Extractors: Gaggenau vs Bora vs Miele

[curly]

Hello, 

 

Trying to choose between Gaggenau extraction (tabletop that comes out of the counter, or integrated similar to Bora) and Bora. 

 

I've read a lot about Bora basic but very little about how efficient (or not) Gaggenau is in comparison. Or Miele, for that matter. The only posts that had comparisons are old enough to get updated views from you all. 

-> For owners of a  Gaggenau or a Miele extractor:

- are you happy with how it removes smells, and with the noise levels?

- Do you wish you'd gone for Bora instead? 

I particularly like the Gaggenau tabletop extractor, because it seems close enough to the cooking zone to be effective, but seems to give more flexibility on which hob to pair it with. 

https://www.gaggenau.com/gb/appliances/extractors/400-series

 

--> For owners of a Bora Basic BFIU or Bora classic: 

- How much were you quoted for it, and do you know how much the bora classic with 2 induction zones would have been instead? 

- Does the timer only work in 10 minutes increments? I can't find any information on that

- Is there a pause function? 

 

I know Bora is the first one that successfully managed extraction integrated in the hob, but have Gaggenau or Miele caught up, or is Bora still the absolute king? 

 

Thank you in advance for all your thoughts! 

Curly

 

 

[AliG]

Do you have a price on the Gaggenau extractor?

 

The designer drew up our kitchen and suggested Gaggenau appliances but they are just laughably expensive. Often they are very similar to Siemens function wise but have a slightly nicer design for which you pay roughly 2x the price. Bosch Siemens owns Gaggenau, also it is now 100% owned by Bosch but they still use the Siemens name.

 

The equivalent Siemens extractors are around £1600. Functionality should be the same, indeed I wouldn't be surprised if it is the same unit with a different case. I would expect the Gaggenau to be £4000 which is silly when most of the time you cannot even see it.

 

https://www.siemens-home.bsh-group.com/uk/productlist/cooking-and-baking/ventilation/worktop-ventilation-solutions/downdraftair-system

 

Managed to find an EU price for the Gaggenau which was 3600 Euros.

 

 

Edited December 5, 2018 by AliG

[lizzie]

I have the Bora with flexi induction think it was about 3k but I would have to check.  I much prefer it to the extractors that come up out of the counter (had that before). The Bora is very efficient and so easy to clean.  I am extremely happy with the Bora....I would go for the flexi option its worth the extra money. The teppanyaki pan is amazing as an extra, my kitchen supplier gave it to me as a gift. I love it.

[curly]

Hi, thank you for your input!

 

 @lizzie, thank you for your feedback. Great to know you had the one that came out of the counter before and think they are not as good. 

--> Oh, I was wondering about Teppanyaki. So your view is that it's a great one to have? It's on my list of buy-right-after-getting-the-hob ? . I was also wondering whether the fixed Teppanyaki was worth it, but cleaning it seems to be a hassle... The one you can move around sounds nice. Flexi is also on my list, it means you can cook on much larger pans... 

--> Did you research any other brand that worked on the same principle when you nought your Bora hob? 

 

@AliG, thanks for looking for prices. I know, the Gaggenau price tag is crazy. I am only watching the ex-display arena. I have a nice Siemens oven, but I am not that impressed, and looking at the build and reviews on Gaggenau, I wonder if under the same company they keep the best components for Gaggenau. Hence the price.

I wish I could go to a cooking demo to have a better idea. I went to a demo of Miele appliances, and then one for Siemens, and I wasn't as impressed with Siemens (but the oven was much cheaper, I'm saving for the hob!) . 

I read that the Gaggenau extractor that is integrated like the Bora is around £3k. Not sure whether it's true but again, I am looking for ex-display. Patiently. 

 

 

[Tony C]

Teppanyaki? I used to live in Japan, and people there would use something like this on their dining table.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Electric-Teppanyaki-Griddle-Camping-Festival/dp/B00W0CVSAM

 

Friend of mine managed to buy Boffi kitchen with all the Gaggenau appliances with good discount, I think it was ex-display.

 

 

 

[AliG]

Often with appliances they seem to do well with different products.

 

We are on our fifth Siemens dishwasher and have never had a single issue even with 10 years daily use. I would always recommend them.

