Water coming in!

[makie]

39 minutes ago, Cpd said:

Strange as it worked very well on a slate roof of a friend . I can’t see how it can be bad in all cases as I have seen  it done and it worked with no detrimental effect to the roof..... in fact the roof stopped leaking and looked great as well ! 

 

Slate may withstand it better than concrete tiles but if there is any slight issues on any part of the slates/tiles it will break them.

I actually get a decent amount of work out of fixing roofs that have been power-washed and painted.

[Jeremy Harris]

On 20/07/2019 at 19:47, Onoff said:

 

This stuff?

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Copper-Sulphate-QUALITY-PRODUCT-FREE-POSTAGE-HDPE-BOTTLE-CRYSTALS/132871662790?var=432170982709&hash=item1eefc4acc6:m:m1EXirEUWvNsQsfW_aQcw0Q

 

or

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1-5kg-Copper-Sulphate-QUALITY-PRODUCT-FREE-POST-HDPE-COURIER-CuSo4-5H2O/132525074063?hash=item1edb1c268f:g:SckAAOSw74FamqPU

 

What ratio to water?

 

Cheers

 

Yes, that's the stuff, but this is better value (get 2kg for £15): https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Copper-Sulphate-Pentahydrate-100g-2-kg-Highest-Purity-FREE-Shipping/121201879010?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3D2743c344f72e4d7f8a5e0d0215d0e711%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D15%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D132871662790%26itm%3D121201879010%26pg%3D2481888&_trksid=p2481888.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3A23641b43-ab2a-11e9-a68e-74dbd1807028|parentrq%3A10fffef016c0ad31c39e3de0ff51a202|iid%3A1.  It dissolves at a ratio of about 20g/100ml of water at 20 deg C, so roughly 1kg - 5 litres of saturated solution.  Takes around a week to two weeks to work when killing live moss.  Also works to kill moss on lawns without killing the grass (but may need dilution - test a small area first).

Edited July 29, 2019 by JSHarris
corrected errant "2" that had crept in

[Onoff]

8 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

 

Yes, that's the stuff, but this is better value (get 2kg for £15).  It dissolves at a ratio of about 20g/100ml of water at 20 deg C, so roughly 1kg - 25 litres of saturated solution.  Takes around a week to two weeks to work when killing live moss.  Also works to kill moss on lawns without killing the grass (but may need dilution - test a small area first).

 

Got a link to the 2kg for £15?

 

Ta.

Edited July 20, 2019 by Onoff

[Jeremy Harris]

5 minutes ago, Onoff said:

 

Got a link to the 2kg for £15?

 

Ta.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Copper-Sulphate-Pentahydrate-100g-2-kg-Highest-Purity-FREE-Shipping/121201879010?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3D2743c344f72e4d7f8a5e0d0215d0e711%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D15%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D132871662790%26itm%3D121201879010%26pg%3D2481888&_trksid=p2481888.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3A23641b43-ab2a-11e9-a68e-74dbd1807028|parentrq%3A10fffef016c0ad31c39e3de0ff51a202|iid%3A1

[Temp]

I'll be surprised if the moss is the cause. 

[Ferdinand]

My chosen weapon for physically removing moss is a gutter brush on a 2x extension pole. No idea where it came from ... parents saw one in a shop once and swooped. It only extends to about 12ft, but that makes 18-20 with me. Should be easy to find online. I did a high bungalow roof with this before selling it.

 

The problem I have now is that I have one storey of wall, then about 7m of roof above that .. which is too much for the brush. So it will be the idea below when I next do it.

 

 

For the ‘spray with copper sulphate and leave to die for a couple of months’ option I would look for a traditional fruit tree sprayer, which will do anything between 2m and perhaps 5m plus you.

 

Or for more fun get hold of a water soaker of the bicycle pump type, which you can make yourself for tuppence

https://www.instructables.com/id/5-Water-Guns/

 

Or buy one for about £3.

 

They will have a 10m range, get a bucket of CuSO4 solution, and Robert is your relation. Maybe. Just practice frost with water so you do not go over the whole house and kill next door’s cabbages.

