Basic cement/ ballast Q

[Ferdinand]

13 hours ago, zoothorn said:

 

What about longevity of these 6x6's though.. extremely wet climate here/ almost rainforest tbh. I think that's maybe why my pro chap recommended sleepers, tho can't imagine he'd be thinking reclaimed type as they look alot trickier to bracket in with uneven ends.

 

Q understood: erm.. not sure bolts or notches: what would you recommend?

 

The important thing for fencepost longevity is that it does not have its feet in water, eg if put straight into concrete. Or, if it does, then you need good posts.

 

The easy way is to make sure that your posts are on top of your concrete footings out of the ground.

 

OTOH some of the wooden underpinnings of seaside piers last more than a century. 

 

Ferdinand

 

Edited September 13, 2019 by Ferdinand

[Ferdinand]

In your circumstances I might decide to put Adjustable Support Pads beneath the supporting points so it can be adjusted later, as I had to do with my shed due to soft ground.

 

 

 

Edited September 13, 2019 by Ferdinand

[Onoff]

More playing! Excuse the dog rough video capture, if you call it that, I just did a free orbit and videoed it on the phone!

 

Reds are notched 6x6. Yellow and blue again 6x2 doubled up on the long sides. (Blues gets screwed to reds, blues to greens, yellows to blues, magenta bits finish off the ends).

 

Magenta, front and back are 6x2s. White noggins down the centre. From back to front all joists at 400mm centres. Noggin not shown at the front will be longer or play with the centres to even them all up.

 

Deck only cantilevered about 645mm as is. Doesn't seem wide enough. How much more can it safely go reliant on those doubled up 6x2s at the end, I don't know?

 

Back corner sits on a 65mm engineering brick or bricks.

 

 

Edited September 13, 2019 by Onoff

[Onoff]

8 minutes ago, Ferdinand said:

In your circumstances I might decide to put Adjustable Support Pads beneath the supporting points so it can be adjusted later, as I had to do with my shed due to soft ground.

 

 

 

 

I'd just jack 'n pack one corner at a time if required.

[zoothorn]

On 13/09/2019 at 06:20, Onoff said:

 

I'd just jack 'n pack one corner at a time if required.

 

Hi Onoff-  how supercool is that!! man it even goes upside down. Major thanks for that.

 

I get the idea- I'll go with the nothched 6x6's, & doubling up 6x2's (for all four cabin perimeter walls though?), & understand the brick: I'd prefer to get this to something 2cm H though: water would never be standing on the plinthfs @ only 2ft dia & no lip.. it just can't pool here, it'll pour off before 0.5cm surely even in monsoon.

 

The cantilevered area: my pro chap says 20% safe rule of thumb (his work/ he knows etc). In which case 60cm. But the side roof eaves would be diggin in your ears/ face.. so I'd need 1m min on the cabin side/ next to stream side. Mmm. So now I'm thinking its surely more sensible to put this overhang -forward- at the door end instead, as I'll have to have a decky-area here (& steps of somesort up too).

 

Its then either a Q of going with the cantilevered idea for this front-deck area, stretching it to 1.5m & supporting the front 2 corner points with 4" pillars (just a guess).. or.. construct a front-deck afterwards as a stand-alone thing.

 

One odd result of either going with or without the orig side walky-bit.. is the front of cabin will be quite a height off slope in front, which needs to be all or mostly 'hidden', obviously by a series of steps up to front &/ or front-decky thing.

 

 

Edited September 14, 2019 by zoothorn

[Onoff]

Honestly my "animation" is crap, a bodge if you like. I did two years C&G CAD but then started the 3rd year animation course but never finished.....I was simply never there as work took precedence.

 

2cm??? Its your shed not mine. Nothing to do with pooling but water splashing up. 

 

Those recycled rubber pads at 5cm high that @PeterW linked looked good if you're intent on going that low. You'd have to notch the timber if you doubled up the front and back beams.

 

Might have another play on CAD later. Was going to show some diagonal supports off the front legs.

 

Isn't 20% cantilever here only 500mm here? As in 20% and your bases are at 2.5m centres?

 

With only a small deck at the front then how about:

 

Double doors overlooking the stream. You could site your chair(s) inside the  cabin a bit, feet out on the deck. 

[zoothorn]

On 13/09/2019 at 06:11, Ferdinand said:

In your circumstances I might decide to put Adjustable Support Pads beneath the supporting points so it can be adjusted later, as I had to do with my shed due to soft ground.

 

 

 

 

HiFerdinand- but the idea of going OTT heavy duty on the footings, is to prevent any movement so as not ever to need jacking up. Id not factored this in.

 

What this does give me as in idea thogh, is to use 2 of those black placcy cabin base 'shoe' things to just lift these two beams off my plinths upper-side. But I need to fix the beam > to shoe > then shoe to the concrete. I must have a very strong join here too: the cabin is a typical design with a front overhang/ extended roof -exactly- where you'd not want to regarding weather/ wind hitting it front-on, & horizontally too.

[PeterW]

58 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

The cantilevered area: my pro chap says 20% safe rule of thumb (his work/ he knows etc). In which case 60cm. But the side roof eaves would be diggin in your ears/ face.. so I'd need 1m min on the cabin side/ next to stream side.

 

Not sure on his logic here ..!! Running that though beamcalc, and my rough numbers show you need a dynamic load on the outer edge of the deck of about 450kg to get anything like a deflection of more than 5mm - that’s 5 people ... all sat on the edge ....

