EPCs. What is the future?

[Roger440]

7 hours ago, pulhamdown said:

The problem is there is very limited scope to use initiative.  It's a tick box system on a tablet.  The "computer says no" was never more accurate, sadly

 

Maybe you misunderstood my suggestion?

 

You simply tick different boxes. Job done. No one is ever going to check. Find the right one, they wont even visit the house.

[SteamyTea]

By the time you have used a dozen EPC assessors, to find the one that gives you the result you want, it would be cheaper to just put the house right.

I really don't think it is sensible to suggest that the assessor is asked to cheat.

I have had too many experiences recently dealing with cheating and lying customers.  No one benefits.

[saveasteading]

If you consult them early, they can assess off plan,  and that is the time to change the design or argue the niceties. 

We've done that and established that we don't have technical disagreements, and had some good advice. The assessor is highly engaged in interested, including alternative opinions.

[SimonD]

56 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

By the time you have used a dozen EPC assessors, to find the one that gives you the result you want, it would be cheaper to just put the house right.

I really don't think it is sensible to suggest that the assessor is asked to cheat.

I have had too many experiences recently dealing with cheating and lying customers.  No one benefits.

 

Of course it's not sensible. It's also unrealistic. The EPC assessor actually has relatively little choice as it's the reduced SAP so simplified and based on lots of assumptions, and of course, it's actually fairly reasonable for an assessor to have to make assumptions without invasive investigations. The EPC is cheap too, so the expectations that a fee of less than £100 is going to give you something that's really accurate is a bit like expecting an accurate air permeability measurement for £50 quid with someone licking their finger and sticking it in the air) instead of a blower or pulse test. And one of the reasons why they're so conservative is partly because I bet a lot of customers ask them to inflate the report so they benefit from it.

 

49 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

If you consult them early, they can assess off plan,  and that is the time to change the design or argue the niceties. 

We've done that and established that we don't have technical disagreements, and had some good advice. The assessor is highly engaged in interested, including alternative opinions.

 

But this isn't with an EPC assessor, rather it's for someone actually doing the fully SAP? 

 

[saveasteading]

17 minutes ago, SimonD said:

doing the fully SAP

True. 

[pulhamdown]

On 22/05/2026 at 08:31, saveasteading said:

If you consult them early, they can assess off plan,  and that is the time to change the design or argue the niceties. 

We've done that and established that we don't have technical disagreements, and had some good advice. The assessor is highly engaged in interested, including alternative opinions.

That will work fine for the original SAP, but the rdSAP precludes them from looking at documents etc, just what they can see.  No wonder it's rubbish.

[saveasteading]

21 minutes ago, pulhamdown said:

No wonder it's rubbish.

I don't think that's right. RdSAP is for older buildings with no drawings or tests.

That isn't what is being discussed, unless I'm misinterpreting.

from the briefest look at the method, it is for where drawings are not available.

 

Even then there will be different efforts made.

The £100 fee guy won't want to put any thought into it, but the thorough one can.

 

With that logic a passivhaus wouldn't get a better sap than others.

[pulhamdown]

On 24/05/2026 at 14:12, saveasteading said:

I don't think that's right. RdSAP is for older buildings with no drawings or tests.

That isn't what is being discussed, unless I'm misinterpreting.

from the briefest look at the method, it is for where drawings are not available.

 

 

That is exactly what my issue with the system is.  My EPC assessor refused to look at any of the large amount of documents that I had laid out for him, icluding a three page specification report..  He specifically said that the rdSAP did not allow for him to look at documents, only assess the house on what he could see.  And a SAP as I understand it, can only be issued once, when the house is being built.  Hence my comment about the system being rubbish.

[pulhamdown]

I have since discovered that it IS possible to have a 10 year old house tested to SAP standard, rather than rdSAP provided that all the relevant information is available.  See link.

