Electrician quotes

[pauldoc]

Not sure if this has been asked before but trying to gauge /estimate my electrics cost. Is it normal to quote by the socket, light fitting etc? Any electrician out there who could give me some direction? I know there are other elements like consumer board. At this stage I am trying to get an idea if quotes are sensible or not. I am in the south east if that makes any difference 

[ProDave]

I estimate (never quote) on the basis of 1 hour labour per "point" where a point is a socket, light switch, light fitting etc. I have not gone over an hour per point yet and usually it's under.  Just to give an example I am wiring a house at the moment that has about 165 points, and it has taken 50 hours to first fix it so far.

 

So if you work on an hour per point at whatever the hourly rate for labour is where you are, you won't be far wrong on the labour element of the job.  Materials can vary a lot more depending on what you want (i.e you can spend anything between £1 and £10 on a humble 13A socket)

 

As I said I avoid quotes. If I was forced to quote, I would have to price it higher to allow for unforeseen difficulties, and then every time the customer changed their mind, added another socket or light fitting I would have to formally vary the quote.  Instead I am open and honest about my hourly rate and give an estimate of the length of the job. If the customer wants to change things (they always do) then it's just an informal chat how much it is likely to cost.

 

 

Some people refuse estimates and an hourly rate, they think the tradesman will sit on his but while charging you the hourly rate. That comes down to trust and the reputation of the tradesman whether you think he will earn his hours paid, or skive just to drag the job out.

 

[Stones]

18 minutes ago, ProDave said:

As I said I avoid quotes. If I was forced to quote, I would have to price it higher to allow for unforeseen difficulties, and then every time the customer changed their mind, added another socket or light fitting I would have to formally vary the quote.  Instead I am open and honest about my hourly rate and give an estimate of the length of the job. If the customer wants to change things (they always do) then it's just an informal chat how much it is likely to cost.

 

Some people refuse estimates and an hourly rate, they think the tradesman will sit on his but while charging you the hourly rate. That comes down to trust and the reputation of the tradesman whether you think he will earn his hours paid, or skive just to drag the job out.
 

 

A lot of the tradesmen here operate on that basis, but then its a small community with nowhere to hide.  Certainly all of the guys we have had on site have cracked on with the job.  

[pauldoc]

Thanks for the replies gents. Also on this topic am I right in thinking that the boiler controls and underfloor heating controls would be done by the electrician? 

[Bitpipe]

42 minutes ago, pauldoc said:

Thanks for the replies gents. Also on this topic am I right in thinking that the boiler controls and underfloor heating controls would be done by the electrician? 

 

Both our plumber and electrician independently included an allowance to supply of these items with the electrician to fit - something to watch, it's a common overlap.

 

I sourced UFH stats and wiring centre myself from Boulder and got them both to remove that item from their quotes - electrician obviously fitted them. Also sourced the electric UFH kit from ebay and stats from the UFH super store.

 

Our electrician quoted using the allowance per socket, downlighter etc method which aggregates the first and second fix labour and materials. Makes it easy to understand and budget accordingly. 

 

We only had one trade on a day rate - the joiner, probably the only area of the build where we really underestimated (and under budgeted) the labour and materials required. We first had him quote with others to box in services (post first fix) and put in door linings and pocket door systems. He then returned to ply the ground floor in prep for resin and then do the skirting and architrave (totally forgot to budget for that!) build some cupboards and then finally hang the doors plus box in around Ikea wardrobes we'd assembled.

 

Some days he'd rip through the work, on others you would not see a lot of progress but he was always busy. There is a temptation to criticise on those days but then you'd see that he'd spent a few hours making a custom jig to speed up the subsequent door hanging or prototyped how the splay head doors would meet the lining and avoid a potential problem so you have to take it in the round. We should probably have been more organised and had a more detailed scope of work for him to quote against, that said he helped me out many times with jobs such as fitting the shower screens, helping the plumbers remove a sink and cabinet welded to the wall with SikaFlex etc and it would have been unfair to expect those extras from a fixed price job.

 

 

[pauldoc]

3 minutes ago, Bitpipe said:

 

Both our plumber and electrician independently included an allowance to supply of these items with the electrician to fit - something to watch, it's a common overlap.

 

I sourced UFH stats and wiring centre myself from Boulder and got them both to remove that item from their quotes - electrician obviously fitted them. Also sourced the electric UFH kit from ebay and stats from the UFH super store.

 

Our electrician quoted using the allowance per socket, downlighter etc method which aggregates the first and second fix labour and materials. Makes it easy to understand and budget accordingly. 

 

We only had one trade on a day rate - the joiner, probably the only area of the build where we really underestimated (and under budgeted) the labour and materials required. We first had him quote with others to box in services (post first fix) and put in door linings and pocket door systems. He then returned to ply the ground floor in prep for resin and then do the skirting and architrave (totally forgot to budget for that!) build some cupboards and then finally hang the doors plus box in around Ikea wardrobes we'd assembled.

 

Some days he'd rip through the work, on others you would not see a lot of progress but he was always busy. There is a temptation to criticise on those days but then you'd see that he'd spent a few hours making a custom jig to speed up the subsequent door hanging or prototyped how the splay head doors would meet the lining and avoid a potential problem so you have to take it in the round. We should probably have been more organised and had a more detailed scope of work for him to quote against, that said he helped me out many times with jobs such as fitting the shower screens, helping the plumbers remove a sink and cabinet welded to the wall with SikaFlex etc and it would have been unfair to expect those extras from a fixed price job.

 

 

This is how my quote is being done, cost per socket etc

I have either really underestimated the electric budget or my main contractor is very expensive, probably an element of both.