 

Oven TBH I just don't see how you differentiate. Pyrolytic is good for ease of cleaning. You can get a Zanussi Pyrolytic oven for less than £300 apparently. We have Siemens, they do the job, they start at around £6-700. Miele ovens used to be well over £1000 for no obvious reason, now they are a similar price to Siemens. I don't think they could sell them at the previous premium. A Gaggenau 200 seems to be around £1400 in Europe, hard to find UK prices. TBF I might be tempted to pay that for the flash factor, but I wouldn't expect it to make any difference to my cooking. My parents have Miele ovens, the microwave is laughably small.

 

Fridges are the same. £100 fridges can last twenty years. I have Siemens, and I feel they are a bit overpriced. A tall integrated Siemens fridge is £8-900. A Miele is £1300. There is no benefit whatsoever that I can see. My kitchen designer suggested built in Gaggenau fridge and freezer at £7000 each. They are exactly the same as the Siemens A-Cool ones at £4000, I think the Gaggenau has a stainless steel interior, but it is obviously exactly the same item. I almost got these but I decided I didn't need a £4000 fridge. Miele also sell similar ones at £7000. Then people can spend 5 figures on Sub Zeros. Crazy

 

I do have a Miele washer and dryer. They do get very good reviews and are a superior product, but TBH I don't think the premium is justified, my parent's Bosch washer dryer at half the price is also very nice. However, they get punishing use in our house so hopefully will last. I got a 10 year guarantee on them.

 

As for hobs, again I don't see what benefit a more expensive Gaggenau or Miele induction hob has. They all look basically the same.

 

But if you want a vented induction hob people swear by Bora. TBH that was all that was available and you now have a Siemens one available also. I suspect it is quite similar

 

You could wait a long time for a Gaggenau display model, don't you want to finish your kitchen.

 

I can vouch for the hob part we have never had any issues..

 

https://www.siemens-home.bsh-group.com/uk/productlist/cooking-and-baking/hobs/venting-hobs

 

Looks like AEG do one now too

 

https://www.pauldavieskitchensandappliances.co.uk/aeg-ide84242ib-combo-hob-hood.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI65r7qNaJ3wIVjr3tCh3xGgMIEAYYASABEgIzQ_D_BwE

[ryder72]

Bora is a good product, but look at Novy or Gutmann. Novy are new to the UK market but otherwise been in business for over 60 years.

 

Some Gaggenau products are very similar to Siemens, but not all of them. Gaggenau is a super premium brand so you pay for the branding. No doubt about it. Some of their extraction products are very good, but there is a brand cost attached.

 

Miele buys in most of their extraction so not worth the money.

 

If you want good extraction buy from the specialists - Bora, Novy, Gutmann, Elica, Westin or Faber but remember that they all have their niches so choose wisely.

[Tennentslager]

What about this one @ryder72

https://www.thewrightbuy.co.uk/cookology-cihdd700-70cm-induction-hob-with-built-in-downdraft-extractor-fan?channel=ppc&&gclid=CjwKCAiAl7PgBRBWEiwAzFhmmjdlaF98ElsOVBAGhGBczobIBRHeBdDLYHjsOxgrjSCNwd8Yvb6B8hoCvZcQAvD_BwE#fo_c=166&fo_k=325cda1175eef92d4356b440b6a86dc2&fo_s=gplauk

 

[ryder72]

Never hear of this brand. High quality budget appliances IMO dont sit in the same sentence.

 

Chinese value engineered tat? Probably

 

You could buy a decent hood for that sort of money, leave  alone a hood and a hob with all the complexity of the downdraft mechanism, limited volumes etc.

 

 

[curly]

Thanks, @ryder72

 

Based on everyone's input, it sounds like if I want a combination of good extraction AND good induction (that matters a lot as well), my best and safest bet is Bora. 

 

Thanks a lot! 

Curly

[ryder72]

@Tennentslager turns out that cookology is their own branded stuff. Fine if you want to sell the property on. Not good at all as appliance retailers generally have little longevity and there wont be anyone around to support the product if the seller is no longer trading.

 

@curly - I have always been a bit sceptical of Bora. Its a good product. But for similar money there are better products. Having taking on Novy, I have to say their products are more innovative and quieter in operation. In fact we have switched most of our business from Gutmann to Novy. Thats how good I think the product is.

[lizzie]

I have a Bora, chose it after looking and demoing others.  I love my Bora very happy with it.  Its personal taste.  I think @ryder72 you have never been that keen on Bora?

[ryder72]

 @lizzie I would never call Bora a bad product, because it isnt. Its  absolutely fine. But I think there are better products out there for the money.

