Tennentslager Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 So Jarek the Polish builder says yup I can do that no problem...you'll need a building warrant and a structural engineer for the steel spec. I knew all of this so called Matt the architect for a price. £800 for drawings for BC including the engineers report. £600 if I source the engineer myself. WTF, browsed the planning portal as there are literally hundreds of these 1964 semis all over this neighbourhood. Downloaded the attached plan from there, all but identical to my place. The wall we need to begone to make the kitchen and dining room into a kitchen diner is 3550mm and as you can see the dividing wall in the room above is offset some 400mm. So, mu question is, can I with the help of the forum, draw and submit plans for BC myself? What do I use to draw (happiest with a pencil and paper) but can learn sketchup etc if need be. Architect guy says engineer will ask for a drawing before survey but will him/herself than do a drawing? What! How does this normally work? I'll be searching the net for a suitable engineer, whats the best way to find a service? Do they always site visit or can this be done online? Hoping you guys will help save me some cash, cant believe there's a couple of days work in this for the drawing guy...£800 Dick Turpin! Scan 7 May 2018.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 A SE will do you a sketch, prob £200, and you hand it to BCO. BCO smiles and says "can you email the SE calcs to me please?", SE does so, and job done. You dont need anything more than a pencil. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted May 7, 2018 Author Share Posted May 7, 2018 Smashing, how does one source a SE. Internet and phone or is there a better way for tiny jobs like this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Is it a wall replacement ..?? I’ve got a couple of contacts who would do it online from a sketch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 3 minutes ago, PeterW said: Is it a wall replacement ..?? I’ve got a couple of contacts who would do it online from a sketch Was just going to say the same thing for my guy. Go with peters guy, if no luck PM me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 9 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said: A SE will do you a sketch, prob £200, and you hand it to BCO. BCO smiles and says "can you email the SE calcs to me please?", SE does so, and job done. You dont need anything more than a pencil. And a tape measure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 SE up here charged me over £1500 for the paperwork for a circa 6M x 4M single storey / single room extension. Thought that was a lot but had a gun to my head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hecateh Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 18 minutes ago, newhome said: SE up here charged me over £1500 for the paperwork for a circa 6M x 4M single storey / single room extension. Thought that was a lot but had a gun to my head. And you had never heard of Buildhub at that time - or you would have been a bit more savvy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 2 minutes ago, Hecateh said: And you had never heard of Buildhub at that time - or you would have been a bit more savvy Yeah possibly! Not sure how much they charge in general but wasn't expecting it to be that much TBH. Hey ho, it's signed off now and that's the important thing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daiking Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 (edited) Is this a common features that age? The first floor brick dividing wall offset from the downstairs one? We have that too and no offence but my house looks pretty grim too. Utterly without appeal. Not a great decade for cheap builders. Bloody council houses to blame I guess, lol. Edited May 7, 2018 by daiking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JK Ro Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 Architects usually charge around 60-90 an hour so that doesn't sound far off at all. It's probably a days work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted May 13, 2018 Author Share Posted May 13, 2018 Thanks to @Peter for the tip to use www.beamcalculation.co.uk The 48 hour service at £49 came back in three hours...on a Sunday afternoon!Steel_Beam_Calculations_ref_69139.pdf Now, anyone give me a pointer on the drawings? The website says I need this- Your local authority building standards service will be able to advise you on what you need to submit with your application for a building warrant. This can be done on-line through the eBuilding Standards. The main requirements are: • Plans and drawings in relation to the proposed work; • The appropriate application fee; • Confirmation that you intend to use an Approved Certifier of Design or (if you know this at this point); • Certificates from an Approved Certifier of Design (if you are using one); and • Confirmation that you intend to use an Approved Certifier of Construction or (if you know this at this point). Why should you use the services of an Approved Certifier of Design? If you are using the services of an Approved Certifier of Design, they will be able to advise you whether there are any design elements that need to be completed by a specialist third party (usually in relation to specialist systems and components). If that is the case, these design elements may need to be completed at a later stage so as not to