Career change

[Guest28]

Most of the people I went to school with who became tradesmen were generally not the nicest or the brightest. The better people were encouraged to go to university. It's just the way the system naturally works, people who do well at school are not encouraged to do a trade.

 

Years ago when people were generally more religious you could find a lot of honest Christian tradesmen, but now that people are becoming less religious they seem to becoming more dishonest. You get a lot of these very rough foul mouthed tradesmen covered in tattoos who probably have a drink/drug problem. 

Edited August 24 by MBT6

[JohnMo]

8 minutes ago, MBT6 said:

Most of the people I went to school with who became tradesmen were generally not the nicest or the brightest. The better people were encouraged to go to university. It's just the way the system naturally works, people who do well at school are not encouraged to do a trade.

 

Years ago when people were generally more religious you could find a lot of honest Christian tradesmen, but now that people are becoming less religious they seem to becoming more dishonest. You get a lot of these very rough foul mouthed tradesmen covered in tattoos who probably have a drink/drug problem. 

Possibly the most patronising post I have ever read. Get over yourself and own self importance.

[Kelvin]

13 minutes ago, JohnMo said:

Possibly the most patronising post I have ever read. Get over yourself and own self importance.

Well said. 

[Oz07]

7 hours ago, saveasteading said:

Not so. Some big contractors have their very particular, sometimes counter-productive, views on what is safe.....but that is not HSE imposed: they are pragmatic and sensible.

 

NOT HSE I'm sure. 

 

For clarity HSE is the Health and Safety Executive: the people who have to turn up to see a body splatted on the ground and try to prevent such things.

For face fit masks id say

[ToughButterCup]

9 hours ago, MBT6 said:

Most of the people I went to school with who became tradesmen were generally not the nicest or the brightest. The better people were encouraged to go to university.

...

 

Better people eh? Well recently (the last fourteen years) we've all had a first class demonstration of what some '... better people...' can do for Britain.

 

They went to the best schools , the best universities, had the best tutors the best opportunities - and added thousands to every single one of our mortgages, preferred  millionaires to tradesfolk. And brought early death to too many.

 

As for increasing dishonesty,  tattoos and decreasing church attendance....

 

Please do a bit of reading on Logical Fallacy. It'll help you to be kinder to those mendacious tatooed traders. And everyone else - BuildHub  members included.

 

 

[SteamyTea]

4 minutes ago, ToughButterCup said:

They went to the best schools , the best universities, had the best tutors the best opportunities

They had smaller classes, so less social interaction, and what interaction there was, was just an echo chamber.

 

(disclaimer, I went though the private school system, it does not guarantee success)

[Dave Jones]

The education system has had it. 

 

Aged 18 kids leaving who cant do basic English and maths. What have the useless teachers being doing for 15 years apart from filling their heads with lefty crap ?

 

We had a work experience lad, nice kid, couldn't do basic math in his head. Asked him what he was expecting in his exams, B and A for everything. 

 

It's criminal how badly they have been let down.

 

And the comedy you see when offstead do an inspection and the heads all start wailing and crying saying the stress is killing them. 

 

pah.

[dpmiller]

1 hour ago, Dave Jones said:

The education system has had it.

that's a very broad brush.

 

\As a parent who has just had a youngster get through his GCSEs and seen the amount of graft and determination required to get a commendable outcome I cannot agree with your viewpoint. Although in NI we're not saddled with the comprehensive system...

[saveasteading]

1 hour ago, Dave Jones said:

filling their heads with lefty crap

that sounds like politics to me.

 

Wrong anyway.

 

I have done some maths classes in schools when building there.

I can't  say I saw much difference in understanding or skills between private and LA schools.

Of course some didn't have a clue.

But what surprised me was how some who were decent at maths couldn't translate it into practicality.

eg I showed them the building we were doing and asked them to work out the concrete quantity. 

getting the right digits was fairly common, with help,  but very few could do decimal points.

 

Does that sound right? Is it going to be half a concrete truck, or 5, or 50?  No idea.

 

One teacher said that the main help I was providing was in confirming hat I used maths (well, arithmetic) all day every day. ie it isn't only for an exam.

 

 

1 hour ago, Dave Jones said:

the useless teachers

 

I think you might be the answer. Volunteer as a classroom assistant immediately.

[Kelvin]

Basic English you say. It’s maths not math. It’s Ofsted not offstead. It’s can’t not cant. It’s ‘been doing’ not being doing. D- needs work. 
 

 

[Dave Jones]

1 hour ago, Kelvin said:

Basic English you say. It’s maths not math. It’s Ofsted not offstead. It’s can’t not cant. It’s ‘been doing’ not being doing. D- needs work. 
 

 

 

thanks kevin, never did well at school myself. found out in later life its dyslexia. speller check sometimes works for me..

[Kelvin]

I think young folk get denigrated too much by some of us older folk who tend to look at the past through rose tinted glasses. School and university only prepare people so far. As has always been the case, it comes down to two things for someone to get on;  are they able and are they willing with the latter being slightly more important. 

[G and J]

Play nicely ewe lot or aisle take yaw nail gun away.

[Dave Jones]

11 minutes ago, Kelvin said:

I think young folk get denigrated too much by some of us older folk who tend to look at the past through rose tinted glasses. School and university only prepare people so far. As has always been the case, it comes down to two things for someone to get on;  are they able and are they willing with the latter being slightly more important. 

 

plenty of good kids out there, itys terrible they have been let down so badly by the system in preparing them for life. I dont remeber it being this bad when UNI was restricted to higher achievers and trade schools / BTEC/YTS for the rest of us. I'd rate a good trade over any highly paid paper pusher office worker / legal / nhs any day of the week. 

[SteamyTea]

2 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

I'd rate a good trade over any highly paid paper pusher office worker / legal / nhs any day of the week.

So the paper pusher who makes sure a plane is refuel with the right type and amount is worth less than the guy who drives the truck to the right place.

(expletive deleted)ing glad you don't work at an airport.

 

It is the 'paper pusher' AKA middle management, that keep the country going.

[ToughButterCup]

3 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

....What have the useless teachers being doing for 15 years apart from filling their heads with lefty crap ?

 

Its all my fault Dave. I trained teachers for a good few years. Serving teachers and Initial Teacher Training. 

To a very limited extent, I think you used to be correct. Way back last century when I trained there was indeed some  lefty crap left over  but even then it was hanging on by its fingernails. 1970s - schools in London - no curriculum - children choose whether to learn or not --- that sort of stuff.

 

You are correct in that there are still one or two 'lefty and righty teachers about. Katharine Birbalsingh for example ( so called strictest teacher in the UK ) and the Head Teacher of a school in Cumbria whose students I used to get as undergrads ( Can't name him becuase I'm still know some of his students) He didn't (still doesn't?) believe in teaching children to spell.

 

Fancy having to teach undergraduates to spell? But, under Tory rules, we had to accept on our degree level courses  'Teachers' (who were appointed by schools) - but who did not have a degree. 

 

Left / Righty Crap teachers ? Dead. Exceptions prove the rool.