rename this area as"timotei falls "--looks just like the advert with this flow 

 and of course such a nice night -got to have some piccies of the view --its all that keeps me going when i,m feeling tiered and its too big a job 

 

 also spoke to farmer and we modified his bit of the burn which caused the problem --

fixed I HOPE for my lifetime

Edited September 6, 2020 by scottishjohn

[Simplysimon]

if you can cut steel with water, a gravel road doesn't pose too much of an issue to move around.

[Onoff]

7 hours ago, Simplysimon said:

if you can cut steel with water, a gravel road doesn't pose too much of an issue to move around.

 

Waterjet cutting? If John's flood water is at circa 60000psi he's in trouble! Needs to redirect it to cut some of that granite up!

[Rmawdsley]

Tarmac will be your cheapest option. You’d probably be looking at £25-30 per m if it was in the northwest of England. If you grade and compact it yourself and then get a tarmac contractor in with a road paver, it would only take them a morning to lay it and you’d be able to run on it the morning after. Concrete you’d have to shutter the edges, set the mesh and then leave it a week before running on it.

Robert

[scottishjohn]

29 minutes ago, Rmawdsley said:

Tarmac will be your cheapest option. You’d probably be looking at £25-30 per m if it was in the northwest of England. If you grade and compact it yourself and then get a tarmac contractor in with a road paver, it would only take them a morning to lay it and you’d be able to run on it the morning after. Concrete you’d have to shutter the edges, set the mesh and then leave it a week before running on it.

Robert

that would be £15k then for that bit of the road!! in tarmac and that depends on how thick they lay it -

 my guess using same dimensions but a 4" thick concrete top is £5k for the concrete  maybe less .

 maybe not the rigth way 0-but my thoughts so far are to lay the concrete in two sections 

centreline of road to one edge with a 1" drop to edge -then do other side same --that should give enough run off  and grip if laid with rough tamped finish ?

 or maybe just make up a tamper bar with the shape higher  in middle than outside  and do sections at full width  to give the camber --just going to be very heavy to work 

 

[Rmawdsley]

That would be for 50mm base, 30mm SMA. I’m not sure of the rate for base only but you could get a quote for 80-100mm base only and may get it to £15-20pm. Your back would thank you ?. I’m not sure about your area, but a m3 of the concrete you’ll want to use is between £86-95 + vat. You’ll want to do it full width if you concrete as you can back the wagons in then. 

[simon45089]

I have just been quoted £10,500 plus vat for a 90 x 3 metre road that consists of 100mm sub base then 60mm of 20mm tarmac and a further 40mm of 10mm tarmac. So 100mm sub base and 100mm of tarmac. Im in Northumberland. Is that a fair price ? Happy to pass on details if it is !

[scottishjohn]

this road has been in use for over 200 years and where the water ate through it you could see many layers of tarmac+  and hardcore+lack quarry waste mix --which is still as hard as hell

even the deepest ruts still had well compacted hardcore at the bottom --so once it drys up enough for me to vibro roll the top layer back in   I, m sure it will need nothing more than a hard water proof layer 

 the reason it broke up to start with was due to 40 years of tree growth on the surface and root penetration  and my clearing of it which meant i had to break through parts of the original hard top  to remove  6" roots from the 30ft trees that grew on it

my guess is a 5cum jigger of concrete will do about 10m of road 

 more planning required and good weather 

 my thoughts are to wait till house is built and heavy road usage by big trucks and construction equipment  is past

 I will need a nice little lottery win to tarmac it all the way 

Edited September 7, 2020 by scottishjohn