Help with kitchen renovation/ 1st house.

[Ferdinand]

2 minutes ago, newhome said:

 

Cos you is clearly on drugs  

 

 

Zoot Horn is it not, and that music is swingtastic 

 

 

 

I am certainly on a number of drugs, but none of them are narcotics. Just for you, Herbert and the Sherbert:

 

 

If it is Zoot Horn, we expect a piccie in a Zoot Suit with the foam monster worn like  a feather boa ! Less painful than the Zoo and Thorn version, which would involve a bear and a pyracantha.

 

We'll be on Blossom Dearie in a minute.

 

Edited July 31, 2018 by Ferdinand

[zoothorn]

Thanks for the music intermission- 1st tune was nice/ havent heard that in a while. The 2nd 'health' actually affected my health as I put it on at breakfast too loud.

 

Well one of mine on the zoot theme (guitarist). Swings hard. Fab solo @ 2.30 I suggest start from this point if not known..

 

 

[zoothorn]

[Ferdinand that's a wonderful pick/ impressed.. ideal kind of music for the job I'd say].

 

This is what I was after.. https://www.screwfix.com/p/cementone-general-purpose-mortar-5kg/36857?tc=FB8&ds_kid=92700034801476239&ds_rl=1245250&ds_rl=1249484&gclid=EAIaIQobChMInP_cu7PL3AIVr7_tCh3ofg_dEAQYAyABEgKtlvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds&dclid=CJL_qcuzy9wCFVITGwod5i4ODw

 

Going over the 'leccy stuff now. Thanks chaps.

[zoothorn]

Any drummer wearing a monacle & paisley pants on his head is worth a listen IMO.

 

Fun & games over.. anyway back to the job!

[zoothorn]

On 31/07/2018 at 12:10, Onoff said:

I'm thinking you'll need 35mm extension boxes for those sockets. Thinking 25mm batten + 3mm pack + 9.5mm pb = 37.5mm so the box will be a couple of mm under.

 

Are you using 9.5 or 12.5mm pb?

 

You might be best getting from a local electrical wholesaler rather than suffering the postage cost if ordering on line.CEF, Edwardes, Newey & Eyre are names to look for. Some bigger builder's merchants might do them too.

 

Typical online supplier:

 

1-gang:

 

https://www.ukelectricalsupplies.com/norslo-extension-box-steel-1-gang-35mm.htm

 

2-gang:

 

https://www.ukelectricalsupplies.com/norslo-extension-box-steel-2-gang-35mm.htm?

 

 

 

 

Onoff, it it a Q (in the case of your links here) of adding these 'extensions' to/ behind my existing socket boxes?

 

I was considering only just now, maybe ditching these & instead put in 2 new/ those HD "industrial" grey metal types.. or is that a big job in comparison I wonder.

 

 

[zoothorn]

Screwfix do a 47mm one https://www.screwfix.com/p/appleby-galvanised-steel-knockout-boxes-2g-47mm/29466?_requestid=272602

 

Am I thinking along the right lines? 1cm proud of the PB preferable than a couple of mm's under, with the 35mm one? mine seems to be 1cm or so proud of my plastered wall after all.

[Onoff]

 

 

42 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

 

 

Onoff, it it a Q (in the case of your links here) of adding these 'extensions' to/ behind my existing socket boxes?

 

I was considering only just now, maybe ditching these & instead put in 2 new/ those HD "industrial" grey metal types.. or is that a big job in comparison I wonder.

 

 

 

The extension boxes screw onto the existing boxes. A "normal" socket then screws to the front of the extension box. I'll dig some out in a while and take a pic.

 

I guess by "industrial" you mean this sort of thing that will fit to a standard back box or extension box:

 

 

Rather than this, which is for surface mounting say in a workshop setting:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 1, 2018 by Onoff

[Onoff]

9 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

Screwfix do a 47mm one https://www.screwfix.com/p/appleby-galvanised-steel-knockout-boxes-2g-47mm/29466?_requestid=272602

 

Am I thinking along the right lines? 1cm proud of the PB preferable than a couple of mm's under, with the 35mm one? mine seems to be 1cm or so proud of my plastered wall after all.

 

No! If you're planning keeping the existing socket positions you need an EXTENSION box which hasn't got a bottom. Stay there, I'll go dig one out...

[zoothorn]

Ah ok I'm not on board yet then. Your 2 pic egs (just now) seem to be the same.. I assume just a typo.. but yes that sort of thing. But only if its not a major re-faff to revert to this type. I guess it might be better to stay w'one I have, newly replaced anyway (by a 'leccy chap).

 

I have a new 35mm single socket on/off switch w'red light.. here.. can this be used instead of my flush-to-wall one on there at present?

 

 

[Onoff]

I give up...you've beaten me!

 

Measure from the edge of the existing metal back box(es), the ones in the wall to the face of the new pb and get an EXTENSION box, not a standard back box, nearest to that dimn, ideally a mm or two under and fit that. 

 

The one you show is for surface mounting.

Edited August 1, 2018 by Onoff

[CC45]

e.g. https://www.cef.co.uk/catalogue/products/6347-1-gang-35mm-deep-metal-box-extension

[newhome]

Put another way ...

 

You have a hole in the wall that has a box inside then a flat socket that screws on top making it pretty flush with the wall. This is the plate that screws on. Nice and thin as you can see. 

 

1 hour ago, Onoff said:

 

 

 

This thing that you have doesn’t slide inside the wall, it screws on top of the wall making it stick out. This is no good to you.  In fact you probably wouldn’t ever use it in your house. Maybe in a shed or similar. 

