dnb Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 I am considering options for floor insulation while I wait for deliveries for the roof. The plan is currently to use 150mm of PIR boards with 65mm of screed over the top. But this requires either paying over the odds at a local builders merchant or finding a way to get 20 cubic metres of PIR from somewhere like seconds and co moved across an expensive bit of water. Are there viable alternatives to consider that achieve close to the same insulation values and end up costing a bit less or don't require me to drive a HGV to Wales? Current best price is of the order of £33 per m2 to site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 (edited) First google hit says they deliver to some parts of Wales and if I've done my sums right it's under £17 /sqm inc VAT. Free delivery over £400. Otherwise £40. https://www.cutpriceinsulation.co.uk/collections/pir/products/quinn-therm-pir-insulation-1200-x-2400-x-150mm Edit: Ah ok the Wales reference had me confused. I see you are on IOW. Edited July 23, 2020 by Temp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 This place covers IOW.. https://www.hampshireinsulations.co.uk/about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnb Posted July 23, 2020 Author Share Posted July 23, 2020 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Temp said: you are on IOW Yes. That bit of water is an equal curse and blessing. I could live with 17 per m2... Even if I had to take a couple of vans to Southampton to tranship. I was hopeful of some new process for applying insulation to floors that involved moving smaller volumes of stuff around the place. I guess that PIR still has the top spot though. Edited July 23, 2020 by dnb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 I think only aerogel is better than PIR. That's very expensive and in it's best form its fragile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeGrahamT21 Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 Phenolic is slightly better than PIR in terms of performance, Kingspan Kooltherm type stuff, 0.018U vs PIR at best at 0.021U. I also find it a much nicer product to work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russell griffiths Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 I just did mine in EPS had to use more for the same u value but price was miles better than that overpriced pir stuff. You would probably need 200mm ok if you have the height. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 30 minutes ago, Russell griffiths said: I just did mine in EPS had to use more for the same u value but price was miles better than that overpriced pir stuff. You would probably need 200mm ok if you have the height. 300mm gets you to PH levels so I’m also an advocate of dig a little deeper and fill it up with EPS. PIR is just so much more expensive to get a little thinner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 I think you can drive a Luton type van in a regular license. They are/were around 16cubic meters. Perhaps you can find a big enough van for one trip across the Solent. Van hire can be pretty cheap sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 (edited) This suggests the 7.5 ton van is big enough.. http://www.dontpanicyoureonlymoving.com/the-diy-mover/what-size-van-do-i-need 1200cubic feet is about 33cubic meters. If you don't fancy driving consider looking for a "man with a van" service.? Edited July 23, 2020 by Temp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnb Posted July 25, 2020 Author Share Posted July 25, 2020 On 23/07/2020 at 21:50, Temp said: Perhaps you can find a big enough van for one trip across the Solent I am twisting the arm of a friend who has a horse lorry. It's bigger than a luton van, on a par with the 7.5 tonner, so has a chance of working, albeit doubling the already significant ferry fare. Problem usually is that the constraint isn't usually the volume - I worked out that while a luton transit will hold 18.5 cubic metres, you can't get 18 cubic metres of PIR board in there because the length is less than 4.8 metres and both height and width are less than 2.4 metres so unless you break up the boards you end up with loads of wasted space. The 7.5 tonner (assuming I found accurate dimensions) will take maximum 44 sheets of what I want, with a significant amount of unusable space. Now need to find a 7.5 tonner I can hire over this side. Luckily I do have C1 class on my licence because I'm just old enough to not need a separate test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 Take a saw and straight edge? If you mark both sides of any cuts you can put them back together for minimal gaps later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 (edited) The other possibility would be to contact any removal companies. See if they have anyone moving off the island and offer them a load going the other way? Actually this sounds like an idea for a small business. Must be lots of people crossing with empty or part empty Van's. Perhaps one already exists? Edited July 25, 2020 by Temp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnb Posted July 25, 2020 Author Share Posted July 25, 2020 4 hours ago, Temp said: Actually this sounds like an idea for a small business. It would be if the ferry companies played fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 How can they stop you carrying goods for someone else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 Seconds and co are in Wales. And there is another seconds PIR place next to Cardiff. They got brand new PIR that came out of the factory with minor faults, but still more than suitable to bury in screed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted August 2, 2020 Share Posted August 2, 2020 Have you got a local cavity wall insulation contractor? Can you do your design to use them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnb Posted August 6, 2020 Author Share Posted August 6, 2020 (edited) On 01/08/2020 at 23:25, Patrick said: Seconds and co are in Wales. And there is another seconds PIR place next to Cardiff Hence my original comments about an HGV to Wales! I didn't know about the seconds place near Cardiff. Please could you share the name? On 02/08/2020 at 10:31, Ferdinand said: Have you got a local cavity wall insulation contractor? Probably... No idea if they are all that keenly priced as yet, but there's no problem with designing to use two layers of 75mm or 80mm board. On 26/07/2020 at 10:35, Temp said: How can they stop you carrying goods for someone else? They can't. But they can "blacklist" your vehicle so you can't book the sailings you want. Not that I suspect them of such things, but I have in the past been told there's no capacity to later find the sailing had an empty car deck. Edited August 6, 2020 by dnb lousy spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 https://www.insulationsouthwales.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 Seconds and Co are quite big. Have you asked them how they have handled the IOW before? Do they perhaps have their own contacts? F Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnb Posted August 6, 2020 Author Share Posted August 6, 2020 4 hours ago, Ferdinand said: Have you asked them how they have handled the IOW before? Yes. They don't do ferries, but will ship to one of the terminals. Cost for getting across the water is far more than the diesel to take a vehicle to Wales and back... and has a much reduces chance of boards getting bashed into uselessness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russell griffiths Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 Do you not get like a residents frequent user pass or something. Get it dropped at the port and run over with a big trailer to collect it ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 19 hours ago, dnb said: Hence my original comments about an HGV to Wales! I didn't know about the seconds place near Cardiff. Please could you share the name? A & A Insulation Service Ltd Unit G4, 5 The Willowford, Treforest, Pontypridd CF37 5YL 01443 209585 https://maps.app.goo.gl/U8NUvPn2R1jRg3mB8 I think it's the place. Huge warehouse full of seconds. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADLIan Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 A&A in liquidation. Now morphed into Insulation South Wales with same owner. Draw your own conclusions. Not sure why anyone would use seconds in a floor (or elsewhere) especially in a self build, life time home. Variation in thickness may give voids in a floor system, made worse if used in multiple layers. What if the reason for being second quality is low compressive strength???? Worth noting also that if second quality product it will not be covered by BBA certificate or comply with Relevant BS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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