EPC Case Study 6 - Passivhaus RDSAP EPC - 105A

[Mike]

2 hours ago, pulhamdown said:

I have since discovered that it IS possible to have a 10 year old house tested to SAP standard, rather than rdSAP provided that all the relevant information is available.  See link.

EPC Case Study 6 - Passivhaus RDSAP EPC - 105A

Well spotted. It's an interesting case study, contains useful pointers and shows that there are some conscientious assessors out there (and why most wouldn't want the hassle).

 

It seems though that they overrode the default values in rdSAP, rather than applying full SAP. Probably.

 

Edited May 29 by Mike

[Mike]

23 minutes ago, Mike said:

It seems though that they overrode the default values in rdSAP, rather than applying full SAP. Probably.

There's some useful information on one of their other pages about that & the need for documentary evidence here : https://www.epcworks.co.uk/improve-your-epc/documentary-evidence/

 

Edited May 29 by Mike

[joth]

On 29/05/2026 at 09:25, pulhamdown said:

I have since discovered that it IS possible to have a 10 year old house tested to SAP standard, rather than rdSAP provided that all the relevant information is available.  See link.

EPC Case Study 6 - Passivhaus RDSAP EPC - 105A

 

On 29/05/2026 at 12:06, Mike said:

There's some useful information on one of their other pages about that & the need for documentary evidence here : https://www.epcworks.co.uk/improve-your-epc/documentary-evidence/

 

 

This is suddenly really interesting for me right now.

We completed our EnerPHit plus retro fit in 2021.  It included a heat pump installed with the (brief and spectacular failure) "Green Homes Grant" and topped up with RHI.

The RHI was audited a few months ago, and they raised a complaint that the EPC used in the application (mid-renovation) didn't reflect the building quality at the moment I applied. i.e. I'd spent my own hard-earned money on improvements to the house (paying VAT on it all too, of course) and hence should be granted less RHI than my neighbour that hadn't improved my house. The EPC had been specifically done a few months before for the Green Home Grant (with the newly topped up loft insulated mandated by that scheme, even though we knew we were adding new external insulation to roof and making a warm loft in months soon to come, but the process is the process). But of course mid-renovation is a silly time to pay for an EPC (solar, battery, light bulbs, and even windows not yet complete).

So now 5 years own I got one done, and it came out at 89 grade B, for an energy positive house! So yeah now going through all the hoops needed to get the EPC surveyor to include correct U-values, airtightness, MVHR, waste water heat recovery, solar battery, etc. Which involves them going through hundreds of pages of evidence, and then again when they themselves are inevitably audited. They're only charging £54 for the whole certificate process, which can barely cover the cost of the site visit let alone the hours of office work this will need.

 

And you have to love the irony that an audit on the sub-£3k RHI grant (on a build where I spent over £150k + VAT reducing energy use) will itself trigger another audit for whoever I chose for the EPC. All on top of already paying £x000 for the passivhaus  certification process.

It's almost like someone somewhere would rather we didn't make well performing houses, isn't it??

 

 

[Mike]

2 hours ago, joth said:

So yeah now going through all the hoops needed to get the EPC surveyor to include correct U-values, airtightness, MVHR, waste water heat recovery, solar battery, etc. Which involves them going through hundreds of pages of evidence, and then again when they themselves are inevitably audited. They're only charging £54 for the whole certificate process, which can barely cover the cost of the site visit let alone the hours of office work this will need... .. It's almost like someone somewhere would rather we didn't make well performing houses, isn't it??

A frustrating tale - I hope you get a good outcome. If you can get it sorted correctly for £54, that's a bargain*. Do let us know how it goes.

 

 

*A 2026 EPC survey here in France found prices of €100-130 for a 30m² studio, to €300-400 for a house >200m², with discounts if combined with other mandatory surveys (and, I guess, extra to trawl through a big file). Prices went up by 15 to 20 % after the certificates became legally enforceable in 2021.

 

Edited 1 hour ago by Mike