Technical Design Quote - sound about right?

[AppleDown]

Hello everyone. We've had our architect (technician) send through the following to move us to the next stage of the build. From your experienced eyes, does it look comparatively OK? Anything in that list that can be done elsewhere (or by myself)? Total is coming in at £9k +VAT.

 

Technical design for house
Prepare technical drawings for submission to Building Control – as timber frame structure.

Pack will include:
- Substructure / ground / roof plans
- Sections
- Elevations
- Outline/building reg specification
- CDM designer risk assessment
- Window/door schedule
- Stair

[Dunc]

Possibly not the same thing as we're in Scotland so must submit for building warrant before starting. Our architectural technician has quoted:

Stage 4
Preparation of Building Warrant drawings based on Approved Planning package 3500
Submission of application, start forms ,completion 89 each
Dealing with building warrant points 250
Engineer’s certification and design details in regards structure (Allow subject to quotes from engineers) Allow 2200 TBC
Drainage Design Allow 675
SAP 375

EPC 190

CDM Pre construction Plan 350

all + VAT

 

I think this assumes that the foundation and timberframe design will be done by the engineer and the TF supplier, respectively. We then have the option on:

Constructional package, precast, steel, window schedule etc. 850

This provides construction based package for build combining engineers package to architectural technician's package

 

So I'm expecting to spend £8675+VAT to get through building warrant.

I suspect the submission of start and completion forms to planning will be 2x£89 that I can easily save. Other than that, I'm expecting to just pay the money to get it right.

 

[Moonshine]

1 hour ago, AppleDown said:

Hello everyone. We've had our architect (technician) send through the following to move us to the next stage of the build. From your experienced eyes, does it look comparatively OK? Anything in that list that can be done elsewhere (or by myself)? Total is coming in at £9k +VAT.

 

Technical design for house
Prepare technical drawings for submission to Building Control – as timber frame structure.

Pack will include:
- Substructure / ground / roof plans
- Sections
- Elevations
- Outline/building reg specification
- CDM designer risk assessment
- Window/door schedule
- Stair

 

The same architectural technician that did my planning gave me a fee for doing the build regs submission, it was £2.5k + VAT (in 2021).

 

I thought that this wasn't that bad a price, however as its a complex build and i would be PM'ing the construction of it, so i wanted to know how it was all going to fit together.

 

I ended up starting drafting up the building regs drawings myself. This took me a lot of my time but it gave me a great knowledge of how the house was going to be built. I agreed with the architectural technician from the start that he would be able to check the drawings / spec and let me know any changes (without any liability taken on his part) which was a few hours of his paid time, including any technical queries i had on BR interpretation.

 

The drawings set i produce was very detailed and way over what i would have got for my £2.5k fee.

 

I did everything that was in your list above other than the CDM risk assessment, and of course the PI insurance that the architectural technician had and the risk was all mine.

 

I submitted the building control and they had only a couple of comments / changes which were an easy fix.

 

In end the same architectural technician oversaw the build for the warranty, with no major issues.

 

To me that sounds pretty high for the works, especially an AT (i could be well out of touch though).

 

I would be tempted to get another couple of quotes to see what the local market is like, from what i have seen of your plans there is nothing to crazy in terms of a technical design to meet building regs.

[Moonshine]

Also start shopping around for a structural engineer, as they feed into your BR drawings, i don't think your AT's quote includes this.

Edited March 14 by Moonshine

[Pendicle]

Hi @AppleDown we are paying £8600 for stage 3 detail design development including drawings for warrant (Scotland)SAP and integration of structural engineers design, some items listed at this stage, I can do but informed it comes as a package so I cannot take elements out. 

[ETC]

Christ on a bike….those costs are eye watering. I’d do them for half that!

[ETC]

lol at:

 

dealing with building warrant points. As if this can be avoided!

stair….??? wtf is that all about. 

integration of se design. Any idiot can do this.

drainage design.

 

I love the way these quotes get padded out with crap that needs to be included in a bc application.

