Recommendations for a dependable UFCH controller / programmer which supports optimum start.

[nmpnmp]

I currently have the Heatmiser wireless Touch screen controllers  (PRT-TSwifi) for my UFCH system and these are supposed to have the optimum start functionality which allegedly learns over time, how long it takes for a room to reach a desired temperature. In theory the controller then pre-empts the programmer to to start the heating earlier, in plenty of time to allow the room to reach the required temperature at the time specified by the user. 

 

Unfortunately this doesn’t work very well in my experience. 

 

I’m planning on updating these and looking for recommendations from folk on what controllers they have  used and can recommend that have this feature and which works well.

 

Many thanks

 

[nmpnmp]

Just a quick bump to see if there’s anyone that can contribute.

 

thx

[newhome]

I have older Heatmisers room stats but they don’t have this feature although the one who remembers how long a room takes to heat up is me so I set the on time accordingly ?. They work pretty well.  @PeterW may be your man for this question. 

 

@lizzie has a newer system. Does yours have this feature @lizzie? 

 

 

[lizzie]

@nmpnmp Mine work through a Neo Hub which I can programme and run from an app.  I can also use wall stat if I choose.  No-one has ever told me they would learn the temps but as no one told me much I have had to work it out for myself so who knows. My stats are NeoStat V2 looking at the instrctions there are a lot of features I have never explored.

 

 

[Declan52]

Is the point of ufh that you set up the times to suit how you live and then just forget about it.  That's how I work mine.  

You already have a system that I presume works so why do you need another costly unit to learn how long your floor takes to heat up.  I have a similar  unit at home called my wife.  She knows how long it takes for heat to come through and feel it on her feet so my times are set by that and the morning alarm to waken the kids.  To be fair one of the heat learning type units would have been much much cheaper than her. 

[ProDave]

Most folk just quickly learn how long it takes to heat up, and use a simple conventional programmer to turn it on for instance 2 hours before you want it to be warm.  At the other end of the day you can turn it off before you have finished as it takes a similar length of time to cool down.

 

Why make things complicated?  The few times I have seen a complicated controller, it is not being used because nobody can understand it.

[nmpnmp]

Hi all, 

 

Apologies for such a slow reply, the Xmas break sneaks up on you and takes over everything. Thank you all for the helpful replies, let me provide some responses below: 

 

On 23/12/2018 at 02:40, newhome said:

I have older Heatmisers room stats but they don’t have this feature although the one who remembers how long a room takes to heat up is me so I set the on time accordingly ?. They work pretty well.  @PeterW may be your man for this question. 

 

@lizzie has a newer system. Does yours have this feature @lizzie? 

 

 

 

Mine are also pretty old, I had them fitted perhaps 2011? These are the PRT TS-Wifi models, predate the Neo range and had this setting, but as I say, I never felt it really helped much. The setting was hidden away quite a bit, so not easily accessible. Perhaps there was a reason for that. 

 

On 23/12/2018 at 09:33, lizzie said:

@nmpnmp Mine work through a Neo Hub which I can programme and run from an app.  I can also use wall stat if I choose.  No-one has ever told me they would learn the temps but as no one told me much I have had to work it out for myself so who knows. My stats are NeoStat V2 looking at the instrctions there are a lot of features I have never explored.

 

 

 

 

Thanks Lizzie, I believe it was called Optimum start on the older device I have. According to the manual for the NeoStat v2, its 'Feature 8',. so looks like its there on your system

From the manual. Be interested in how affective you find this, if you do get to use it. 

 

"Feature 08 – Optimum Start: Optimum start will delay the start up of the heating system to the latest possible moment to avoid unnecessary heating and ensure the building is warm at the programmed time. The thermostat uses the rate of change information to calculate how long the heating needs to raise the building temperature 1°C (with a rate of change of 20, the thermostat has calculated the heating needs 20 minutes to raise the building temperature 1°C) and starts the heating accordingly."

 

On 23/12/2018 at 10:05, Declan52 said:

Is the point of ufh that you set up the times to suit how you live and then just forget about it.  That's how I work mine.  

You already have a system that I presume works so why do you need another costly unit to learn how long your floor takes to heat up.  I have a similar  unit at home called my wife.  She knows how long it takes for heat to come through and feel it on her feet so my times are set by that and the morning alarm to waken the kids.  To be fair one of the heat learning type units would have been much much cheaper than her. 

 

Fair point, and thats how we've used it since installation. However, I am now looking to update the controllers to work with a home automation system, and this is one feature I thought would add greatly to the flexibility of the system. Especially if the system is able to react to changes in external temperatures / seasons. In effect the controller learns how long it takes to raise the temperature of a space by 1 degree. It can then monitor the current temperature and respond by starting the heating in ample time to reach the desired temperature by the required time, and in the most energy effiecient way. i.e. Start heating at the latest possible point to reach the desired temperatures. 

 

On 23/12/2018 at 10:14, ProDave said:

Most folk just quickly learn how long it takes to heat up, and use a simple conventional programmer to turn it on for instance 2 hours before you want it to be warm.  At the other end of the day you can turn it off before you have finished as it takes a similar length of time to cool down.

 

Why make things complicated?  The few times I have seen a complicated controller, it is not being used because nobody can understand it.

 

All sensible points, and how we've been using this system for a while now. Yet, I think that its possible to improve on this approach, whilst improving energy efficiency, but this is only because I am looking to replace the existing ones anyway for other reasons. Certainly wouldn't change just for this single feature. As I mention earlier, I'm looking to update these controllers to work with a home automation system hence the question.

 

Thanks for all the feedback folks. 

 

[jack]

4 hours ago, nmpnmp said:

However, I am now looking to update the controllers to work with a home automation system, and this is one feature I thought would add greatly to the flexibility of the system. Especially if the system is able to react to changes in external temperatures / seasons. In effect the controller learns how long it takes to raise the temperature of a space by 1 degree. It can then monitor the current temperature and respond by starting the heating in ample time to reach the desired temperature by the required time, and in the most energy effiecient way. i.e. Start heating at the latest possible point to reach the desired temperatures. 

I think you'll find that integration with most home automation systems is pretty dire, especially if the controller itself has any "smarts".

 

A better way is to have your home automation system handle it, and leave everything else as "dumb". For example, we have Loxone home automation, and it can do this on a per-thermostat basis. Pretty clever, although we don't use any of this functionality due to the way the house is heated.