Basework on slope/ cabin.

[zoothorn]

3 hours ago, Onoff said:

How's the cabin and decking looking / standing up?

 

Do you use it much?

 

 

 

Looking good Onoff, stood up well to gales/ no problem/ solid. Decking starting to become uneven on surface, but minor.

 

I have bad water ingress @ door & @ front window, around the panes & in thru the t&g area below the glass on the door. The front faces the weather bigtime. Door shrinks alarmingly by 8mm (just at latch side) in winter too, so door wouldn't close!

 

I used it for work last summer, great. But now work shifted to my proper workshop/ extention lower room.. its actually only been used as garden tool storage. I know it's use will fall into place, come to me in time.. maybe my overnight quarters if I b&b my bedroom 2 (my old master bedroom) from earliest next summer (if I pull the stops out).

 

It's just lovely to 'have the luxury' of the knowledge of an extra room as it were for now, even if I just potter in it. I use the deck every opportunity tho- sit in the sun with beer & snax, above/ next to stream.

[zoothorn]

4 hours ago, PeterW said:

You need these to support it 

 

https://www.plasticdrainage.co.uk/rafter-top-gutter-bracket-2-9365.html

 

 

 

Hi Peter- useful suggestion: so these fit to the underside of the overhanging roof? presumably not fixed to the topside thru felt etc, tho it would be 'surer' this way of course..

 

thanks for that- zH

[PeterW]

Yep usually under a rafter block or rafter tail. 

[zoothorn]

4 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Yep usually under a rafter block or rafter tail. 

 

Which suggests they're usually fitted after the rafter.. but before the perpendicular roof surface, wood in my case, sandwiched in between-?

 

Am I anywhere close?!

[Onoff]

Crap attempt at marking up the pic but if you look underneath the side overhangs can you see the ends of the angled roof timbers? What the fascia board butts up to...

 

[zoothorn]

@Onoff thx yup I guessed they went under here, well they cant go anywhere else (apart from onto the topside).. but they seem longer than my overhang here, so they'd either need cutting down, or, inserting somehow into the side structure of the top of the wall.

 

But Im likely a country mile off!

[Onoff]

9 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

@Onoff thx yup I guessed they went under here, well they cant go anywhere else (apart from onto the topside).. but they seem longer than my overhang here, so they'd either need cutting down, or, inserting somehow into the side structure of the top of the wall.

 

But Im likely a country mile off!

 

Difficult to see under there tbh...it's a dark photo. Cut down, re-drill and paint the cut end and drilled hole an option.

 

Multi-tool the top of the wall and let them in without cutting the bracket maybe?

 

Could you not just cut some timber blocks from say 4*2 and screw on from the inside. Cut them at an angle so they butt up to the roof timbers. Then affix the gutter brackets to those?

Edited May 10, 2021 by Onoff

[zoothorn]

@Onoff btw that mini gutter.. looks a fab suggestion. They do a kit with all bits n bobs, for both sides, downpipes, with xyz bits/ the lot for £70 which I think is darn good. Just add 4x swan neck offsets to get the downpipes tucked in flush to cabin sides.. & its all bits sorted in one go. Black methinks.

 

I bet its a -really- satisfying & simple job too.. unlike my last hand-fking-up frame scraping/ godawful job.

 

You are nothing short of an enclyclopedia for the right gizmo Onoff! & wtf I'd have done without it.. I've no idea. thx.

[PeterW]

Also look at this place as it’s decent quality and 75mm guttering 

 

https://www.plasticdrainage.co.uk/2m-half-round-gutter-10802.html

[zoothorn]

5 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Also look at this place as it’s decent quality and 75mm guttering 

 

https://www.plasticdrainage.co.uk/2m-half-round-gutter-10802.html

 

hey that might even work out to be cheaper still. Its cute stuff I like it already.. gonna look great.

 

Onoff should write a book: " 'Gizmos & Gubbins' (How to help an idiot tart up their gaff)".