 

[ETC]

I’ve just completed a planning application for a forum member for £0. You might think I’m mad but really there is nothing to it.

[Nickfromwales]

1 minute ago, ETC said:

I’ve just completed a planning application for a forum member for £0. You might think I’m mad but really there is nothing to it.

I very much doubt this is advantageous to this thread?

 

Random members working for free is not a benchmark is it? That also should remain off open forum too, please, as whatever reasons you had for doing that is between yourself and that member. I do similar, but I keep it to myself and help where I can in whatever spare time I get, off air.

 

Please take this up via the PM system if you wish to continue such dialogue, but, for Joe Public, the subject is about the value for money of the quote, or is it deemed by others as "steep"; by comparison drawn from their own facts / experiences / costs / scope of works.

[AppleDown]

29 minutes ago, ETC said:

lol at:

 

dealing with building warrant points. As if this can be avoided!

stair….??? wtf is that all about. 

integration of se design. Any idiot can do this.

drainage design.

 

I love the way these quotes get padded out with crap that needs to be included in a bc application.

 

I had the same reaction, but wanted to gauge if I was way out.

 

The timber frame guys we are leaning towards have said they’ll do them for just under £3k - and with them doing the structural calcs and design, most of the work is done by them anyway.

[ETC]

6 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

I very much doubt this is advantageous to this thread?

 

Random members working for free is not a benchmark is it? That also should remain off open forum too, please, as whatever reasons you had for doing that is between yourself and that member. I do similar, but I keep it to myself and help where I can in whatever spare time I get, off air.

 

Please take this up via the PM system if you wish to continue such dialogue, but, for Joe Public, the subject is about the value for money of the quote, or is it deemed by others as "steep"; by comparison drawn from their own facts / experiences / costs / scope of works.

Try reading the rest of my posts.

 

The point I’m making is that these costs are eye watering and are padded out with services that need to be completed for a BC application but are being highlighted as if they are “special” services that are worthy of a special mention in a fee break down. They aren’t special and they don’t warrant any special highlighting in a fee quote.

 

As for working for free I do it regularly on this forum - we all do - every time we offer advice we give it for free so why is this post any different? I didn’t join this forum to chase work and I have been approached several times by forum members to complete drawings - and have been offered fees - but in the spirit of this forum I have decided that I will not charge anything but will help where I can.

 

The costs quoted are - in my opinion - high and as I said padded out with irrelevant information designed - again in my opinion - to justify the quoted fee.

[ETC]

Just now, AppleDown said:

I had the same reaction, but wanted to gauge if I was way out.

 

The timber frame guys we are leaning towards have said they’ll do them for just under £3k - and with them doing the structural calcs and design, most of the work is done by them anyway.

I deal with construction drawings day in and day out. A timber frame is a dream for anyone making a BC submission - as you said the TF guys do most of the work anyway. 

[Nickfromwales]

49 minutes ago, ETC said:

Try reading the rest of my posts.

Thanks, I did (before I responded).

[DevilDamo]

1 hour ago, ETC said:

They aren’t special and they don’t warrant any special highlighting in a fee quote.

That may be the case for you, but not somebody who isn’t familiar with the processes and what is included for the monies being paid out. You wouldn’t accept a quote from a builder with a total cost and not have it broken down. So you should expect the same for a professional offering their services.

[Kelvin]

On 14/03/2024 at 10:31, Pendicle said:

Hi @AppleDown we are paying £8600 for stage 3 detail design development including drawings for warrant (Scotland)SAP and integration of structural engineers design, some items listed at this stage, I can do but informed it comes as a package so I cannot take elements out. 

Holy moly that’s dear. Ours cost £2500 also Scotland. 

[Moonshine]

9 hours ago, ETC said:

I deal with construction drawings day in and day out. A timber frame is a dream for anyone making a BC submission - as you said the TF guys do most of the work anyway. 

 

Also BC drawings are not really  construction drawings, and the TF guys will likely provide drawings that are more construction level drawings that will be used for BC submission.