Validating a staircase design

[DeanAlan]

Hi people. 
 

18 months since we bought our brown field site and we’re finally approaching 1st fix. Yeh!

 

We have a general staircase design in mind but was wondering if anyone knows of a service to validate a design  ahead of BC point out a bloody obvious issue!

 

Would BC take a sketch?

 

Are there services out there to just provide validation separate from fabrication/installation?

 

Basic stuff like rise and going are relatively simple but there are some but around balustrades, hand rails, changes around half returns that gets a little sketchy. 
 

I’m also looking into recessing hand rail into the walls for a real contemporary clean look and the regs in this area seem a little hard to interpret. 
 

cheers

Dean

[SuperPav]

How complex is it? Can you use stairbox (or similar) online builder to create the dimensions which will show all your widths/angles/goings/rises and clearances etc. if you need to make sure they're compliant, but it won't generate a Building Regs drawing as such!

 

[PeterW]

+1 to using any one of the many stair design services to confirm your design then get it built. 

[Bitpipe]

Remember to calculate stair design from finished floor level on each floor and if you have exposed wooden stairs try not to install them until all wet trades (plaster & paint) are done, preferable all trades done as they are so easily damaged, even when protected.

 

We used cheap MDF stairs right up until we moved in and then took measurements for the real ones - maybe a bit extreme but worked fine for us.

[JohnMo]

Don't stair designs have to be approved by structural engineer?  

[Simplysimon]

8 minutes ago, JohnMo said:

Don't stair designs have to be approved by structural engineer?  

nope, any competent joiner should be able to design and build stairs

[DeanAlan]

I have the outline of the design for the staircase (aesthetically) and all the calculations of going/rise based on lower and upper finished floor height and available horizontal space.

I'm primarily interested in things like banisters and balustrade requirements. I used StairBox to validate my math by the way 🙂

 

The pinterest screenshot is what triggered my thinking for the design (although we are flipped to raise starting on the left).

The graphic is my work up. The different grays are just to help me differentiate in the diagram. They will be micro-cemented MDF with American oak alternate tread blocks.

 

I approached a bespoke staircase designer/fabricator and it was crazy money. Like £20K+. I know my steel fabricator can do the second piece of the half landing quite easily and the lower half is where the fun is from a regulatory/design perspective. Its construction needn't be expensive (MDF or HDF possibly with acoustic insulation below (in the void) to help give the impression of solid concrete).

 

So open questions for me are

 

1) on the lower half, do I need a railing down the centre (yuk) or not? 

2) can I embedded handrail (recess) within the wall on the left (my drawing) for thew lower half.

 

Maybe I just need to work up the design in a little more detail and get their feedback on paper.

 

Your continued thoughts are appreciated.  

 

cheers,

- Dean

[Adam2]

Very nice and similar to our own design. BC said no to the half width treads. We'll put a handrail of some sort - that will be easily detachable for maintenance purposes. You may get more luck with your BC person. Maybe show them when they are round next time and if OK follow up with an email else see what they think will be acceptable for sign-off

[DeanAlan]

Thanks @Adam2.

Our local BC (3C Shared Services Cambridge) seem pretty reasonable folk - I know that's not always the case. Probably best I just talk to them.

cheers,

- Dean

[Gus Potter]

That looks interesting.

 

You may have to put a bit more thought into how you make it safe and comply with the accessibility requirements, especially if it is a new build. It's not just the stair on it's own but also what you have at the bottom / top of the stair / corridor widths and so on. That is why maybe why you find folk backing off a bit in helping you with the stair design. You need to provide the whole picture in terms of top and bottom landing space / doors in proximity at the top and bottom of the stair / opening direction, the size of the landings at the top and the half landing and so on.

 

A few things to check are for example in Scotland: Are there gaps more than 100mm between the treads and between the handrail balusters. Is the hand rail / baluster assembly climbable? What space do we have at the top and bottom of the stair, where are the doors, are there any fire / smoke protection measures required, can we fit hand rails and where do we need them and what width of stair is required.

 

If a new house then disabled access requirements will apply. Basically in Scotland you need to make provision for a future stair lift. The regs require space at the bottom of the stair and at the top to park / access a standard stair lift. But you can now get ones that are self parking so that makes life a bit easier. Stair lift technology has improved a lot over the last few years.

 

I would try if you can to put together something that shows more information, maybe that covers the above and see how you get on. You can always test the water by posting here on BH.

 

Don't worry if you can't understand the stair regs at your first attempt.. very few, if any, do, myself included.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DeanAlan]

Thanks @Gus

 

We're in Cambridge so our regulation are a little different that Scotland.

 

This is a renovation as well - although the renovation took an 86m2 1930 3 bedroom right back to its bare brick walls, lowers ground floor, lowered intermediate floor and then added about another 150m2 is 'extension'. Basically a new house but technically a renovation and extension and I think that provides more flexibility - thinks like access as you say.

 

The main question (and I am just preparing some material for BC to review) is whether I can get away with a handrail coming down the centre of the bottom flight where the intermediate treads are half width. Everything else will be well within regs I believe. I read somewhere that if the stairs are < 1m wide then you only need a rail on one side (ours would be on the left going up) but here there is some ambiguity about what the staircase actually is and if I don't need a hand rail do I still need a banister or some other barrier (glass) to stop people stepping off the the right side and suddenly having a 2xRise drop?

 

Separate to this I actually want to recess the handrail on the left hand side of first flight and right of second flight into the wall as much as possible but that is a separate topic.

 

I'll let you know what BC come back with.

 

cheers,

-Dean

[DeanAlan]

Note - correction, I want to AVOID a handrail or ballustrade, divider down the centre of the lower flight.

Maybe I will have one and it will be designed for easy removal for maintenance as @Adam2suggested 🙂

Edited June 1, 2022 by DeanAlan