[Onoff]

8 hours ago, PeterW said:

Also look at this place as it’s decent quality and 75mm guttering 

 

https://www.plasticdrainage.co.uk/2m-half-round-gutter-10802.html

 

Not the same stuff...FloPlast Miniflow?

 

I was expecting him to shop around price wise but maybe not... 

[zoothorn]

On 11/05/2021 at 05:57, Onoff said:

 

Not the same stuff...FloPlast Miniflow?

 

I was expecting him to shop around price wise but maybe not... 

 

If your site is only one with a shed kit saving me alot of hassle, plus you suggested it which I trust 100%.. that's the right choice! free post too.

 

Could you help here tho Onoff: when my 2 downpipes are tucked into the back cabin corners, they'll innevitably exit rain onto my concrete pads sited directly below. I think I should've added something under the galv pillar shoes on the concrete pad tops.. because I see a permanently wet lowest 6" of each pillar after any rain, because I assume they're 'set into/ standing in' water (even if I do my best to drain the pad tops) & capillary action draws moisture up maybe.

 

And I can't access the lowest part of pillars to creosote- a job I plan to do in the summer/ whole base.

 

So, my achilles heel seems to be the pad tops.. & exiting gutters onto them doesn't seem ideal. What do you think-?

 

Thanks zooter schmootz.

 

 

[Onoff]

You usually want a shoe on the bottom of the down pipe to direct it away from/off the pad and down the slope.

 

In this case you might need a 112 or 92.5deg bend then a short length of pipe to do the same. 

 

Pretty sure you could knock something up from an old bit of ordinary gutter set at an angle so the down pipe just sits on that. Any old bits of lead, another possibility?

 

[zoothorn]

22 hours ago, Onoff said:

You usually want a shoe on the bottom of the down pipe to direct it away from/off the pad and down the slope.

 

In this case you might need a 112 or 92.5deg bend then a short length of pipe to do the same. 

 

Pretty sure you could knock something up from an old bit of ordinary gutter set at an angle so the down pipe just sits on that. Any old bits of lead, another possibility?

 

 

Aha good idea. I'll have some excess gutter, so use that under the shoe (shoes come with kit). So topside of slope is easy/ can do this as gutter can rest on ground.. because the pad is @ this corner 1" below cabin flat frame it sits upon.

 

My other back side- not so easy. Ive got the pillar high above the pad. So the shoe will only divert water an inch or two.. so it'll end up on pad, & cant use gutter as nothing to lay on, unless somehow suspended jutting out. Will have to do this side over time I think. Get a pic up then ideas might come.

 

cheers Onoff.

[zoothorn]

Im still totally lost as to where these galv brackets attatch to. I know this might seem incomprehensible & simple to all. I am even starting to wonder if I have early dementia, because I seem to be getting stupider & stupider, job to job. Seriously (!?). I even watch a video (someone emailed or linked to- but I cannot find it) but even that makes no mention or shows where on the cabin they fix to.

 

Im getting all sorts of conflicting info you see emailed from the supplier, twisted types suggested (but nowhere to fix them to: 'rafter they say'.. b b but I have no rafters along under here!). Or the flat types 'fix under roof tiles' they say (so under the felt, but on the roof top maybe-?!). Or with these 'fix perp to rafter' they say .. (what fkn rafters are you talking about supplier-?!).

 

Ok. The only place I can think these [flat types- the twisty ones are an utter mystery] attatch to, in my cabin, in any normal log cabin.. is simply 'under the roof'. To the t&g roof, under the 10" overhang. Parralel to & onto one of these 24 (if there are say 24 all allong next to each other) t&g boards. So where Onoffs arrows are (but why any mention of 'rafters'?? why not just 'under roof'??).

 

Could someone please help? I'm going insane & I think I need mental help.

 

thx zH

 

 

 

 

[Onoff]

This help?

 

[zoothorn]

@Onoff no it doesn't unfortunately.

 

I understand clearly this is how these two types of bracket would fit/ are specifically designed to fit, as your photo shows. I knew this days ago by watching a video clip, chap says flat one fixes from above to top of rafter, t'other one to the side of rafter.