 

I got one from the pound shop a couple of years ago which had enough range to discourage the cats and squirrels on my front wall from the front porch and protecting the nesting birds a little.

 

Ferdinand

 

 

 

 

Edited July 21, 2019 by Ferdinand

[Onoff]

I'm going to try the copper sulphate trick on my parent's moss covered concrete patio. If nothing else to mitigate the slip risk.

[Declan52]

Is the wet patch on the actual dormer or under the tiles on the main roof. 

[Simplysimon]

21 hours ago, makie said:

 

Slate may withstand it better than concrete tiles but if there is any slight issues on any part of the slates/tiles it will break them.

I actually get a decent amount of work out of fixing roofs that have been power-washed and painted.

that'll be the boys who power wash upwards and paint to 'protect' it, a few hundred in the back pocket and 'thank you ma'am'

[makie]

35 minutes ago, Simplysimon said:

that'll be the boys who power wash upwards and paint to 'protect' it, a few hundred in the back pocket and 'thank you ma'am'

 

Few hundred? Some of these guys charge just less than I would to completely renew the roof.
 

Any tile manufacturer will strongly advise against power-washing tiles in any way as it can damage them.

[Jeremy Harris]

9 hours ago, Onoff said:

I'm going to try the copper sulphate trick on my parent's moss covered concrete patio. If nothing else to mitigate the slip risk.

 

It should work well to kill off moss and lichen on concrete, but there may be a slight blue stain initially.  The stain should fade away after a week or two though.

[Onoff]

1 hour ago, JSHarris said:

 

It should work well to kill off moss and lichen on concrete, but there may be a slight blue stain initially.  The stain should fade away after a week or two though.

 

2kg ordered thanks.

[EverHopefull]

As an update I managed to clear 90% of the moss using a combo of ladders and skirting board with a long length a bamboo screwed to it. A bit like dentistry from afar but after the momentus thunder storm overnight I ventured I to the roof space with a torch at 2am and everything was dry as a bone. Bucket still cobwebs, not a drop in it. So moral of the story is get rid of the moss if you can! 

Copper idea is one I may try tho to keep it at bay in future. 

Cheers for all the advice as ever! 

[daiking]

Pretty much 48 hours of heavy rain has revealed a similar leak for me around the junction of the chimney and the roof.

 

I'm going to need a professional ladder climber and he/she knows anything about roofs, that would be a bonus.

 

I don't think moss is the issue in this instance but that has been useful to note as my lean to roof appears to be at risk of moss problems.

[EverHopefull]

It can work in both your favour and against you. My conservatory roof has become more water tight with the increase of moss, opposite of the tiled house roof! ?

There was nothing visible lifting the flashing so I am having to assume that the moss was causing some damming of the rainfall sending it sideways and under the flashing. More days of heavy rainfall and bone dry in the original loft zone. 

[Onoff]

On 20/07/2019 at 21:12, JSHarris said:

It dissolves at a ratio of about 20g/100ml of water at 20 deg C, so roughly 1kg - 25 litres of saturated solution.  

 

Just gone to make this up. Are those ratios correct?

 

If it's 20g to 100ml then isn't it 200g/1000ml, 1000g/5000ml.

 

Cheers

 

[Jeremy Harris]

13 minutes ago, Onoff said:

 

Just gone to make this up. Are those ratios correct?

 

If it's 20g to 100ml then isn't it 200g/1000ml, 1000g/5000ml.

 

Cheers

 

 

Yes, looks like more finger trouble...  Not sure how the "2" ended up in front of the "5", I'll edit it.

[Onoff]

32 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

 

Yes, looks like more finger trouble...  Not sure how the "2" ended up in front of the "5", I'll edit it.

 

Ta. Any precautions with this stuff. Doesn't exactly look benign according to the safety data sheet! A little concerned too as to the effects on wildlife if it runs off onto the garden:

 

75448.pdf

 

 

[Jeremy Harris]

5 minutes ago, Onoff said:

 

Ta. Any precautions with this stuff. Doesn't exactly look benign according to the safety data sheet! A little concerned too as to the effects on wildlife if it runs off onto the garden:

 

75448.pdf 107.75 kB · 0 downloads

 

 

 

Best not get it on your skin, and definitely try and keep it away from streams and ponds, but other than that it's not too bad.  It's been used for many years as a fungicide on plants.  I believe it's also been used as a fertiliser, too, but I'm not quite sure how that works, just from the chemistry.  Probably not a good idea to spray it near pets or other animals, but it seems fine once it's dried on the roof.

