harry_angel Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 We have a new building which is quite isolated and getting on mains gas is going to be prohibitively expensive. So we are taking the view to over-invest in insulated plasterboard and go with the oil tank and boiler. But is the below a decent price? SUPPLY AND FIT NEW GRANT EXTERNAL COMBINATION BOILER. SUPPLY AND FIT PLUME DEFLECTION KIT. SUPPLY AND FIT ALL PIPEWORK AND FITTINGS NECESSARY FOR CENTRAL HEATING INSTALLATION. SUPPLY AND FIT NEW GRANT MAGNETIC FILTER. SUPPLY AND FIT ALL RADIATORS AND RADIATOR VALVES AS NECESSARY. SUPPLY AND FIT NEW BUNDED OIL TANK 1800L. SUPPLY AND FIT NEW BASE FOR TANK. SUPPLY AND FIT FIRE SAFETY VALVE. SUPPLY AND FIT TIGER LOOP, AIR FILTRATION. SUPPLY AND FIT OIL LINE FROM TANK TO BOILER. SUPPLY AND FIT PROTECTION BOLLARDS FOR OIL TANK. CARRY OUT FULL COMMISSIONING OF CENTRAL HEATING SYSTEM TO INCLUDE DOSING WITH CHEMICAL INHIBITOR. AS A G1 INSTALLER CUSTOMER WILL RECEIVE EXTENDED WARRANTY ON BOILER. TOTAL: £14,900 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanR Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 Have you considered the impact of the phasing out of off-gas-grid fossil fuel heating installations for all domestic and non-domestic buildings from 2026? I've not looked at the detail, but assume you won't be able to buy a replacement oil boiler from that date. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnMo Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 Have you thought about LPG also, you get a modulating boiler that way. You can get it to do low flow temperature for CH. I would consider a hybrid system, ASHP and boiler. Combi boiler (oil or LPG) provides DHW and suppliments ASHP in really cold weather. ASHP does the rest. You should be able to this for a similar price. Or just ASHP and get a few grand from the government. You really need to future proof the system what ever you do. Specify oversized radiators so they work at low temperature flows, get the right sized piping also for the distribution system. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry_angel Posted March 25, 2022 Author Share Posted March 25, 2022 13 minutes ago, JohnMo said: Have you thought about LPG also, you get a modulating boiler that way. You can get it to do low flow temperature for CH. I would consider a hybrid system, ASHP and boiler. Combi boiler (oil or LPG) provides DHW and suppliments ASHP in really cold weather. ASHP does the rest. You should be able to this for a similar price. Or just ASHP and get a few grand from the government. You really need to future proof the system what ever you do. Specify oversized radiators so they work at low temperature flows, get the right sized piping also for the distribution system. Thanks. We looked at the LPG route and had the plans all drawn up for tank etc but the providers won't deliver the canisters to us due to access (which is ridiculous) so had to scrap that idea. We also looked at connecting the the gas mains. But just for them to put an external pipe in and connect it up (not including digging the trench and preparing the ground or the boiler and plumber's work internally) is £25k+ so that obviously put us off... I'm not sure for this build ASHP is going to work well enough on its own. But I will certainly look into the hybrid option you suggest with oil. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 21 minutes ago, harry_angel said: I'm not sure for this build ASHP is going to work well enough on its own. But I will certainly look into the hybrid option you suggest with oil. Cheers At what stage are you with your build? Is it too late to improve the insulation and air tightness and make it work with an ASHP? You pay once for insulation and during construction of a new build that is 0% VAT so there is never going to be a better chance than NOW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nod Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, IanR said: Have you considered the impact of the phasing out of off-gas-grid fossil fuel heating installations for all domestic and non-domestic buildings from 2026? I've not looked at the detail, but assume you won't be able to buy a replacement oil boiler from that date. If the 2006 face out happens Which I ver much doubt You will still be able to replace like for like Long after we have all perished From the inquiry's we made 12 months ago Price looks ok 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanR Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 36 minutes ago, nod said: If the 2006 face out happens Which I ver much doubt You will still be able to replace like for like Long after we have all perished This is specifically Oil and LPG Boilers for off-gas-grid properties. It's the low hanging fruit, and it's not just new installs, the prohibition will cover replacements, but not spare parts. The BUS is the ideal opportunity for those properties to go ASHP, or biomass (for rural properties, in some circumstances) before 2026 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry_angel Posted March 25, 2022 Author Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, ProDave said: At what stage are you with your build? Is it too late to improve the insulation and air tightness and make it work with an ASHP? You pay once for insulation and during construction of a new build that is 0% VAT so there is never going to be a better chance than NOW. We are at first fix electrics stage - with heating and plumbing first fix to go in next. Two crucial things - 1) It won't be classed officially as a new build because it is an additional building on our plot "ancillary to the main dwelling house" so no money off / grants available to us here... 2) We have screeded the floor already so the moment for under floor heating has gone. Although we could lay it on top potentially, in theory, the French doors and some other door / window furniture would not allow for this re: measurements. From an ASHP perspective, we were also warned that not enough heat, and definitely not enough hot water, would be delivered if - for example - we had four people staying in there and they all wanted a shower in the morning. If we're letting guests stay there, we can't be dealing with complaints about lack of heat and hot water over and over. This is why a hybrid version, if possible, may be the ticket - if the boiler tops up where the ASHP can't stump up...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry_angel Posted March 25, 2022 Author Share Posted March 25, 2022 24 minutes ago, IanR said: This is specifically Oil and LPG Boilers for off-gas-grid properties. It's the low hanging fruit, and it's not just new installs, the prohibition will cover replacements, but not spare parts. The BUS is the ideal opportunity for those properties to go ASHP, or biomass (for rural properties, in some circumstances) before 2026 Hi Ian! From all I've read though - how can millions of off gas grid properties be expected to do this? It's financially impossible for everyone to switch. See my comment just now about ASHP concerns / issues for us (and also that this building is not classed as a new build). It's definitely not a clear and confident solution for us. All very difficult this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 7 minutes ago, harry_angel said: we were also warned that not enough heat, and definitely not enough hot water, would be delivered if - for example Who told you that? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Punter Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 If you have already designed this not to have UFH you will need oversized radiators and pipework. For the DHW you could just use an electric immersion if you need to give the tank a top-up. If you put some PV on the roof you can dump this into the tank as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnMo Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 52 minutes ago, SteamyTea said: Who told you that? Possibly someone trying to use like a gas boiler? Lots of on off cycles, not sized correctly? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanR Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, harry_angel said: how can millions of off gas grid properties be expected to do this? It's financially impossible for everyone to switch. Unfortunately, after 2026, when their existing oil/LPG Boilers break down beyond reasonable repair, and they are in the market for a new boiler, oil or LPG will not be an option. Biomass is currently an option and that includes bio-fuels. I've never looked at the latter, so do not know if that is a viable option. 2 hours ago, harry_angel said: and definitely not enough hot water, would be delivered if - for example - we had four people staying in there and they all wanted a shower in the morning. A 500l UVC coupled with a 12kW ASHP will handle the Hot Water requirement. Depending on energy losses, you may not need to go any larger for space heating as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 What power oil burner has been suggested? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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