the_r_sole Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 6 minutes ago, Mr Punter said: Why not get her to quote for as far as the planning application stage and after that they agree to hand over CAD versions of the material should you choose not to go with them for building regs? I always find this a bizarre approach and really a misunderstanding of the process for delivering a building, the technical design and specifications are absolutely critical in the design of a building - whoever is doing the technical design needs to understand the intent for each area and understand the reasoning for the design being what it is, if you lose the rationale in the technical stage you can end up with something very wrong! Also expect to pay a premium for the release of the CAD files, in the old days you'd get a paper copy of the drawings, you couldn't get the architects pens and drafting table... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 If you are going to do an unusual or striking design, or push the limits, then more reactions are likely and there is a greater likelihood of being taken to committee. TBH it doesn't sound that expensive to me, if your budget is a couple of hundred K or more. But you need to be sure to maximise potential value by not totally doing the architect's job for him, and being well organised with suitable regular meetings and having your questions in a row ready to ask and debate. Quote saves us even 5 square metres compared to a 'cheaper' Architect, then he has paid for himself. Am I being rational there? He is pretty much double the price of our 2nd choice, who isn't anywhere near as inspiring. That's not how it works. In those circs one of you will find a reason why you still need the spare 5 sqm for something else ?. Ground rule: the way to get value from professionals is to use them effectively rather than try and crunch on price. Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bitpipe Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 In my view, the architects #1 job is to design you a home that meets your requirements (function, aesthetic & budget) AND can get it through planning - whether it goes to committee, appeal or just delegated to the officer. Everything else flows down from that and can be given to others. However if you don't get past that first requirement then everything else is academic. So what is that worth to you (and as a % of your overall build budget)? FWIW, my architect designed a great home for us and got us planning after an initial refusal - he had a planning consultant who was ex LA and could pick up the phone to he planning dept and have a straight conversation. Also had traffic engineering consultants etc as seemingly minor issues like parking and turning can easily kill an application. However we decided not to use him for post planning (conditions discharge & regs) as they wanted £15k (2015 prices) and we were getting full drawings from the TF firm so were able to DIY conditions discharge and regs and save the fee. Still maintained a good relationship with him though and picked his brains on a few issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Punter Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 30 minutes ago, the_r_sole said: I always find this a bizarre approach and really a misunderstanding of the process for delivering a building, the technical design and specifications are absolutely critical in the design of a building - whoever is doing the technical design needs to understand the intent for each area and understand the reasoning for the design being what it is, if you lose the rationale in the technical stage you can end up with something very wrong! Also expect to pay a premium for the release of the CAD files, in the old days you'd get a paper copy of the drawings, you couldn't get the architects pens and drafting table... That is not how I see it. The architect does not deliver a building. There are lots of other professions involved. They will normally get others to do structural design and calcs, M & E, SAP, drainage, kitchen and bathroom layouts, QS works and landscaping. Often the various contractors will design their own works. There is no need to pay a premium for the work you have already paid for. Just agree this in advance in the fee discussions. Often the main plan is designed by the head honcho and the grunt work is done by the office CAD monkey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_r_sole Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 11 minutes ago, Mr Punter said: That is not how I see it. The architect does not deliver a building. There are lots of other professions involved. They will normally get others to do structural design and calcs, M & E, SAP, drainage, kitchen and bathroom layouts, QS works and landscaping. Often the various contractors will design their own works. There is no need to pay a premium for the work you have already paid for. Just agree this in advance in the fee discussions. Often the main plan is designed by the head honcho and the grunt work is done by the office CAD monkey. ok ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gus Potter Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 (edited) On 25/11/2020 at 21:12, the_r_sole said: Tbh I find that really strange... I'd always want to be involved from start to finish with any project, going through the technical design stage you are still making key design decisions on how things are put together, if anything this is a more critical stage for making sure the design intention is carried through to construction. Maybe it's just me! No Sole, it's not just you. I take the same view. Edited December 15, 2020 by Gus Potter typos.. left handed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilly Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 On 15/12/2020 at 14:02, Mr Punter said: Why not get her to quote for as far as the planning application stage and after that they agree to hand over CAD versions of the material should you choose not to go with them for building regs? I did this and it ended up costing loads more as there were several stuff ups because the second firm weren't invested in the design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Punter Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 6 hours ago, Jilly said: I did this and it ended up costing loads more as there were several stuff ups because the second firm weren't invested in the design. That is interesting. Quite unprofessional of firm no.2 as they should have assessed what was required of them when they looked at the job. Why did you not stick with the original architect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilly Posted December 18, 2020 Share Posted December 18, 2020 (edited) 18 hours ago, Mr Punter said: That is interesting. Quite unprofessional of firm no.2 as they should have assessed what was required of them when they looked at the job. Why did you not stick with the original architect? She couldn't work to my budget, that's all. I really admire her work, but she's also a very high end designer. She can't stand the 'make do and mend culture' which I don't mind, and I (still) want to keep to a low budget with flair, if I can. I was also very ill at the time the planning permission was going through (maybe not a co-incidence!) so that may have clouded my judgement. The second firm came on as CAD monkey, I think you called it, which meant there were millions of questions for me to answer all on the clock...(they decided it was fairest...). Edited December 18, 2020 by Jilly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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