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vivienz

Entry posted by vivienz

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A boring title, I know, but it's succinct and to the point.

 

I find it hard to get excited about windows, to be honest, which has surprised me given how much they cost but slogging through different window systems and deciding what's best hasn't been the most fun thing to do.  I guess one aspect that takes any joy out of the process is the lack of uniformity in windows where each company does their own thing and has their own systems which, I'm sure, are terribly important to them and they believe gives them their USPs.  From my point of view, too much choice isn't necessarily a good thing and it just makes it impossible to do a direct comparison between window companies.  But then, you all knew that already, didn't you?!  There's certainly been enough discussion about it.

 

My process for choosing the window supplier was unscientific (apologies Jeremy) and lacking in rigour (apologies everyone) but it worked for me.  I contacted 5 companies, Rationel, Ecohaus Internorm, Norrsken, Velfac and Katzenbeck.  4 replied, I never got anything back from Katzenbeck.  I sent out our planning permission drawings with floorplans and elevations and described the kind of windows I wanted.  Rationel weren't able to do what I wanted with the sliding doors on the ground floor, (a 2 part slider with mullions to make it look as though there are 4 panels) so that didn't go any further after the initial quote.  Velfac sent me a quote, but didn't quote on exactly what I'd asked for, including the sliding doors, but I sort of kept the quote in play just to get a feel for their prices.  I was a little wary of their attention to detail because I'd also specified 3G with no trickle vents and their first quote was for 2G with vents.  Hmm.  Ecohaus were outrageously expensive.  A nice product, sure, but really expensive at £65k with fitting.  That leaves me with Norrsken, and they're my final choice.

 

I've settled on Norrsken for a few reasons, not just the price although that heavily influenced me, of course.  I've got about 37m2 of triple glazing and it's coming in at about £35k, with another £8k for fitting.  So far, Norrsken have been a pleasure to deal with - not slippery or patronising in any way and very straightforward.  They also have their own in-house installation team; I can't comment on them as yet apart from saying that the installations manager came across as well as their sales guy.  I'll mention the quote from Velfac here, as it came in about £1500 less than Norrsken, but they are supply only and so I'd have to go and find an installations team that would be able to work with MBC and get the fitting right in those super thick walls.  Norrsken have worked with MBC a few times and are familiar with fitting the windows into a passive house; I'm sure that there are plenty of good installers out there but, as is often commented on here, locating them and hiring them is the tricky part.  Also, because Norrsken offer a supply and fit package, they can do this with zero VAT which means I don't have to bother with a reclaim on a hefty chunk of spending.

 

As for the windows themselves, well, they look nice, they are triple glazed, they open how I want them to and I can have them in the colours I want.  I did say it was unscientific.  No doubt I could go into far more detailed research but that lot is good enough for me.

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Plumbersmateuk

For me, my biggest gripe before contacting the companies is the quality of the web sites.

To much glitz and glamour and not enough informatioon on the actual products.

I have a clear picture of what I want so I could dismiss a lot of the companies straight away if thay had more relevant product info.

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IanR

I really liked the Norrsken product, and the company seemed pretty good too.

 

But "Wowza", those prices are much more than I was quoted July 2015. Including fitting, you've been quoted £1,228/m2 for Norrsken and £1,911/m2 for Internorm.

 

In July 2015 Norrsken quoted me just under £500/m2 (and then offered another 10% off when I called them to say I was going with Internorm) for 3G Alu-clad pine. For the same spec I got Internorm down to £440/m2,  although I upped the spec in the end and paid just under £500/m2.

 

In my favour, all my windows are made up of units that are neither particularly large or small so it was quite an efficient way of buying the glass. 

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vivienz

I've got a lot of large windows and one that runs the entire height of the building following the rise of the stairs up to the roof, so not much in the way of smaller, very standard windows.  It's quite a commitment signing up for the glazing, but I don't think I could have retained the design ideas that we wanted and got the glazing for much less.  I'd love to be able to pay less, but I don't think I can do much to change that in the current market.

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IanR

I've just looked at the rendering of your house on your profile and your window sizing is similar to mine, large openings made up of smaller sashes. ie. I have a few 5m wide windows by either 2.1m high or 4.2m high, but they're built from five 2.1m x 1.0m sashes which costs a lot less than trying to make it in a single 2.1m x 5m sash.

 

The pound has devalued since I bought mine, but that shouldn't have added more than 20% to the price.

 

Have you gone with any integrated blinds on the Norrsken windows, I know that added a lot to the price. It was much cheaper to go with external blinds.

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vivienz

Interesting, thanks Ian. I will look at the figures more closely over the weekend.

I haven't gone with integrated blinds; I looked at them when I was talking to internorm and the price was really high, far more than I felt was justified.

I have to go back to norrsken to finalise the order and haven't paid the deposit yet, so I will see what they have to say on the figures.