 

But I cannot understand how in the 1st top pic, anyone is supposed to gain access to the topside of a rafter, if guttering is an after-addition to the construction of a roof. Remove the whole roof 1st-?! well yes you could do this I guess.

 

If A) I had such a rafter to contend with, I could simply just plump for the 2nd twisty type (& just forget the topside bracket.. even tho I cannot fathom how this is a feasable if the roof is built).. but I don't.

 

And B) if I had such a rafter, & for some bizarre reason wanted to instead plump for the flat-top-mounted type, then I could rip off all my felt, remove all my t&g 24x (x2 for both sides = 48) roof boards, in order to gain access to the rafter top. Then replace the whole roof again. Now, I am stupid, yes I hear you all holler, but I aint -that- stupid.

 

Leaving me the twisty type option.

 

But I have no rafter in the underside-of-roof-eaves-area-each-side to fix it to!

 

I  need mental help- immediately. zH

[joe90]

Zoot can’t see much from your photo, we need a quick sketch of what you got, then we maybe be able to offer a solution!.

[zoothorn]

6 minutes ago, joe90 said:

Zoot can’t see much from your photo, we need a quick sketch of what you got, then we maybe be able to offer a solution!.

 

True/ ok will take a better snap..

 

But I just thought log cabin roofs are A) so simple, B) so ubiquitous, C) i thought the simple construction of this type of roof (4x rafters.. parallel to the gutter/ roof ridge/ roof edge L &R > roof board nailed in perp the them).. was seen from the thread.

 

I just thought log cabin roofs are so frequent, & so simple their roof construction was just known by all.

 

I can only assume then that the reasoning was, that my rafters, are like std full size house rafters or something, numerous etc, plus 90*... to how mine actually 4 are running front-to-back.

[Onoff]

I THINK his detail is like this...

 

[zoothorn]

3 minutes ago, Onoff said:

I THINK his detail is like this...

 

34 minutes ago, joe90 said:

Zoot can’t see much from your photo, we need a quick sketch of what you got, then we maybe be able to offer a solution!.

 

Yup- even better than an ipad photo in the rain. Great help Onoff.

 

Ok so I could, I guess use the flat types.. & drill holes through the roof edge underside baton, also through wall toppermost bit (where Onoff's vertical wall line is at its highest point).. & stuff the sods in. ?

 

Or fashion the roof edge so its vertical, by adding a wedge/ (pain to undo hundreds of felt nails @ edge tho, & the wedges will likely rot too).

 

Or make short galv whatnots somehow myself? (I mean ffs.. why cant I just buy cabin roof mini gutter brackets already?!?)

 

I just cant understand, if cabins are -so- ubiquitous, why these mini gutter metal brackets arent primarily designed for them, & not full size houses which never have mini gutters on (with soffit facia/ vertical boards most often just there, negating the need for any such bracket at all) with traditional rafters they seem only to be designed for: then how you would be expected to access/ get them onto the top of any such rafter anyway/ if so.. bemuses me.

 

An utter farce, unless, Im being VERY thick..

[joe90]

I think you will find the roof is so small most people don’t bother with guttering, I have none on my front porch. Probably best to just make blocks screwed to the side wall and the gutter fixed to those.

 

[Onoff]

You have to be adaptable...and adapt what you have when you live in the cheap seats(like we do)!

 

You could.....

 

Run a continuous length of timber up underneath the roof overhang and affix your brackets to that. Something like:

 

 

Just remember, you can do it, you're a winner!

 

 

 

[joe90]

6 minutes ago, Onoff said:

You could...

How do you get that screw in?, brackets in the way ?

[Onoff]

1 hour ago, joe90 said:

I think you will find the roof is so small most people don’t bother with guttering, I have none on my front porch. Probably best to just make blocks screwed to the side wall and the gutter fixed to those.

 

 

At the front won't that block be fixing to thin air?

1 hour ago, joe90 said:

How do you get that screw in?, brackets in the way ?

 

Until he draws what he's got we won't know. Doable either at an angle or with a right angled drill attachment.

 

Hold up Zoot I've an idea you might like, will sketch in a minute.