SBMS

It’s a bonkers price per sqm @nod - £365. Think you’re up north like me where we pay around £65.

Who is your local authority?

The problem you’ve got is the CIL is due and the council will pursue matters against you. You’d be fighting on two fronts - one against the council and one against the architect… but a planning solicitor would help on both fronts and hopefully be able to look at whether the architect had any liability. Contact a solicitor tomorrow.

Fair point @joe90 if the contract called out all planning matters inclusive of CIL arrangement fair enough. If they did I’d definitely pursue them - their professional indemnity would pay out, result all round. Our RIBA stage/worded contract definitely didn’t. @Berkshire_selfbuid - what was your contract with your architect? Care to post it (anonymised)?

Firstly - how did they arrive at such an enormous figure? How big is your house and did they subtract existing floor space from your bungalow? OK.. some harsh words coming but bear with.. I completely empathise with your situation. Unfortunately this is a little bit of an ‘ignorance is no defence’ - certainly I don’t think there’s any point in pursuing your architect. They’re not really responsible for this (indeed ours had zero involvement in this process. Even our planning consultant bowed out at the end and I dealt with CIL directly for my exemption). it is an overly bureaucratic a process but councils are very very punitive with it. Self builders are an easy target because they don’t always know the exact sequencing. I would say it’s almost certain your LA will not waive it - especially such a large amount. They are, unfortunately legally entitled to demand this of you and why would they not? I’ve posted elsewhere that our local council pursued a widow for 30k on CIL because her husband died and he hadn’t put her name on the CIL. They asserted that ‘he’ hadn’t lived in the build for 3 years (because he had died from cancer I might add) and were collecting against his estate as they were legally entitled to do. Talk about the letter of the law vs the spirit.. That being said, you do have the option of pursuing this matter legally. With such a vast sum owed I would recommend you retain a solicitor specialising in planning law disputes (Ellis jones is one, there are others). You might have deeper pockets than the council (many are technically bankrupt) and they may not even want to risk their legal costs to defend an action from you. But with a large sum… they might. Speak to a number of planning dispute solicitors and get advice from all and see whether they think you have a case. Unfortunately I think that’s your only option.

Thanks @Russell griffiths I am 50/50 abandoning the idea but worry I might forever regret it. Someone on here gave an excellent argument by reasoning what was the cost per swim. Good way to look at it. Will come back here once I know more and have a price for it all.

Interested to hear how much it would cost you? Also.. you said you had two pools.. so the first must have been pretty good if you did it again??

Appreciate it @Russell griffiths we’ve designed it such that the pool room is effectively a single story flat roof extension connected to the house. Pool section would be at least 3m away from foundations of the main house. Have done this to try and minimise issues with affecting main house. I think my current route is to get a design from SE for the retaining wall and foundation design. Then I’ll get a waterproofing design done. Builder can quote from that and I can see if it’s worth doing or not. Can report back here if anyone is interested Appreciate some think it’s a crazy idea full stop… but Am I following a sensible plan there or missing anything?

Yes of course. Structural engineer will design retaining walls and impact on foundation design etc, it’s just that there wouldn’t be any load outwards from pool itself.

The pool we are looking at is self supporting.. doesn’t impose any load on side walls.

When you say an existing house do you mean retrofit or a new build? I have sorted the ventilation and humidity extraction as the pool is relatively small and covered most of the time. Or do you just mean indoors full stop? negativity is good. It offsets naivety to land somewhere approaching realism.

Right ok - well that’s not great. It sounds like a basement design is required (or a really big pump running 24/7)??

Why? 41k for groundworks you mean?

Thanks @saveasteading (the only adult in the room so far). Is this something that a structural engineer would typically design?

So the "build some retaining walls out of blockwork and reinforced base slab" doesn't cut it? If there's a sump pump pumping out the water would that do it? Or would you recommend a fully waterproofed design?

I know. Am waiting with bated breath for someone who knows what they're talking about to laugh

It's got that! Swim turbine included. and a harness to attach you (or something..)

It's nice the first response was enthusiastic! I thought I might get a load of "don't do it it's a massive waste of money".. Am still not sure it's worth it! I've got young kids so just thought they'd love it (then they'll grow up, move out, and I'll fill it in 🤣)

Haha thanks - if it's a goer I'll put up some progress pictures and commentary (then everyone can laugh when the water table gets in and floats my pool out of its hole)

I was thinking of concrete retaining wall, lined with maybe 150mm PIR, and then a concrete base - not sure if PIR in the base would make much difference to heat loss? Any engineers out there?

To be fair that included all the groundworks but still crazy

Yeah I looked at these, but I think this is just for the shell? Then there's all the filters, pump equipment, cover, installation, heat pump, swim turbine etc

8m x 4m was £117k... without a cover and 1 light. This is an 8x3 with an electric roller cover, heat pump, a proper swim turbine and 20 odd jets (hot tub style) as well for £41k...

Thanks @Pocster. I got a quote for a pool and fell off my chair. Then found this which is a fraction of the price... Its just the groundworks I'm clueless about. The builder can't believe it's as straightforward as they suggest (he keeps asking what's keeping the water out - whatever that means) and he's asking if it's not more like a 'mini basement' (which is £££)..

We're currently considering a (probably crazy) idea of sinking an 8m long x 3m wide x 1.5m swim spa as part of our self build. We've been looking at ones that are entirely self contained, and just 'pop' into a hole in the ground, with a bit of access either end to change pumps etc. The supplier has sent some construction details which basically outline: - a 215mm block retaining wall - a 100mm reinforced concrete slab - a soakaway and sump pump I asked whether any form of waterproofing would be required, and was told generally no. Likewise no shuttering etc. Am I missing something, or being incredibly naive to think we just dig a hole, build a wall and pour a reinforced slab? This is indoors. I've attached the details sent by the supplier.