8ball Posted January 13, 2017 Author Share Posted January 13, 2017 I think I might get a local estate agent to come round so I can have a chat, as it stands its a link detached but if it was a Semi how much wonga would be lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe90 Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 2 hours ago, 8ball said: I think I might get a local estate agent to come round so I can have a chat, as it stands its a link detached but if it was a Semi how much wonga would be lost. I agree but I would still say that it's link detached if next door does not extend like you, still only linked by their garage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliG Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 Obviously we don't know the layout of your house, but unless you have lots of kids, an extra room downstairs may be preferable. As the population continues to age an ensuite bedroom downstairs which could be used as a gym or family room today, but could also suit ageing people in future might have more value, although it will be more expensive to build due to needing foundations. The other thing you might consider is a big open plan kitchen, again this may add more value and maybe free up say a dining room that is rarely used to be a more functional room. Depending on the direction your house faces, it may also allow you to make better use of the light and create a sheltered area in the garden. A lof of houses have way more bedrooms than public space nowadays, but is it really useful when not many people have more than 2 or 3 kids. I guess an agent may help to answer these questions and you can look at the sums of cost to build per square metre versus value added. Although tbh you could just look at Zoopla and find out prices in the area yourself as this is pretty much all estate agents do. If you do go along the lines of building above the garage, you have to consider that it has to look correct relative to the original house as it will be very visible. The risk is you build one thing on your side and then the neighbours build something similar but not exactly the same. It ends up looking very untidy. And as pointed out you end up with a semi which probably cuts a few percent off the value of your house. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 Your type of house still has the No 1 advantage of a true detached, in that there is no party wall between living spaces, so you can have your music on as loud as you want without bothering the neighbour, and likewise you can't hear his tv or music. That was always the thing I hated most when I was joined to a neighbour, even little things like being able to hear when they slammed a door were just so "wrong" Of course there are detached, and "detached". My definition of properly detached is I can drive my car all the way round my house. Where I am now, We are sufficiently detached from the neighbours that I really could have a drum kit if I was so inclined (instead I flog a dead horse and one day I WILL be able to play something on a guitar) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 Have you considered converting the garage itself to liveable space? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 I could drive a car all the way round my house though I may need a 4wd for a start and possibly some bridge laying equipment to cross the various unfilled trenches..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 16, 2017 Author Share Posted January 16, 2017 On 13/01/2017 at 17:04, AliG said: Obviously we don't know the layout of your house, but unless you have lots of kids, an extra room downstairs may be preferable. As the population continues to age an ensuite bedroom downstairs which could be used as a gym or family room today, but could also suit ageing people in future might have more value, although it will be more expensive to build due to needing foundations. The other thing you might consider is a big open plan kitchen, again this may add more value and maybe free up say a dining room that is rarely used to be a more functional room. Depending on the direction your house faces, it may also allow you to make better use of the light and create a sheltered area in the garden. A lof of houses have way more bedrooms than public space nowadays, but is it really useful when not many people have more than 2 or 3 kids. I guess an agent may help to answer these questions and you can look at the sums of cost to build per square metre versus value added. Although tbh you could just look at Zoopla and find out prices in the area yourself as this is pretty much all estate agents do. If you do go along the lines of building above the garage, you have to consider that it has to look correct relative to the original house as it will be very visible. The risk is you build one thing on your side and then the neighbours build something similar but not exactly the same. It ends up looking very untidy. And as pointed out you end up with a semi which probably cuts a few percent off the value of your house. Hey AliG thanks for the advice, As it happens the house has had a single storey extension which runs along the entire back of the house which does make the house bottom heavy. The open plan kitchen is planned as soon as I can find my large hammer and also the downstairs utilty room and toilet. Already have a dinning room, a living room and another "I don't know what" kind of room ;-) all of good size. The idea of the room over the garage was to even the house up a bit as it has 3 bedrooms and 1 small bathroom, I was debating adding the room on top of the single storey extension but the floor plan just did not work thus the plan for the bedroom over the garage. Again thanks for the good advice :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 16, 2017 Author Share Posted January 16, 2017 On 13/01/2017 at 17:22, Onoff said: Have you considered converting the garage itself to liveable space? Over the weekend it started to creep into my head that it might make sense whilst I am mucking about with the garage. I'll see how the plans go but one thing that maybe I dont need is space down stairs as there is already plenty of it. The garage comes in very useful as a workshop and I can get my Mini in there (I can get it in but then cant get out of it :-) Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 16, 2017 Author Share Posted January 16, 2017 On 13/01/2017 at 17:25, Onoff said: I could drive a car all the way round my house though I may need a 4wd for a start and possibly some bridge laying equipment to cross the various unfilled trenches..