Changing door to terrace to locked access hatch?

[jack]

We're close enough to sign-off that we can taste it. Just need to order glass for balconies and install it, and we're done.

 

However, we need a lot of glass - two balconies (respectively 7m and 4m wide) and over 20m to go around three sides of the flat roof terrace over our attached double garage. I haven't got formal quotes yet, but it's going to be many thousands of quid.

 

We've been doing a lot of thinking about the terrace recently. It never gets used, and I can't really see a situation where it will be used in the future. We're therefore thinking that we could save several thousand quid (which would come in very handy right now) by not installing the glass balustrade around this area. Instead, we'll just cap the low parapet wall with powder coated aluminium coping.

 

The only access is via a door from our bedroom. My understanding of building regs is that we need a balustrade around the terrace if there's a usable door to this area. The question, then, is what would need to be done to change this door to something more like an "access for maintenance" door. For example, would locking it with some sort of lock that needed a tool (rather than a key) to open it be enough?

 

Obviously we'll need to discuss this change with the building regs guy, but I'd like to go in forearmed with some basic knowledge if possible.

 

For the avoidance of any doubt, this door is not needed for fire escape purposes, so no issues there.

 

Many thanks.

[Stones]

Can you not just put a balustrade / Juliet balcony barrier immediately outside the door from your bedroom, to effectively block routine access to the flat roof area?

[jack]

Just now, Stones said:

Can you not just put a balustrade / Juliet balcony barrier immediately outside the door from your bedroom, to effectively block routine access to the flat roof area?

 

Could do, but regular access is needed for maintenance (massive oak tree right beside it, so lots of leaves), so any balustrade or Juliet balcony would still need to be hinged or otherwise movable/removable. That gets back to the same issue of what sort of lock or other restriction is needed to meet building regs.

[ProDave]

16 minutes ago, jack said:

 

Could do, but regular access is needed for maintenance (massive oak tree right beside it, so lots of leaves), so any balustrade or Juliet balcony would still need to be hinged or otherwise movable/removable. That gets back to the same issue of what sort of lock or other restriction is needed to meet building regs.

It becomes hinged or moveable the day after sign off 

[jack]

Just now, ProDave said:

It becomes hinged or moveable the day after sign off 

 

What might happen after sign-off is another issue entirely! My thinking is that a small lock is likely the cheapest and easiest option, if it's something that meets building regs.

[ProDave]

2 minutes ago, jack said:

 

What might happen after sign-off is another issue entirely! My thinking is that a small lock is likely the cheapest and easiest option, if it's something that meets building regs.

I don't think locking a door will satisfy BC.

 

We are likely to have the same issue that I will probably want to get completion before the balcony is built.  The only solution I can see is a fixed ballustrade 1100mm high across the opening, that will be removed once the balcony is actually built.

 

[jack]

1 minute ago, ProDave said:

I don't think locking a door will satisfy BC.

 

Exactly, hence my reference to whether a tool-operable lock (which could be something like a bracket "permanently" installed to prevent the door opening) might meet the relevant requirements. I agree that a standard key-operable lock is unlikely to be sufficient.

Another possibility I thought of but forgot to mention would be to replace the door handle with a blanking plate.

[andyscotland]

Don't know how it would translate to a domestic environment, but in commercial I think if routine maintenance access was required there'd still need to be a designed-in solution for edge/fall protection whether guarding, restraint system, or whatever. 

 

Obviously in commercial you can also make a stronger case for protection by locked door/gate as you can have proper management and control measures over permit-to-work/access to the key/monitoring frequency of access etc. So might e.g get away with restraint system over permanent guardrail. In domestic you're essentially asking BC to take it on trust that neither you (nor a future occupier) will unlock the door without thinking through fall protection. 

 

I'm not sure having to use tools makes that much more of a guarantee - though would at least prevent kids/visitors etc getting out there I guess.

 

I think I remember reading something that said a roof etc could only really be considered inaccessible and left unprotected if you needed a ladder for access, at which point the assumption is that a) it will be very infrequent and b) the ladder user will plan the whole operation sensibly.

 

Unless you get on very well with BC I would be tempted to put a "permanent" juliet balcony barrier across the gap, keep stum about maintenance access, then revisit after completion. I wouldn't personally want to take the risk of telling BC I'd be up there all the time clearing leaves.

 

 

[Mr Punter]

I would either close off the door permanently with a Juliet balcony / door restrictor OR fit edge protection.  You could price up timber if glass is too costly.

 

Consider the risks of the door being accidentally left unlocked and small kids in the house or you get someone else to do the tree work, they are talking on their mobile and take a step back.

 

The reg is there for a good reason.

[joe90]

I think you would get away with locking the door and removing the handle, no chance of accidentally opening it then. All down to your BCO, ours was really good but they are not all like that. You could try it, apply for sign off and if he does not like it ask what he wants. Better than spending money! 

[jack]

46 minutes ago, andyscotland said:

I'm not sure having to use tools makes that much more of a guarantee - though would at least prevent kids/visitors etc getting out there I guess.

 

I think I had in mind something like electrical access panel control, where some form of tool-operated closure is required (going from memory of something my electrician mentioned). I'm really just wondering whether something similar applies in this situation. Sounds like it doesn't.

 

19 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

The reg is there for a good reason.

 

I don't doubt it. I'll have a rethink based on what people have said above. I haven't priced up alternatives to glass yet - I think I'll do that before making a decision one way or the other.

[joe90]

9 minutes ago, jack said:

where some form of tool-operated closure is required

what, like a square shafted tool (called a door handle that’s removable) and locked with the key removed?

[andyscotland]

@Mr Punter is bang on re protection for children etc and that's definitely worth thinking about and having a robust/foolproof solution for. Possibly something that can only ever be either open and unlocked or closed and locked, so it can't ever be accidentally left unsealed.

 

In terms of tree contractors/you clearing leaves I might take a slightly different view. If you/an other actually need to be on the roof, or it's the easiest place to work from, then that's where you'll be - door or not. There will always then be a risk of working too near the edge or being distracted on the phone. I don't see that justifies increasing the risk (eg by fitting permanent barrier/fixed window and using ladders to get up just so you can say "well nobody was meant to be up there guv".

 

So personally I would assess the frequency and nature of work on the roof and what's reasonable precautions for temporary or permanent edge/fall protection. But then entirely separately if there's an easy/ secure way to provide safe access on and off the roof I'd do that.

[andyscotland]

15 minutes ago, jack said:

 

I think I had in mind something like electrical access panel control, where some form of tool-operated closure is required (going from memory of something my electrician mentioned). I'm really just wondering whether something similar applies in this situation. Sounds like it doesn't.

 

IMO it's a slightly different context. Tool-operated electrical enclosures are predominantly about kids/inquisitive or accidental opening. Where the regs for fall protection/access cover that but also are as much about controlling/planning for intentional (but perhaps ill-advised) work at height. A door you can unlock doesn't do anything on that front.

[Stones]

@jack how have you arrived at the conclusion that you won't use the balconies? I assume you haven't used them to date because they've not been finished, and therefore reasonable enough to say you'd never use them, but I think you need to carefully consider the potential use once complete, and the reasons you originally planned them.

 

We're in much the same position re our study room. From the day we moved in it's been used as a dumping ground. It really annoys me and I wish we hadn't bothered and used the money to build an oak desk area elsewhere, but we're finally at the point of doing something meaningful with the space and actually using it, something I really hope will cause me to change my view and embrace the space (granted the cost is hundreds rather than thousands).