[Ferdinand]

I have my moss control weapon of choice. £1.29 from Home Bargains.

 

 

Range is about 12-13m on the flat, and it will reach the top of my roof.

 

One squirt is about a pint, so Jeremy’s 2kg of CuSO4 should do it for starters. Though 15 for 2kg is galling when one can get 25kg for either £50 or £75.

 

Then I need a calm day and some careful and delicate aiming.

 

F

 

 

Edited July 31, 2019 by Ferdinand

[Ferdinand]

OK.My Copper Sulphate Pentahydride has arrived from the @JSHarris link.

 

Just a few checks.

 

Precautions:

 

Obvs disconnect any connected water butts, used for the garden, where some may end up.

Great care required to avoid contact with water courses / ponds - bad for water plants.

Presumably keep the amount going into soakaways as little as possible.

 

Questions:

 

Are there any sensible limits that should be adhered to? Can I use say 500g-1kg at one session, without undue risk?

 

Does this stuff do any damage to reed bed and treatment plant systems? I can see some reaching reed beds, as iirc they are used for surface and grey water, but treatment plants generally are not? (I am on soakways or main drains) but it may affect others.

 

Do I need to keep a separate set of buckets etc for this, or can I simply wash down afterwards?

 

Tangent

 

I ran across Tribasic Copper Sulfate, which I think is the normal version with a different label. The Soil Association approve it for organics at 6kg of copper per Ha per annum, or up to 5 years worth in one go for a perennial crop.

 

Ferdinand

Edited August 16, 2019 by Ferdinand

[Jeremy Harris]

The stuff is readily soluble in water, so washes away fairly readily. 

 

It may stain stuff blue for a time, but this will usually fade/wash away with time.  When diluted by rainwater etc it's very unlikely to remain at a concentration that will cause harm, other than to fungal growth.

 

6kg of copper = 24kg of copper sulphate, and I believe the Soil Association have allowed the use of copper sulphate solution for dealing with fungal disease in crops for some time, which is a reasonably good indicator that it's fairly safe to use.

 

 

[Ferdinand]

OK.

 

I made up my first 3l of solution with 500g of CuSO4, and it seems to have semi done about 1/3 of my roof (3 sections this is trial), plus 1l extra water to soak up the undissolved CuSO4.

 

So I am estimating perhaps 3-5kg to do it all row by row which may be good for the first application.

 

3-4 l was about 15 squirts with the squirter.

 

The blue stain looks distinctly useful in detecting what has been covered. next time I will probably try after rain whilst it is still damp, as the solution dried very quickly done this way. It reached beneath the solar panels relatively easily.

 

Now to wait a week or two. All comments welcome.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 17, 2019 by Ferdinand

[daiking]

Didn’t have any Cu sulphate so when I was up near the roof yesterday I sprayed some generic roundup as far as I could reach. 
 

Will this be any use?

 

(there does seem to be a lot of moss around the east facing, out of the sun most of the day, ground floor veluxes)

[Ferdinand]

On 04/11/2019 at 13:53, daiking said:

Didn’t have any Cu sulphate so when I was up near the roof yesterday I sprayed some generic roundup as far as I could reach. 
 

Will this be any use?

 

(there does seem to be a lot of moss around the east facing, out of the sun most of the day, ground floor veluxes)

 

Suspect not I'm afraid.

 

AFAIK Glyphosate does not work on moss. 

https://homeguides.sfgate.com/roundup-safe-moss-103841.html

 

And I'd say be very careful indeed where the runoff goes.

 

Glyphosate is delivered via water solution, and you could end up with water butts full of dilute glypohosate if you left them connected. Don't water the leaves of anything with it ! If you did let it reach your butt I'd run it off into the ground or drains at once. I would forget and use it by mistake next week.

 

Edited September 13, 2020 by Ferdinand