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 2 hours ago, 8ball said: Over the weekend it started to creep into my head that it might make sense whilst I am mucking about with the garage. I'll see how the plans go but one thing that maybe I dont need is space down stairs as there is already plenty of it. The garage comes in very useful as a workshop and I can get my Mini in there (I can get it in but then cant get out of it :-) Cheers I was going to say I like a house with a garage and think converting it would be a bad move. But if you struggle to open the door of a MINI then it must be a pretty small garage!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 16, 2017 Author Share Posted January 16, 2017 12 minutes ago, ProDave said: I was going to say I like a house with a garage and think converting it would be a bad move. But if you struggle to open the door of a MINI then it must be a pretty small garage!!! Its a new shape MK3 Cooper S . if it was a original mini I could fit it through the front door. If I was to fit a door from the garage into the house in the same place that the car door opens it might work as long as I can synchronize the opening of the car door with the new door Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crofter Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 Just trade it in for one with a sunroof, much easier! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliG Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 Now knowing that the house has a ground floor extension, an upper floor extension balancing it out makes more sense. You might consider is would it make the house much larger than all the ones in the area which might limit the price. Even if he garage isn't big enough to open the car doors, it would be expected in a house this size and I would be wary of losing it. This is the biggest issue - I am guessing from your comments that is a 7'6 or 8' garage door. As someone said there is a good chance that the wall in the centre of the garage is a single block non load bearing wall. Not only would you need a steel to support a wall above it, but an insulated cavity wall would be a lot wider. You will also need to frame out the wall on the other side against the house. You could end up with less than 8ft internal width in the room, so something like 19x8 assuming a normal garage size. It might be that you cannot use a cavity wall and need to use some kind of wood clad box to keep the thickness of the walls down. This may or may not look OK. Ideally considering the size of the house you'd be wanting to add a double bedroom with ensuite. This might be possible if the bed goes at one end with the back against the short wall and the en suite at the other but is likely to be very tight, you'd only have 18 inches each side of the bed! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 17, 2017 Author Share Posted January 17, 2017 16 hours ago, Crofter said: Just trade it in for one with a sunroof, much easier! That is a bit dramatic Crofter, I was just thinking of parking it on its side. Anything to avoid dealing with a BMW Mini car dealership 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 17, 2017 Author Share Posted January 17, 2017 11 hours ago, AliG said: Now knowing that the house has a ground floor extension, an upper floor extension balancing it out makes more sense. You might consider is would it make the house much larger than all the ones in the area which might limit the price. Even if he garage isn't big enough to open the car doors, it would be expected in a house this size and I would be wary of losing it. This is the biggest issue - I am guessing from your comments that is a 7'6 or 8' garage door. As someone said there is a good chance that the wall in the centre of the garage is a single block non load bearing wall. Not only would you need a steel to support a wall above it, but an insulated cavity wall would be a lot wider. You will also need to frame out the wall on the other side against the house. You could end up with less than 8ft internal width in the room, so something like 19x8 assuming a normal garage size. It might be that you cannot use a cavity wall and need to use some kind of wood clad box to keep the thickness of the walls down. This may or may not look OK. Ideally considering the size of the house you'd be wanting to add a double bedroom with ensuite. This might be possible if the bed goes at one end with the back against the short wall and the en suite at the other but is likely to be very tight, you'd only have 18 inches each side of the bed! AliG the price limit is one thing I have to be really careful of as the house is currently one of few with this much space even before the planned above garage room, I am going to be speaking with an estate agent soon to fire a few questions at them regarding this. I am now planning on keeping the garage and for convenience I am planning a door from the utility room into it. The size of the space I create will hopefully be enough for a double bedroom and bathroom and as you said a clad box I was thinking SIP panels might be the answer. I have just remeasured the garage internally and its 2.6m x 5.1m and the centre wall is breeze block including the weird buttress like thing in the middle (see pic) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 The buttress just confirms it is a single skin wall and you need those in single skin walls to add a bit of strength. I like the lifting beam and crane. you can do your own engine swap (if the car will fit) 2.6 metre internal width is small, and by the time you have built a proper wall upstairs, won't leave much width in the room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 17, 2017 Author Share Posted January 17, 2017 27 minutes ago, ProDave said: The buttress just confirms it is a single skin wall and you need those in single skin walls to add a bit of strength. I like the lifting beam and crane. you can do your own engine swap (if the car will fit) 2.6 metre internal width is small, and by the time you have built a proper wall upstairs, won't leave much width in the room. 2.6m is narrow eh, I'll have to work out how much width SIP panels will use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) Hope you and the neighbours get on well as you'll need access via the top of their garage of course. What's the score I wonder party wall