You live and learn I guess, but as most have pointed out its best to have a detailed schedule pre commencement. But I think a lot of us find it both difficult to work out and fimd the time to do so

[ProDave]

3 hours ago, pauldoc said:

This is how my quote is being done, cost per socket etc

I have either really underestimated the electric budget or my main contractor is very expensive, probably an element of both.

You live and learn I guess, but as most have pointed out its best to have a detailed schedule pre commencement. But I think a lot of us find it both difficult to work out and fimd the time to do so

So what rate has he quoted per socket?

 

Like I tried to say, I estimate on that, but it's not a hard and fast rule, and by charging by the hour the reality is an extra socket costs very little if you are advised about it in time.

 

The ones I hate are big building firms who include a set minimum number of sockets and then charge you £100 extra if you want any more.  As long as you decide how many and where you want them at first fix stage it does not cost anything like £100 extra per point.
 

[Mikey_1980]

The below was our quote for all stainless steel fittings and LED lights, the total came in at about 400 more due to us adding another 3 outside lights and having 82 sockets in total.

 

Install 42 amp isolated supply for Air Source Heat pump		See Note 2
Install 42 amp supply for range.
Install 75 double sockets.		See Note 3
Install kitchen and utility appliance outlets.		See Note 4
Install 4 Shaver sockets
Install lighting points inside house,		See Note 5 & 6
·       83 Downlights
·       15 Pendants
·       4 Uplighters
Install 38 various switches inside house.		See Note 7
Install 9 outside lighting points		See Note 8
Install 4 Outdoor sockets
Install 7 mains wired smoke alarms plus 1 heat alarm in kitchen.
Install 7 standard TV outlets.		See Note 9
Install 9 data points		See Note 10
Main Consumer Unit & Bonding
Heating Controls		See Note 11
Estimate Total	£13,000.00

[jfb]

that is a lot of down lights!

 

or is that just me…..

[ProDave]

That's about 260 "points" (some guesswork as the number of kitchen points not specified)

 

So at my labour rate of £25 per hour that would be £6625 labour. Rates in the south will be more than £25 per hour.

 

So is there £6000 worth of parts there? quite likely if you have gone for all stainless steel.

 

 

So in summary nothing there looks particularly alarming.

 

 

I do agree that's a lot of lights. I hoe you have low energy or LED lamps in them.

 

[Mikey_1980]

It does look like a lot of lights, our floor area is nearly 280 m2, 5 bathrooms, Large Kitchen/Utility etc is soon adds up.

 

All the lights in the house are LED mainly Aurora/Enlite either the small flat panels or down lighters. We struck really lucky with our electrician as he was used to working in commercial sealed labs so worked tirelessly to maintain the air tightness of our build.

Edited September 29, 2016 by Mikey_1980

[vfrdave]

Just to add to this thread this below is a quote supplied through a main contractor for electrical work on my soon to be started new build.

 

It should be noted this is in NI and for now I let the electrician draw up the spec, but it needs some tuning in places.

 

Consumer unit and bonding

Garage; 2 sockets, 2 LED fluorescent fittings

Boiler rm: 1 light

W/c: 1 light

Boots rm: 1 light

Coats: 1 light

Corridor: 1 light, 1 socket

Family rm: 1 light, 4 sockets, 1 t/v point

Kitchen: 9 LED recessed lights, 4 sockets, 1 cooker point, 1 fan point, 1 F/F point, 1 immersion point, 1 t/v point

Dining: 1 light, 2 sockets

Room of dining rm: 1 light, 1 socket

Snug; 1 light, 3 sockets, 1 t/v point

Reception/hall: 12 LED recessed lights, 3 sockets

Store 2: 1 light

Bedroom 4: 1 light, 3 sockets, 1 t/v point

Bathroom: 1 light, 1 fan, 1 electric shower point

Bedroom 3: 1 light, 3 sockets, 1 t/v point

Shared bathroom: 1 light,1 fan

Store 1: 1 light

Bedroom 2: 1 light, 3 sockets, 1 t/v point

Dressingrm/un-suite: 3 LED recessed lights, 1 fan

Master bedroom: 8 LED recessed lights, 4 sockets, 1 t/v point

Outside doors: 1 light at each ( wire and fit only )

A fire alarm panel c/w 2 heat and 3 smoke detectors wired in red FP200 cable is allowed for

Wiring and connecting of conventional oil/gas heating system is allowed for ( stats, pumps, time clock etc supplied by others )

30mtrs of underground cable for future avenue lights is allowed for

1 door bell 

Tracking by others

 

Cost £4960.00

[JamieM]

did you allow for a connection of a MHRV (if your having one though i guess not as i see you have a fan in the bathroom).

also if your in the countryside you may require for an eletric cabling to a sewage treatment plant.

i'd also add cabling for cctv (if you ever wanted it later on).

I'd also add some CAT6 to the main living areas (but thats just personal opinion).

[vfrdave]

10 minutes ago, JamieM said:

did you allow for a connection of a MHRV (if your having one though i guess not as i see you have a fan in the bathroom).

also if your in the countryside you may require for an eletric cabling to a sewage treatment plant.

i'd also add cabling for cctv (if you ever wanted it later on).

I'd also add some CAT6 to the main living areas (but thats just personal opinion).

All valid points Jamie and all things that need to be added to this, as I said it the electrician drew the spec himself and I would be tuning it.  We havent got working drawings as yet so it was a finger in the wind exercise to a degree to allow a contractor to give me a 'guide price' for our build.

[Mikey_1980]

I would have data points anywhere there is a TV aerial, in Hallways near a phone line and in the Kitchen, every device is going to be connected in the furture and wireless isn't always great, especially if there is lots of insulation.

 

We also added in lots of outdoor sockets and lights, and cables which are terminated outside for the furture use of electric gates/lights etc.