Front gates...Advice needed.

[Big Jimbo]

When i bought my property, i had an opening from my front garden to my road. A B road 30mph. There was no gate. I made it wider to about 14ft, and did a proper crossover, of the ditch to the highway. I then put up a pair of 5 bar gates. Now i want to put a couple of nice big high gates up. First problem is, who owns the verge/ditch. me or the council. The council dont know, and neither do i. Now if i own the land between me and the road, my gates will be about 5 mt from the tarmac road. If the council own say the first 2 mt of the verge, my gates will be 3mt from the council verge. Looking at the permitted devl rules, if i want to do gates higher than 1 mt adjacent to the highway i will need permission. What i am trying to find out is what will be considered "adjacent" distance wise. I have read an appeal judgement,  where the judge stood on the council land, reached out his arm, and could not touch the gate. he said the tall gates were fine, as they were not adjacent to. Unfortunately, on another appeal, where the gates were set back 4.6 mt the judge ruled that they were adjacent, and therefore needed permission.

I would rather not have to go for permission, as the parish council object to everything, which in turn means that all applications have to go to committee. and takes bloody 6 months.

Anybody got any wise words ?????? Please.

[CC45]

We have just been told we need to go for full planning to put a new entrance in - it can't be done with PD.  Do you know if your entrance has got planning or has it just developed that way?  Highways were able to tell us who owner the verge - they did with us.

[Gone West]

When we were planning our replacement house we had to move our driveway and that was done within our planning application. It required approval from the local Highways Dept. as well as LPA.

[Onoff]

30 minutes ago, PeterStarck said:

Highway

 

Your road...a highway! ?

[Ferdinand]

On 18/04/2020 at 14:03, Big Jimbo said:

When i bought my property, i had an opening from my front garden to my road. A B road 30mph. There was no gate. I made it wider to about 14ft, and did a proper crossover, of the ditch to the highway. I then put up a pair of 5 bar gates. Now i want to put a couple of nice big high gates up. First problem is, who owns the verge/ditch. me or the council. The council dont know, and neither do i. Now if i own the land between me and the road, my gates will be about 5 mt from the tarmac road. If the council own say the first 2 mt of the verge, my gates will be 3mt from the council verge. Looking at the permitted devl rules, if i want to do gates higher than 1 mt adjacent to the highway i will need permission. What i am trying to find out is what will be considered "adjacent" distance wise. I have read an appeal judgement,  where the judge stood on the council land, reached out his arm, and could not touch the gate. he said the tall gates were fine, as they were not adjacent to. Unfortunately, on another appeal, where the gates were set back 4.6 mt the judge ruled that they were adjacent, and therefore needed permission.

I would rather not have to go for permission, as the parish council object to everything, which in turn means that all applications have to go to committee. and takes bloody 6 months.

Anybody got any wise words ?????? Please.

 

Is there any indication of land you own on the plans in your Land Registry docs?

 

Sometimes these are to the road centre.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Ferdinand

[Big Jimbo]

2 hours ago, CC45 said:

We have just been told we need to go for full planning to put a new entrance in - it can't be done with PD.  Do you know if your entrance has got planning or has it just developed that way?  Highways were able to tell us who owner the verge - they did with us.

I don't intend putting a new entrance in. The entrance is already there. Highways, don't have a clue what they own unfortunately.

[Big Jimbo]

1 hour ago, PeterStarck said:

When we were planning our replacement house we had to move our driveway and that was done within our planning application. It required approval from the local Highways Dept. as well as LPA.

Drive not moving Peter. I just want to put in taller gates.

[Big Jimbo]

9 minutes ago, Ferdinand said:

 

Is there any indication of land you own on the plans in your Land Registry docs?

 

Sometimes these are to the road centre.

No indication Ferd. unfortunately, the council don't know. It is a tarmac B road. They don't know if they own just to the edge of the tarmac, or also a portion of the verge.

