ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 This inspection chamber will be 1100 mm below the ground level. The I/C base indicates the position of the foul drain for the loo. (Orange elipse) Our shower drain (red elipse) exits the property upstream of the toilet drain. And so, in theory, I should put another I/C there ( green rectangle) because rodding points should be provided at all changes of direction. I'd like to avoid putting another I/C there because I'm going to put a rodding point in at the yellow circle. If I were to follow the letter of the recommendations there would be two access chambers and 1 rodding point within 2 meters. Can putting a rodding point in at the yellow circle be seen as sufficient provision for clearing the drainage system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epsilonGreedy Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 (edited) @PeterWWill provide a definitive answer to your main question. I want to comment on the orientation of your toilet IC, it should be rotated 45 degrees clockwise so the solids follow the main channel through the IC and the shower enters a minor branch. Edited April 23, 2020 by epsilonGreedy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrerahill Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 11 minutes ago, AnonymousBosch said: This inspection chamber will be 1100 mm below the ground level. The I/C base indicates the position of the foul drain for the loo. (Orange elipse) Our shower drain (red elipse) exits the property upstream of the toilet drain. And so, in theory, I should put another I/C there ( green rectangle) because rodding points should be provided at all changes of direction. I'd like to avoid putting another I/C there because I'm going to put a rodding point in at the yellow circle. If I were to follow the letter of the recommendations there would be two access chambers and 1 rodding point within 2 meters. Can putting a rodding point in at the yellow circle be seen as sufficient provision for clearing the drainage system? Could you not use a rest bend on its side or something, rods will easily go around that, it is just your shower so in theory should never block unless it was a backup and then you could always back rod from the IC. I know this is not perhaps by the book, but I see your predicament in filling the place with IC's and rod points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 6 minutes ago, epsilonGreedy said: [...] I want to comment on the orientation of your toilet IC, it should be rotated 45 degrees clockwise so the solids follow the main channel through the IC and the shower enters a minor branch. Right, thanks very much . Appreciate the attention to detail. I'll go and look at that now .... back in a few minnits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 I would dig away a bit more of that "island" of soil between the two exits from the house. Put whatever bend is needed so that the toilet waste goes into the first side branch and the shower waste into the second side branch. Then the rodding point into the straight through connection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrerahill Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 6 minutes ago, AnonymousBosch said: Right, thanks very much . Appreciate the attention to detail. I'll go and look at that now .... back in a few minnits. Long radius bend: https://www.drainageshop.co.uk/110mm-drainage-pipe-fittings/GWPTE320.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 10 minutes ago, ProDave said: [...] Put whatever bend is needed so that the toilet waste goes into the first side branch and the shower waste into the second side branch. Then the rodding point into the straight through connection. My BCO has just this minute agreed that I can put a 135 from the shower outlet into the main run and a rodding point where the yellow dot is. Interestingly she suggested I arrange for the rain 'wash' from the piggery roof be used to help flush the foul drainage line. The roof is very small ( 5 by 1 ) . 27 minutes ago, epsilonGreedy said: [...] I want to comment on the orientation of your toilet IC, it should be rotated 45 degrees clockwise so the solids follow the main channel through the IC and the shower enters a minor branch. Here's a close-up To me it looks OK, but I have been so wrong so often ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 I would have been aiming for the WC straight into the side as you have it pictured, and the shower into the 45 degree outlet to the left of that. Our main stack comes into the side of an identical looking chamber with no issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epsilonGreedy Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, ProDave said: Our main stack comes into the side of an identical looking chamber with no issues. The idea behind my suggestion is that it is better if solids don't splat over the branch change in level and instead slither through the primary channel. I have read this in some docs though the alternative is not doomed to fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, epsilonGreedy said: The idea behind my suggestion is that it is better if solids don't splat over the branch change in level and instead slither through the primary channel. I have read this in some docs though the alternative is not doomed to fail. So how would you do that? You would have to put a bend in to get the WC waste into the end straight through port, then where would the shower go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 1 minute ago, AnonymousBosch said: Interestingly she suggested I arrange for the rain 'wash' from the piggery roof be used to help flush the foul drainage line. The roof is very small ( 5 by 1 ) . That is an interesting thought however I would ensure that it doesn't swamp the treatment plant. It should be ok if it is only a 5sqm roof, even with your wet weather. 