Jump to content

Any Architects on here?


Recommended Posts

8 hours ago, Gus Potter said:

The vertical strut at the joist end seems to be missing

We had our metal web joists installed as per @ETC drawings. A few of the joists had to be shortened, and the builders contacted the joist manufacturers, who said they could be shortened, but that the end vertical strut had to be fitted as per original, after shortening.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 hours ago, Gus Potter said:

image.png.4236ca14f6d558f72cf45bfca495f7cf.png

 

I was bit more diplomatic as I used the word "improvised" @Dave Jones was maybe a bit more forthwrite.

 

@Mulberry View I don't doubt you have done your best and am sure you have not cut corners. However I can tell you as I do this as a day job.. each of the designers may have done a great job.. and you installing it as per the drawings etc. But one of the things I do is to coordinated designs SE wise.. to pick up on the little but important bits that get missed. I often see things like this so don't feel bad.

 

It looks to me that the top flange of your joist is carrying all the shear load on a small bearing area. Think about it.. you have all that floor load and a bit of tying all ending up on the top flange of the joist.. it just looks questionable to me. When I see something like that I always ask.. is this ok? I'm happy to be proved wrong.. I just suck it up.. but if I'm right.. which I am from time to time then it saves a lot of folks bacon. It cost nothing to ask the question, the only cost can be your pride.

 

Please get your design team to review this as if I'm right this is a tiny but major flaw and needs sorted for safety.

 

 

 

 

 

It's one thing making recommendations, but you went in fairly heavy-handed and caused me sleepless nights without having the full picture.

 

This image that I posted on Page 3...

 

LedgerPosi.jpg.fc2acd64acf5d7fd3646c3fe0a755301.jpg

 

Is directly from Pasquill's design, which has been agreed with my engineer. The whole of the first floor is in the same principle. Are Pasquill's design engineers not capable of engineering this? But just to be sure, my SE spec'd 195x47 for the Ledgers for the first-floor joists after examining the scheme before it was signed off. The same principle was used for the roof ledgers, so they are probably overkill.

 

If I deviate from their designed scheme, will they underwrite it? If you were the engineer here, would you underwrite it if it hadn't been installed as designed? I think you know the answer to that, so for that reason, I have installed it to the absolute letter. So what could I have done differently? Questioned Pasquill? Questioned my SE? I am a ruthless worrier, so I have done both and both times the same verdict was returned.

 

Fun Fact - My First Floor has been engineered using predominantly top-chord hung Posis and cleared for the 750kg loading needed for a large bath upstairs, along with a 2.3m high 2.6m wide 3-sided triple-glazed Oriel Window. I can't imagine what that will weigh.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Gone West said:

We had our metal web joists installed as per @ETC drawings. A few of the joists had to be shortened, and the builders contacted the joist manufacturers, who said they could be shortened, but that the end vertical strut had to be fitted as per original, after shortening.

 

Conversely, my own surveyed measurements were so tight, nothing in my first floor scheme had to be adjusted. Everything dropped straight in.

 

The roof scheme is largely the same, but my 'squint' cuts had to be made on site by me to ensure sufficient bearing. All cuts were made from the verified trimmable portions of the joists.

 

I just don't know what else I could have done!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 hours ago, Gus Potter said:

@ETC good detail.

 

The vertical strut at the joist end seems to be missing from @Mulberry View?

 

This omission of this dramatically changes the forces in the metal web for example.

 

Best just to seek clarification.

 

 

 

Again, Pasquill didn't design it this way, so what ought I have done? Added it? The scheme was designed on Mitek software by the way. I have full 3D's of them if you want a look! ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

another vote for the lindab galv guttering. Found the 125mm cheaper to buy than the 100mm. The hoppers were 8 weeks leadtime from factory when i ordered in feb. may have changed..

 

 

 

 

Edited by Dave Jones
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 26/06/2024 at 20:22, Mulberry View said:

It's one thing making recommendations, but you went in fairly heavy-handed and caused me sleepless nights without having the full picture.

Hiya.

 

Sorry if I caused a lot loss of sleep, that was not my intention.

 

Indeed, I did not have the full picture as you fed the info in dribs and drabs. For all on BH.. If you have structural concerns then for someone like me to make reasoned comment I need to see where all the loads come from and where they go. If I can't see enough I need to be very cautious.. and this may seem heavy handed at times. 

 

@Mulberry View I've copied and pasted some of you text and comment in line.

 

"Is directly from Pasquill's design, which has been agreed with my engineer. The whole of the first floor is in the same principle. Are Pasquill's design engineers not capable of engineering this? "

 

Yes they are. In fact Pasquill's started out just down the road from where I live and I used to work with them on and off. Their lead  Engineer was very talented, the owner a talented business person. As I understand they merged with one of the big outfits. If they have the same quality of design team and leadership then they are more than capable.

 

But just to be sure, my SE spec'd 195x47 for the Ledgers for the first-floor joists after examining the scheme before it was signed off. The same principle was used for the roof ledgers, so they are probably overkill.

 

Not looked at that at my end.

 

If I deviate from their designed scheme, will they underwrite it? If you were the engineer here, would you underwrite it if it hadn't been installed as designed?

No.

 

But.. in the heat of battle on site sometimes the builder needs to adapt. A good one will often get it right.. often over compensate. Just because there may be a deviation from the design doesn't always mean disaster. The main thing is to spot any deviation early.. check to see if it is ok, if not fix it.. often a belt and braces solution is adopted. Everyone is happy and it all gets signed off.

 

I think you know the answer to that, so for that reason, I have installed it to the absolute letter. So what could I have done differently? Questioned Pasquill? Questioned my SE? I am a ruthless worrier, so I have done both and both times the same verdict was returned.

For all. If you have any doubts then ask questions. The easy way is to send photos to the design team and say.. am I doing this correctly? This is the safe and cost efective way of doing things.

 

Fun Fact - My First Floor has been engineered using predominantly top-chord hung Posis and cleared for the 750kg loading needed for a large bath upstairs, along with a 2.3m high 2.6m wide 3-sided triple-glazed Oriel Window. I can't imagine what that will weigh.

 

You can work it out pretty quickly to get a ball park figure.

 

All the best with the project.

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...