[CC45]

so if they don't know either way what about writing to them stating what you are about to do and requesting a response from them either way?

[Big Jimbo]

1 minute ago, CC45 said:

so if they don't know either way what about writing to them stating what you are about to do and requesting a response from them either way?

They just don't respond.  Perhaps i should write again, but even if they do respond it will simply be "Needs permission, which due to the wankers on the P.C. will take forever. They are the worst council i have ever had to deal with.

[Ferdinand]

3 minutes ago, Big Jimbo said:

They just don't respond.  Perhaps i should write again, but even if they do respond it will simply be "Needs permission, which due to the wankers on the P.C. will take forever. They are the worst council i have ever had to deal with.

 

JFDI is tempting.

[joe90]

This was part of my planning fiasco with the planners, upshot is the verge is classed as “pedestrian” and historically was used fir horses. Your boundary will be the fence, ditch or hedge. There is a min distance from gate to roadside to enable you to stop your car off the road to open your gate, if your gates are that far back then visibility will not be an issue. Personally I would “crack on” as no one seems to notice (unless you have a stroppy neighbour like I had) but I still won my case at appeal and the planners and neighbour were told I was within my rights ?

[Big Jimbo]

22 minutes ago, joe90 said:

This was part of my planning fiasco with the planners, upshot is the verge is classed as “pedestrian” and historically was used fir horses. Your boundary will be the fence, ditch or hedge. There is a min distance from gate to roadside to enable you to stop your car off the road to open your gate, if your gates are that far back then visibility will not be an issue. Personally I would “crack on” as no one seems to notice (unless you have a stroppy neighbour like I had) but I still won my case at appeal and the planners and neighbour were told I was within my rights ?

As you said Joe. Nobody can actually walk down the grass verge, because in effect it is a ditch. If i set my gates back, say 6mt to allow for a large car to completly pull off the tarmac onto the drive, i won't be blocking the visibility of any cars coming up or down the road, and any walkers have to walk on the tarmac, so i would'nt be blocking them either. The crossover is already there. For me it's all about putting in a set of gates above 1mt high to stop all the nosey sods walking past looking in.

[joe90]

@Big Jimbo    IMO there is nothing stopping you, crack on mate ?

[Big Jimbo]

So I made some gates. That should stop all the people walking passed having to watch me in my pants, scratching my bits, having a fag outdoors. I'm pleased with them 16ft wide. 

[Mr Punter]

Nice.  Tell more.  Did you make them?  Are they automated?  They look like sliding but I can't work out which way.  Pics during construction may be good.

[Big Jimbo]

14 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

Nice.  Tell more.  Did you make them?  Are they automated?  They look like sliding but I can't work out which way.  Pics during construction may be good.

Yeah, I made them. 8 ft wide each, then joined them with metalwork at the top and bottom. Too heavy to lift as 1 gate. So it is now 1gate 16ft wide. Made it sliding, and stuck a grands worth of c20 concrete in the ground to take the sliding track, and to act as a super strong crossover for big lorries etc. Bought the motor from Italy, and welded up the stop catches etc from scrap. 

[Onoff]

Looks terrific.

 

Have you got contact strips on the gate or just photo cells?

 

I'll have at least 3 pairs of photo cells (3 beams) and will add contact strips.

 

Did you buy a sliding gate kit & what make? 1000kg one is it as that gate looks huge and heavy?

 

(I like gate details).

 

Also looking to make a simple loop detector circuit.

[Big Jimbo]

12 minutes ago, Onoff said:

Looks terrific.

 

Have you got contact strips on the gate or just photo cells?

 

I'll have at least 3 pairs of photo cells (3 beams) and will add contact strips.

 

Did you buy a sliding gate kit & what make? 1000kg one is it as that gate looks huge and heavy?

 

(I like gate details).

 

Also looking to make a simple loop detector circuit.