wise if you do an extension now and they want to do similar later? Might be worth considering at the design stage. @Bitpipe had a 12'x38' caravan for sale I think, you could land straight on top....too wide? Edited January 17, 2017 by Onoff 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 17, 2017 Author Share Posted January 17, 2017 29 minutes ago, Onoff said: Hope you and the neighbours get on well as you'll need access via the top of their garage of course. What's the score I wonder party wall wise if you do an extension now and they want to do similar later? Might be worth considering at the design stage. @Bitpipe had a 12'x38' caravan for sale I think, you could land straight on top....too wide? At the moment we get on OK but see what happens eh, I don't wont to sound mean about it but making it easy for them to do the same at a future point wont be planned as this will devalue my home. Its a link detached at present and still would be with the extra bedroom but if they did the same it would make both houses Semi detached thus lowering the value. This has already been mentioned previously in the post. The caravan idea is good as I could do a cantilever (Caravantilever) design and make it all modern looking BUT from past experience with caravans the best place for them is................................................................... Cheers Onoff 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 17, 2017 Author Share Posted January 17, 2017 OK so i have a concern about the width of the bedroom as the total inner width of my garage is 2.6m, I am figuring on running steels front to back and building up from there with SIPs and brick slips as a cladding to try and keep the construction as narrow as possible giving more room internally. What I am starting to struggle with is getting a exact SIP wall thickness so I know how big the room will be, obviously if its too narrow then I wont go ahead with the project. I have spent a couple of hours online looking at diagrams of how a SIP build is layered but they all have diff methods and thicknesses, can anyone who has used SIPS point me in the right direction with my calculations? From the outside to inside I think I will have the following: Brick Slips Cavity with battens Vapor barrier SIP Panel KS Thermawall insulation Cavity with battens Plasterboard Is the above correct in terms of layers? and secondly as an estimate what thickness would I be looking at, I feel as though I'm getting other people to do my workings but I'm just getting so confused with the available information online. As always help is much appreciated guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliG Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 I think you can get down to 175mm or thereabouts, 27.5mm slips, 10mm board, 25mm cavity, 100mm SIP panel, 25mm service cavity, 12.5mm plasterboard. That is 200mm looking at a normal SIP detail, but i don't think you need the service cavity which would take you down to 175mm. Timber on the outside instead of slips might get you down to 160mm. You will also lose around 40mm framing out the outside wall of the house. So net you are looking at losing 215mm of width give or take. If you are allowed to build up to the centre of the block wall you have 2.65m, so realistically you are talking around 2.4-2.45m of internal width. Basically this is down to single bedroom/study size. There is enough room for a single bedroom and an en suite. Can you build an en suite off a larger bedroom upstairs adjacent to the garage? Or maybe use the existing single bedroom for this and add a new small bedroom above the garage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 18, 2017 Author Share Posted January 18, 2017 14 hours ago, AliG said: I think you can get down to 175mm or thereabouts, 27.5mm slips, 10mm board, 25mm cavity, 100mm SIP panel, 25mm service cavity, 12.5mm plasterboard. That is 200mm looking at a normal SIP detail, but i don't think you need the service cavity which would take you down to 175mm. Timber on the outside instead of slips might get you down to 160mm. You will also lose around 40mm framing out the outside wall of the house. So net you are looking at losing 215mm of width give or take. If you are allowed to build up to the centre of the block wall you have 2.65m, so realistically you are talking around 2.4-2.45m of internal width. Basically this is down to single bedroom/study size. There is enough room for a single bedroom and an en suite. Can you build an en suite off a larger bedroom upstairs adjacent to the garage? Or maybe use the existing single bedroom for this and add a new small bedroom above the garage. Thanks for the above info AliG, I understand I need insulation which I cannot see in your example or have I misunderstood guide lines? Ha you read my mind regarding using the smallest of the 3 existing bedrooms for a bathroom or an en suite of the largest but my floor layout wont allow it without some serious shuffling around and £££. The smallest room is the furthest from water+drainage and the biggest bedrooms shape does not help at all with an en suite. I'm going to have a good think today and see what I can do, sometimes a bit of thinking space does wonders for ideas eh again thanks AliG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliG Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 A 100mm SIP panel will hit the minimum insulation for an extension which is a U-Value of 0.28 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted January 18, 2017 Author Share Posted January 18, 2017 Just now, AliG said: A 100mm SIP panel will hit the minimum insulation for an extension which is a U-Value of 0.28 Why an earth did I not see this, if it was a snake it would have bit me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8ball Posted February 8, 2017 Author Share Posted February 8, 2017 Meh....So I have spoken to a few estate agents about my plans and as I suspected I would be making my house too large and too expensive for the area I am currently in plus the risk of the neighbour doing the same thing and actually devaluing the property. Anyway guys just wanted to say thanks for all the advice leading up to my decision not to go ahead, I,m reverting back to the removal of a wall in the kitchen that I never got round to doing nearly 2 years agohttp://www.ebuild.co.uk/topic/15763-is-it-load-bearing-it-doesnt-seem-so/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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