9 minutes ago, AnonymousBosch said: Here's a close-up To me it looks OK, but I have been so wrong so often ........... So I wouldn't use the first connection. Dig the IC out so it is further down the trench and come in on the second branch - it is a 45 degree full flow, and doesn't have the kink that the 90 branch has. Then use a 45 degree long radius bend into the second socket. Shower should use a 45 degree bend into a Y branch, then come up to the rodding point from the back end of the Y branch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFDIY Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 I don't see the need for the rodding point. I would put a 45 bend on each side of the main run so that manhole is serving the toilet without the solids having to change direction. The chamber is rotated 45 clockwise as per your photo. Then use the other branch and several 30 degree bends or a swept bend to pick up the shower. All should be rod-able from the chamber that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epsilonGreedy Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 56 minutes ago, ProDave said: So how would you do that? You would have to put a bend in to get the WC waste into the end straight through port, then where would the shower go? Yes to a bend at the main exit. If the main entrance port is 12'o clock then the shower could come in on the 10:30 port. I thought all of this was broadly accepted best practice, maybe I read too many docs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 3 hours ago, PeterW said: [...] I wouldn't use the first connection. Dig the IC out so it is further down the trench and come in on the second branch - it is a 45 degree full flow, and doesn't have the kink that the 90 branch has. [...] Yes, it does have a kink : if I were to use your suggestion, that kink would be in the pipe, a few mm before it gets to the I/C. Wassa diffrunce? Somewhere, at some stage, the flow has to go through a 45 degree turn. Your way involves a good deal of digging in what is now bone-hard clay. After a solid week of digging (more now I come think of it) I've kind of had enough. Mind you, I don't want the good weather to end....... Thanks to @Bob, I have two of those Bend-It-With-Beckham (grey) joints. Any Gottchas using this? I'm using it because the level of the shower outlet is about 40mm higher than the loo outlet. Bummer. ( Oooops ? unintentional malapropism.) Thanks to @Construction Channel for the tip about holding the end of the pipe in place (in his case) bits of rebar. I used a fork to hold the assembly stable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epsilonGreedy Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 23 minutes ago, AnonymousBosch said: Thanks to @Bob, I have two of those Bend-It-With-Beckham (grey) joints. Any Gottchas using this? I'm using it because the level of the shower outlet is about 40mm higher than the loo outlet. Bummer. You would eliminate much of the 40mm if the IC was rotated 45 degrees as suggested. Could it be that your groundwork team anticipated this arrangement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 29 minutes ago, AnonymousBosch said: Thanks to @Bob, I have two of those Bend-It-With-Beckham (grey) joints. Any Gottchas using this? Yes they aren't certified for underground Got an 11 or a 22 lying about..?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 52 minutes ago, PeterW said: Yes they aren't certified for underground Got an 11 or a 22 lying about..?? Oh boogre. 11 or 22 - ah'm ahn it honey, ah'm an it.... if not, lets pray that @Bob has one lying around .... Jamie??? if you are reading this....? Why an 11 or 22? Whassa craik? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 1 hour ago, epsilonGreedy said: You would eliminate much of the 40mm if the IC was rotated 45 degrees as suggested. Could it be that your groundwork team anticipated this arrangement? Can you do a sketch of what you are proposing please as I just can't understand how it can be anything other than how it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 Looks like I'm spending tomorrow digging ........ The peg at the end of the line is about 50mm from the side of the trench. So I need to shave another 80mm off the left hand side - which is a real ball ache because the land drain is about 81mm from the side: in other words, it's going to collapse. kcuf it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, ProDave said: Can you do a sketch of what you are proposing please as I just can't understand how it can be anything other than how it is. I think @epsilonGreedy has implicitly accepted that the I/C is correctly orientated as is.....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 Just now, AnonymousBosch said: Looks like I'm spending tomorrow digging ........ The peg at the end of the line is about 50mm from the side of the trench. So I need to shave another 80mm off the left hand side - which is a real ball ache because the land drain is about 81mm from the side: in other words, it's going to collapse. kcuf it what distance is that ..?? if you use 3m lengths of pipe you can get 75mm movement off centre anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 8002 mm ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 1 minute ago, PeterW said: [...] if you use 3m lengths of pipe you can get 75mm movement off centre anyway. Wot, each section (pipe) ? .... bloody hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 It’s the 2mm that has blown it ... by my calculation you have 209.56mm of wiggle room there ... Carry on..! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 Happy night tonight...... might have a bit of giggle water .... Thanks @PeterW 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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