At the moment i just have photo cells, and a flashing light. The motor is from Italy. (Actually made in italy) The company is called Oxygen. Its a 2000kg motor. The gate is bloody huge and heavy. I bought four wheels, and a track from Rolling centre, I am going to make a loop detector, and i plan on adding an edge contact strip. (Better not kill anybody) I'm a right tight sod, and my only mistake was getting a video door entry, with keypad, and rfids from China. £69...I got the Key unlock from inside to work, but can't get the rfids to work or the number pad. The video works great.  Im rubbish with tecno, but the entry systems from brit companies were about a grand, so i though for £69 squid i'd give it a go.

[Taff]

On 29/04/2020 at 14:22, joe90 said:

This was part of my planning fiasco with the planners, upshot is the verge is classed as “pedestrian” and historically was used fir horses. Your boundary will be the fence, ditch or hedge. There is a min distance from gate to roadside to enable you to stop your car off the road to open your gate, if your gates are that far back then visibility will not be an issue. Personally I would “crack on” as no one seems to notice (unless you have a stroppy neighbour like I had) but I still won my case at appeal and the planners and neighbour were told I was within my rights ?

Totally agree

[Onoff]

@Big Jimbo, got my kit from EasyGates, 500KG motor is by Chamberlain LiftMaster. Track from Barrier Components in Purfleet. Tbh I think all my gear is in fact Italian. Made the gate & frame and built the brick pillars. 

 

I really didn't like the idea of looking at the big flashing orange strobe, like a council gritter! 

 

My lad's just 3D printed an insert so I can mount it near flush.

 

 

 

It'll get sprayed black to match the trim of the brick lights below. 

 

 

My video doorbell is something equally obscure as yours sounds! Made by the Kyoto Dangerous Toy & Lawnmower Company I think. Trialled it the other day with 45m of Cat-6 and it worked fine tbh. Comes with a 7" indoor touchscreen.

 

[Big Jimbo]

4 minutes ago, Onoff said:

@Big Jimbo, got my kit from EasyGates, 500KG motor is by Chamberlain LiftMaster. Track from Barrier Components in Purfleet. Tbh I think all my gear is in fact Italian. Made the gate & frame and built the brick pillars. 

 

I really didn't like the idea of looking at the big flashing orange strobe, like a council gritter! 

 

My lad's just 3D printed an insert so I can mount it near flush.

 

 

 

It'll get sprayed black to match the trim of the brick lights below. 

 

 

My video doorbell is something equally obscure as yours sounds! Made by the Kyoto Dangerous Toy & Lawnmower Company I think. Trialled it the other day with 45m of Cat-6 and it worked fine tbh. Comes with a 7" indoor touchscreen.

 

Love your recessed light. That looks fab. I hate mine. I'll have to bite the bullit and get a decent door entry video thingy. They just seem to cost so much from Brit suppliers, and they are all prob made in China.

[Onoff]

6 minutes ago, Big Jimbo said:

Love your recessed light. That looks fab. I hate mine. I'll have to bite the bullit and get a decent door entry video thingy. They just seem to cost so much from Brit suppliers, and they are all prob made in China.

 

1080P apparently is my one. Must mean something different in China! ?

[PeterW]

1 hour ago, Big Jimbo said:

Love your recessed light. That looks fab. I hate mine. I'll have to bite the bullit and get a decent door entry video thingy. They just seem to cost so much from Brit suppliers, and they are all prob made in China.

keep an eye out for Videx stuff on eBay. It’s eye watering new but is really well made. I picked up a returned unit with a damaged internal phone for £75, and then got two new phones from eBay for £20. Total cost of all the bits would have been £7-800 at normal prices. 

[Onoff]

@Big Jimbo This is the loop detector circuit I'm  going to have a go at. Going to order the components now and stuff to make the pcb (probably from Cricklewood Electronics). Haven't made a pcb in years! Hope my UV box still works!

 

http://chemelec.com/Projects/Loop-Detector-1/Loop-Detector.htm