 

For instance, the Bora basic is easily matched by the NikolaTesla from Elica.

The One from Novy is the nearest competitor with quieter operation, better extraction rate and a much cleverer central downdraft mechanism that rises and drops to 3 heights to suit the type of cooking being carried out. Benefit - You must have seen what happens when you have a pot on the boil without the strategically placed lid - rising steam doesnt get completed sucked down. The Novy counters this problem and when turned off, leave a clean continuous ceramic surface. The One Pro has better inductors and a higher grade ceramic that virtually anyone else on the market.

The Panorama from Novy is a completely unique concept leaving all drawers usable (albeit 40cm deep rather than 50cm).

Novy offers ceiling and conventional extraction as well with matching hobs that communicate.

 

[lizzie]

@ryder72 my bro in law likes my Bora and wants to fit similar but has an existing island and losing the drawers would be a problem.  Can you give me a link to the Novy you mention so I can send him......EDIT I have found it online now so will send to him.  

 

I don't do a huge amount of boiling so never had any issues with steam, I usually zap the boost on the mvhr extracts in the kitchen area when cooking as well as hob extraction, I have large open plan living space and don't want smells travelling everywhere. 

Edited December 10, 2018 by lizzie

[vivienz]

I have been planning to have a Gutmann Abajo but it's interesting to see the comments about Novy. Even more interesting to see their prices! I may consider alternatives.

[AliG]

Can I ask something controversial here-

 

Do people actually use their extractor fans. I think that I turn it on around three times a year.

 

Admittedly we use the oven a lot more than the hob.

 

Should I be using it more?

Edited December 10, 2018 by AliG

[Sue B]

I’m the same.  We put a kitchen into our temporary structure that we are currently living in about 18months ago and got the third degree from the salesman about no extractor hood.  I just never use it.  

In our last build I found a pop up extractor - i’d never seen anything like it and had to have it.  I didn’t want to hit my head on a hanging down hood. I can’t remember the make but it’s none of those mentioned, something from Germany.  It was quite noisy and really didn’t work very well.

[Jeremy Harris]

10 hours ago, AliG said:

Can I ask something controversial here-

 

Do people actually use their extractor fans. I think that I turn it on around three times a year.

 

Admittedly we use the oven a lot more than the hob.

 

Should I be using it more?

 

I fitted a bit of OSB behind the plasterboard in the ceiling, complete with a cable run ready to hang and connect up a cooker hood above the hob.  I can't see any need to actually buy and fit one, as the MVHR does a fantastic job of both removing cooking smells and preventing condensation in the kitchen.

 

Makes me very thankful that I didn't spend a lot of money on buying and fitting an extractor hood, as the wasted cost of just putting in the bit of timber and terminated cable is negligible.

[Gone West]

We fitted an recirculating extractor unit to ensure that any cooking oil vapour in the air is trapped before it can enter the MVHR system and condense in the ducting.

[ryder72]

An extractor in vented mode would get rid of smell, steam and trap grease.

 

In recirculation mode, particularly in houses with MVHR systems, the MVHR deals with the smell and steam remarkably effectively. However, grease is another matter. If the grease isnt trapped, its going to go somewhere. Typically this will end up on the units, worktop, floor & even walls in the room making these harder to clean and also a breeding ground for bacteria and fungus. It also tends to start smelly musty in time. This obviously does depend on individual cooking habits.

 

A good extractor is worth it.

 

Most of the venting hobs, while very good, command a substantial premium over most other alternatives. Only the user can decide what this is worth to them but personally .

[vivienz]

@ryder72 Am I missing something on the Novy Panorama?

 

I've been having a look at the Novy panorama combined hob and extractor (with a recirculation option) but I don't think it will work with a standard kitchen as the depth of the vent that sits inside a cabinet is 770 - 840mm but standard base units are only 720mm deep.  I may need to stick with the Gutmann abajo as the depth needed for the extractor fits into a standard kitchen base unit.  Pity, it was nice to have an alternative to consider.

[ryder72]

No it works. What you need is for the vent to come down into the plinth void where you connect it to the recirc box in the plinth space. We have installed it.

[vivienz]

Thanks! Do you have any opinion on the panorama v. the abajo? I didn't like most of the pop up extractors but i do quite like the panorama.

[ryder72]

Panorama is quieter. I have the Abajo myself and I can vouch for the Panorama. If you are looking for a hob with 4 zones on induction the Novy product is one of the best I have found.

[vivienz]

Thanks again, much appreciated.