If standing charges are going next year, as announced in the budget for gas, I may consider reconnecting the still installed gas boiler.

Gives a zero cost backup, in case the heat pump has an issue.

Anyone had similar thoughts?

Is it enough of a saving?

The government is 'looking into' what they can do to reduce electricity prices.

While I know this is all to do with the cost of living, rather than any environmental policy, I think it is sending a confused message, especially to the domestic renewables industry.

I think it's pretty daft saying we are removing gas standing charges and will think about electric later. Less of an incentive for people to look any further than a gas boiler.

16 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Is it enough of a saving?

For use as a actual heater instead of the ASHP, the gas boiler would be expensive to use, currently about 8p (9p with efficiency taken into account) per kWh for gas, ASHP is costing me 2.8p currently. But if the ASHP was to have an issue, the gas boiler could be there to use, I would just need to have a gas meter reinstalled.

But if it genuinely zero standing charge, it may be an option. As back up only.

There is no "saving" for the customer.

The small print is gas standing charge removed, and instead the cost added onto the unit charge. So a low user might save, a high user will pay more. So if you wanted to retain a gas connection with zero use for a backup, then that might be a good plan. That is not what this change was all about though.

The headline is standing charge removed. Most news outlets don't drill into the detail. Most dumb gas users are happy they are "saving". A bit like the people getting excited at £100 off their council tax to help with energy. If an extra £100 solves your "cost of living" crises, then there is no crises.

11 hours ago, JohnMo said:

Anyone had similar thoughts?

I'd always imagined that any house we ever get to build would not have a gas connection, but if there was no standing charge, then I'd maybe reconsider that. Not to have a gas boiler installed, but maybe a gas fire, or a specialist gas hob for some types of cooking. If the cost of connection was low enough, it would make sense, and, as @JohnMo notes, it may be a good backup for some.

Will it be an unintended consequence that people start to think in a similar way and we see gas connections start to rise, even as people are transitioning to electric for heating?

For very low use, in our case the gas hob, we have a pair of 47Kg LPG cylinders on an automatic changeover.

Just the cost of a gas connection (even if mains gas was available here) would pay for many years of cylinder refills.

7 minutes ago, ProDave said:

Just the cost of a gas connection (even if mains gas was available here) would pay for many years of cylinder refills.

Agreed. You'd need to have a very simple connection to a gas main running close to the property for the cost of installation to be low enough, but for some, that may be the case.

And of course, for existing properties, there's now no reason not to keep gas connected...

I had the circulation pump fail in the heat pump rendering even the backup heater useless. Plugged a couple of fan heaters in and used the immersion for hot water for a few days until fixed. Cost four times as many pennies as the heat pump but still nothing compared to an annual boiler service. Obviously different if you're not counting your labour as a cost but I wouldn't bother with the hassle.

If you use the mean amount of gas (~10MWh/year) and you unit price is 8p/kWh, with a standing charge of 30p/day, then to keep it cost neutral, the new kWh price will be 19p/kWh.

Now most people have no idea what they pay, or how much the use. So I see a problem coming to save pennies.

27 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

If you use the mean amount of gas (~10MWh/year) and you unit price is 8p/kWh, with a standing charge of 30p/day, then to keep it cost neutral, the new kWh price will be 19p/kWh.

Now most people have no idea what they pay, or how much the use. So I see a problem coming to save pennies.

You sure about that??

Usage 10,000 kWh at £0.08 per kWh is £800 per year

Standing charge £0.30for 365 Days is £109.50 per year

As a result total cost is £909.50

Divide that by 10,000 and I get a new kWh cost of £0.09 where is the £0.19 per kWh coming from!!!

36 minutes ago, marshian said:

Divide that by 10,000 and I get a new kWh cost of £0.09 where is the £0.19 per kWh coming from!!!

Whoops, I think you are right.

I misread my decimal point.

An extra penny per unit.

All previous houses I've paid about 3 or 400 for gas connection. I wasn't going to get it in new place if ashp but will deffo rethink if standing charge is going. I'll have a gas hob. @JohnMo your tune has changed! You said gas heating should be banned from newbuilds!

Gas should be banned for ALL new builds, so no change there - this thread really is to demonstrate how stupid decisions are. My new build was built with a gas boiler in 2021. Soon got swopped to an ASHP.

31 minutes ago, JohnMo said:

Gas should be banned for ALL new builds, so no change there - this thread really is to demonstrate how stupid decisions are. My new build was built with a gas boiler in 2021. Soon got swopped to an ASHP.

I know where you're coming from but wouldn't it be hypocritical if you fitted one. Probably hard to pass sap with one now anyway

5 hours ago, garrymartin said:

And of course, for existing properties, there's now no reason not to keep gas connected...

I like cooking with gas but my long term plan would be to move to ASHP (Self funded not BUS grant has always been the plan) and then I'd have to move to induction hob as the SC's wouldn't make sense for such a small usage.

However if the SC's were added to unit cost I'd keep the gas boiler for HW - retain the gas hob and just split the system so ASHP was just for CH, I'd get away with a 4 or 5 kW unit without the need to interupt CH with HW cyl recharges

We have an electric oven with gas hob powered by 47kg gas cylinders. One lasts at least 18 months.

27 minutes ago, Temp said:

We have an electric oven with gas hob powered by 47kg gas cylinders. One lasts at least 18 months.

Fine if your kitchen doesn't face a main road and cylinders would have to be out the front

1 minute ago, marshian said:

Fine if your kitchen doesn't face a main road and cylinders would have to be out the front

Pipe's do exist

I know there are some issues there but issues are always solvable with sufficient motivation.

Why would anyone want a gas hob?

Induction hobs are so much better.

1 hour ago, Oz07 said:

I know where you're coming from but wouldn't it be hypocritical if you fitted one. Probably hard to pass sap with one now anyway

But one ineveitably bends to the incentives government lays down.

Of course it just another nonsensical decision which misses the main issues completely.

Lets hope they dont do it on electricity. I realy dont need my bills even higher.

39 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Why would anyone want a gas hob?

Induction hobs are so much better.

My hates our induction, I love it so not changing it

39 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Why would anyone want a gas hob?

Induction hobs are so much better.

Which do you use?

1 hour ago, Oz07 said:

I know where you're coming from but wouldn't it be hypocritical if you fitted one. Probably hard to pass sap with one now anyway

It would - but did a SAP A with gas boiler

Gas is cheaper and the hobs last longer. No special pots or pans.