 

60cm without any weight on the other side I would go with, but you’re putting a 5-700kg shed on the other side ..!! If you really want to use the @Onoff School of (over)Engineering then use a doubled up 6x2 at each side, but for me I would be more inclined  to  just go with a 6x2 each side and then span across with 6x2 at 400mm centres. 

 

[Declan52]

Don't forget that if you put a diagonal from the cantilever edge to the post then your beefing up an already very strong beam so going out 1m is well within its capacity.

[zoothorn]

@Onoff ok understand the splash up.. but you see I'm high as it is (cabin front will be way off ground) so need this packing as minimal as possible: even if I wrapped the cnr beam join are with dpm or something.

 

No the stream side you see is definitely the cabin's RHS side: over stream here is n'bors (only yds away) & dark with no view. Front as originally intended will 1) be facing down long thin gdn to main house/ symmetry etc, 2) view, & 3) most importantly: its facing south.

[Onoff]

Is the balcony/ cantilever going stream side or not?

[PeterW]

1 hour ago, Onoff said:

Is the balcony/ cantilever going stream side or not?

 

God knows as I’m as confused as you now ..!!

 

@zoothorn can you draw a simple plan with stream, cabin and a direction arrow please ..?

[Onoff]

And what side is the planned entrance door, in the face away from the stream or one of the sides?

[zoothorn]

Hi chaps- took wknd away/ just seen replies. Sorry for confusion. I add my sketch again. Beam numbers 1,2,3,4.

 

The idea has been the cantilevered +20% or so walky area to be added RHS @ lower two pillars' side. This was/ & always will be the RHS -side- of cabin, next to & parallel to stream below.

 

But the front of cabin, door  etc(facing down gdn to house) then has no terrace/ balcony. As I'll obviously need a front terrace area (I cant just step out of door ~4ft splat) should the added walky cantilevered section instead go on the FRONT I'm wondering now? (IE extending beams 3 & 4 forwards, instead of extending beams 1 & 2 twds rhs as per the orig sketch below).

 

Beam 2 is always the cabin FRONT. Beam 4 is always the cabin RHS. In the orig sketch below I have a drop outside my door (where my '2' is scribbled) onto the 45* slope.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Onoff]

Can you do a plan?

[zoothorn]

10 minutes ago, Onoff said:

Can you do a plan?

 

Yes.. but takes me hours! I can't do super quick like you (I wish).. need 4x draughts/ then slr batts ages to charge etc.

[Declan52]

Just draw it out with a pencil and a ruler and take a pic with your phone and post it. We are not looking a work of art just a bit of a better idea on how you intend it to look so we can help you get there a bit easier. 

[zoothorn]

2 hours ago, Declan52 said:

Just draw it out with a pencil and a ruler and take a pic with your phone and post it. We are not looking a work of art just a bit of a better idea on how you intend it to look so we can help you get there a bit easier. 

 

B but thats what I do! takes me hours to draw & photo it (dont have phone w'pics, only an sLr you see/ faff).

 

Ok for the mo, let's just say I build a square 2.3m frame > cabin on. I'm standing down gdn looking at front/ door of it. I have 2 plinths in front of me: the LHS on's on the upper slope, RHS one's on the down slope, ~1m pillar. So I have a L>R  ground discrepency of ALOT.

 

I need to have a decking area in front of the thing (or I open door & fall out, hit slope & roll down R into stream crying, & I shouldnt wonder if my trousers dont fall down as well). I need 1.2m deck here min. Do I add as an -afterthought- IE build it separately later? (& should I even add this side walky area into the mix? is a separate Q) or add the walky extra area to the --front-- instead of the RHS?

 

Does that help for now?

[Declan52]

Is this what u have in mind????

[zoothorn]

@De

2 hours ago, Declan52 said:

 

 

Hi Declan- bingo that's it.. even window's correct LHS (stream is opposite, RHS, & n'bors too). Very grateful for that.

 

Ok this green front area is what I'm considering at the mo: I'm obviously gonna need a deck here. I have 3 options afaict.

 

1) Swizzle the cantilever area round to the frontside forming my front deck/ not sticky-outy out RHS.

2) Keep cantilevered walky bit as planned (on RHS, orig idea).. & build a separate front deck later.

3) Ditch the cantilever altogether, make a 2.3m square base.. & build separate front deck later.

 

 

[zoothorn]

forget this post..

 

 

 

Edited September 16, 2019 by zoothorn

[Declan52]

Option 2.

Build the deck and put the shed on. This will give you the door position. Then you can use 2 3*3/4*4fence posts to give you both something for the deck to attach on plus will give you enough height to let you form some sort of bannister to stop you falling into the stream. Dig 2 holes drop the posts in and put a bag of postcrete into each hole with some water. Plumb the posts and leave to set.

So it will look like this.

[Declan52]

Or you could really go to town and have an overhang on both sides so you can walk round to your seating area without going into the cabin. This will be the more expensive option as not only will the timber joists need to be longer but you will need more of whatever you where going to use as a barrier to stop kids falling into the stream. 

[zoothorn]

@Declan52 yes I think 2. But you see if I leave the cantilevered area RHS too, I'll need access to it.. so its got to protrude forwards, & join the front "green area" deck somehow. This is the problem with 2.

 

This is why you see I'm thinking the RHS walky area is actually problematic (unuseable as it is?), &, the obvious thing if I'm ditching it RHS.. is instead to have it coming out frontwards.

[ProDave]

You are over thinking it.

 

Buy a standard garden cabin, the type that has double doors and iondows opening out onto a veranda that is on the cantilevered bit out over the stream. Lovely place to sit and enjoy the view etc.

 

Then as a means to get into the building, cut another opening in the back and have a door in from the back of the cabin where it is high up level with the grass.