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Mr Punter

We went with IdealCombi on the last job which was ordered 2 years ago.  £275 / m2 for 3g ali composite + £68 / m2 for cills (by others) and fitting (by others).  280m2 total.  Much more hassle than supply and fit though.

 

I think looking at the size of your job you could target £800 to £1000 / m2 supplied and fitted, so between £30k and £37k.  Get some more quotes and tell them that is your maximum budget.

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vivienz

I didn't approach idealcombi  - I will give them a call tomorrow and see what they have to say.

I'm a little reticent to get separate fitters, in truth, and one of the positives about norrsken is that they have done a few projects with MBC and are happy with the wall sizes. Still, it doesn't hurt to shop around a little more.

Edited by vivienz
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Moira Niedzwiecka

I used ideal combi & very happy with the doors & windows.

Initial installation a disaster as did not use ideal combi's recommended installers.

I had ideal combis installers, PAB fixings take all the windows & doors out & re install them properly.

Fantastic job & would thoroughly recommend them.

They have sorted all the cills & thresholds out for me & are coming back to fix them.

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gravelld
20 hours ago, Mr Punter said:

I think looking at the size of your job you could target £800 to £1000 / m2 supplied and fitted, so between £30k and £37k.  Get some more quotes and tell them that is your maximum budget.

 

Is this higher figure because of the smaller amount of glazing required?

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Mr Punter
1 hour ago, gravelld said:

 

Is this higher figure because of the smaller amount of glazing required?

 

Partly, yes.  Also our quote was a couple of years ago, pre Brexit and IdealCombi don't do a supply and fit package.  I think that @vivienz could save some money and still have the comfort of a single supply and fit from a reputable dealer within my suggested maximum figures, maybe less, so I would encourage a rethink before signing up.

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Moira Niedzwiecka

Thanks @Plumbersmateuk

I was just going to add my previous post.

Saved me looking for it.

@vivienz As above, just under £12k for the windows & doors & about £3k for the installation & cills, but of course this price included removing & re-fixing after the first b*lls up so would have been about £500 less. Cills have cost £380 because of minimum order.

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Edited by Moira Niedzwiecka
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vivienz

Lovely looking windows and doors, Moira.  I've requested another couple of quotes - any money saved on the windows can go towards my ever increasing kitchen budget!  Thanks for the pictures and info.

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Moira Niedzwiecka

I liked the slim profile of these. Handles are really nice too.

Save the money where you can.

Most things will  cost more than budgeted for.

Good luck.

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Plumbersmateuk
8 hours ago, Moira Niedzwiecka said:

I was just going to add my previous post.

Pleasure..............

7 hours ago, Moira Niedzwiecka said:

I liked the slim profile of these. Handles are really nice too.

Would you be so kind as to add some pics of the windows from the inside

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Moira Niedzwiecka

@Plumbersmateuk 

I am at work today & not home until after 6pm. As it is raining, yet again, it may be a bit dark when I get home & no lights yet. Ditto tomorrow.

There are some good pics in the domestic inspiration section on the ideal combi website showing internals.

You can choose to have a different colour on the inside if you like.

We chose to have RAL 7016 both internally & externally apart from the back door where we had white internally as it is a larger area of solid door.

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Plumbersmateuk
8 minutes ago, Moira Niedzwiecka said:

domestic inspiration section on the ideal combi website

Ah thanks for that I hadn't noticed that link........

 

10 minutes ago, Moira Niedzwiecka said:

You can choose to have a different colour on the inside if you like.

and I didn't realise that. Looking again at the pics you have posted I can see that

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gravelld
17 hours ago, Mr Punter said:

 

Partly, yes.  Also our quote was a couple of years ago, pre Brexit and IdealCombi don't do a supply and fit package.  I think that @vivienz could save some money and still have the comfort of a single supply and fit from a reputable dealer within my suggested maximum figures, maybe less, so I would encourage a rethink before signing up.

 

Seems to be putting a fairly high price on installation, or am I wrong?

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Moira Niedzwiecka

@gravelld Yes, on the Leicestershire/Rutland border.

Our new house is build on the side of an old ironstone quarry.

Our existing cottage is one of a terrace of former quarry workers cottages built on the old quarry bed, hence the name Stonepit Terrace, built in 1870.

We had to use ironstone on the new house because it is in the conservation area.

We have kept it to a minimum because of cost.

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Moira Niedzwiecka

@gravelld Yes I am using MBC BC. They have been great.

Really helpful and open to considering alternatives from the usual.

Our build is a bit different from the norm & I think they are finding it interesting.

Are you in the local area?

Happy if you want to PM

 

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PeterW
5 hours ago, Moira Niedzwiecka said:

@gravelld Yes I am using MBC BC. They have been great.

Really helpful and open to considering alternatives from the usual.

Our build is a bit different from the norm & I think they are finding it interesting.

Are you in the local area?

Happy if you want to PM

 

 

Can second that - used Melton too and they are very good, especially Jonathan at the Grantham branch. 

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