 

53 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

 

 

So your box that sits inside the wall is now going fo be too short as you’ve made the wall thicker so you need to add something to bridge the gap. So this thing that @CC45 has posted bridges that gap. It goes inside the wall to do that so you measure from the edge of the existing box that is inside the wall to where the plasterboard will come and buy one that bridges that gap. Simples. 

 

 

Then you screw your existing plate on top. Job done. If the wires are too short you may have to address that but let’s get the right bits together first. 

 

 

Edited August 1, 2018 by newhome

[newhome]

So briefly.

 

Old existing box and new extension box screw together to come flush with the new wall / plasterboard. Then screw your existing socket plate on top. All you need to get is the new extension box. 

[zoothorn]

51 minutes ago, Onoff said:

I give up...you've beaten me!

 

Measure from the edge of the existing metal back box(es), the ones in the wall to the face of the new pb and get an EXTENSION box, not a standard back box, nearest to that dimn, ideally a mm or two under and fit that. 

 

The one you show is for surface mounting.

Ok understood. Please don't give up on me! I'm only trying to understand stuff Ive never done before.. I'm still not sure what's exacty inside my box in order to establish how exactly it extends, & how I actually do it (ie, do I need to extend the actual cabletoo.. etc).

 

I'll turn off the mains electric this ev & have a look.

[newhome]

Take a photo of the socket with the front plate off and go and have some tea. 

[zoothorn]

1 minute ago, newhome said:

So briefly.

 

Old existing box and new extension box screw together to come flush with the new wall / plasterboard. Then screw your existing socket plate on top. All you need to get is the new extension box. 

 

Ah ok understood- thanks. This sort of simpleton talk is ideal for me! so screwfix don't do them by looks of it.

 

So the position of the 2 side screws, & the H & W of the box, are industry standard dims?

[Onoff]

13 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

 

Ah ok understood- thanks. This sort of simpleton talk is ideal for me! so screwfix don't do them by looks of it.

 

So the position of the 2 side screws, & the H & W of the box, are industry standard dims?

 

12.10 yesterday and on Thursday I posted up links to box extenders! Click on the links we post and try and take it it eh?

 

Hopefully then 3rd, 4th? time lucky with @CC45 & @newhome's contributions above.

 

I'm a bit worried in all honesty whether you're capable of safely extending the cabling. Happy to do an idiots guide. Get the power off and photograph inside the boxes that need extending.

[zoothorn]

Onoff Ive said before that I don't get many replies until I reload the page.. this is why I'm late on reading many.

 

I went back over the links you posted, & read them more than once & am trying to understand it.. but as I'm not used to these extentions, & why their needed as opposed to buying a new one, I just didn't/ couldn't on first go at these, distinguish between an extension.. & a box, unless the subtle difference is kindly pointed out. Its obvious to you. Its not to me.

 

I have another one, a single plug socket inplace/ located on the wall yet to do, which protrudes 40mm from the wall to the very fwd point of it (including its front plate). Is the idea with this to leave it in place & PB / C'tex around it??

[PeterW]

Don’t extend it. 

 

Just get a piece of 18mm ply or similar about the size of the box, unscrew the box from the wall, board on into the hole then screws back in. 

 

It will give you enough forward projection of the socket, may need longer face plate screws but it’s quick and easy and no wiring required. 

[zoothorn]

Ok here's the double socket. Are the side fixings, & the HxW of these industry standard dims?

[zoothorn]

12 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Don’t extend it. 

 

Just get a piece of 18mm ply or similar about the size of the box, unscrew the box from the wall, board on into the hole then screws back in. 

 

It will give you enough forward projection of the socket, may need longer face plate screws but it’s quick and easy and no wiring required. 

 

Are you referring to the flush double sockets? or the 3rd one on t'other wall I just mentioned (which projects 40mm)-?

[Onoff]

23 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Don’t extend it. 

 

Just get a piece of 18mm ply or similar about the size of the box, unscrew the box from the wall, board on into the hole then screws back in. 

 

It will give you enough forward projection of the socket, may need longer face plate screws but it’s quick and easy and no wiring required. 

 

Disagree if there's any chance the edges of the knockouts could cut the cable if no grommets or if the cable could be otherwise crushed. Assumes too the box will come out easily, mine don't.

 

@zoothorn, how about these? From Toolstation:

 

https://www.toolstation.com/shop/p79641?

 

I even found this:

 

 

Tbh I don't like them as the tendency is to use them at their limits and the socket often ends up wobbly. I also like having a back box up near the socket to fill around.

 

The "40mm" forward one sounds like it's already surface mounted? Maybe just ease forward on the screws & pack a little at the back with some penny washers (or timber / pb) so the back of the face plate is level with the face of the pb.

[zoothorn]

Onoff I'll go with your orig idea of the box extension (that ^ idea looks simplest yes but a bit flimsy maybe) now I'm on board with how they fit together (now seen mine). I was only trying to find s'thing from screwfix as I'm there tmrw/ thought Id found s'thing but wrong, they don't do extensions then.

 

I didn't know the front plate bits were available separately? I'll go with mine anyway/ simplest. I'll have to assume the fixing lugs L & R, the size of the box HxW, & the screw thread too.. are all a standard size so mfr A's extension > fitsm into to mfr B's box (in my wall).

 

Can you just confirm this? then I'll search in town tmrw.

 

I'm electrics aware: as a rule I turn off all/ ie the main double-red flip switch in consumer unit before doing -anything- in the house. I've built fender tube amp circuits (500v at the biz end/ just fully rebuilt a 78 twin reverb), & replaced an old shower unit/ rebuilt bathroom last year too.

[CC45]

you shouldn't have any probs with screws / threads, at least I've never had compatibility probs in 25 years of playing at being a full time builder.

[zoothorn]

good- thanks for that CC45.