hold up the building warrant application process. Where this is the case, the Certificate of Design that you submit to your local authority should be accompanied by a Schedule 1 that describes these additional design elements. These elements will be noted by your local authority building standards service and will be subject to separate checks once the specific detail of those designs is complete. A Form Q must be submitted to the local authority when the design of the elements on Schedule 1 have been finalised. If you make design changes after the building warrant has been granted you are likely to need an amendment to building warrant and a new certificate from the Approved Certifier of Design. Plan A is to use the plan of an identical house as the existing drawing and then remove the wall from the drawing as proposed. What detail to they need re position of padstones etc? Do I need this detail? What about removing the electrical sockets etc from the (Kitchen) wall, do they need to know anything about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 25 minutes ago, Tennentslager said: What detail to they need re position of padstones etc? Do I need this detail? Deffo. SE will specify with the steel drawing. Full detail will be required, buy your only looking at a pre-stressed concrete lintel, 6"x4" around 300-400mm long and the steel needs to be a min of 100mm bearing on the pad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 13 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said: Deffo. SE will specify with the steel drawing. Full detail will be required, buy your only looking at a pre-stressed concrete lintel, 6"x4" around 300-400mm long and the steel needs to be a min of 100mm bearing on the pad. Padstone is specced in the design - that is a standard Naylor Padstone available from most BM. Read the notes on the file and you can work out where it goes. BCO doesn't need to know about removal of electrics assuming you're using a sparky, just that the padstones are in the walls appropriately and the steel is minimum 100mm on the padstone. I was picked up on one a few years back and always make sure my steels are min 120-150mm on the padstones and that way I have no issues. For the cost - and if the padstone is in line with the beam - getting the beam 300mm longer each end than the opening means it sits better on the pad and doesn't front load it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 +1, I should have said I always go for 150mm as 100mm just looks inadequate to me. And steel is pennies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted May 13, 2018 Author Share Posted May 13, 2018 (edited) Like this...? Pocket made on each wall, remove bricks, insert padstone, rest steel on top ensuring the steel sits on the whole surface area...i.e. a bit longer than the padstone? Edited May 13, 2018 by Tennentslager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 How far from the edge of the doorway between the DR and the LR will the padstone be? BCO may ask for a pillar there. Looking a bit tight to have the doorway lintel and the new pad so close on a single skin. Any chance of a pic looking from the DR into the LR with dimensions ? You'll need to expose the existing lintel to be 100%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted May 13, 2018 Author Share Posted May 13, 2018 This help? The wall with the door is the one that will be going... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Questions... How wide is the stub marked with a red arrow And what is above the blue arrow..? is this blockwork up into the next floor..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 Cheers for the pics. I recon your well into pillar territory there. You need the old '45 degree downward' rule applied where the piece of wall under the existing lintel ( opening not doorway one ) will want to push outward and splay that little stub of wall as it'll then have two lots of downward pressure at that one point. You may even be asked to expose the founds to check that stub wall ( to the left of the existing opening ) is sat on a true foundation. A house that size may just be a thick reinforced concrete raft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted May 14, 2018 Author Share Posted May 14, 2018 The stub with the light switch is 300mm The bit above the blue arrow is original, without chipping the plaster away I'm not sure but it's solid so probably lintel/block Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 2 minutes ago, Tennentslager said: The stub with the light switch is 300mm The bit above the blue arrow is original, without chipping the plaster away I'm not sure but it's solid so probably lintel/block Does it go through the floor and up to the ceiling of the next floor ..? As @Nickfromwales says, not unusual for those to be built off the slab. Out of interest, any chance of leaving the small return where the light switch is..?? It’s creating a buttress to the other wall and would simplify your installation somewhat as currently you’re going to compromise the whole of that other 100mm wall by removing bits of it less than 500mm from its end ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted May 14, 2018 Author Share Posted May 14, 2018 7 minutes ago, PeterW said: Does it go through the floor and up to the ceiling of the next floor ..? Yes, for most of it...it's a bedroom above but the first floor landing is above so not the whole wall all the way up. 7 minutes ago, PeterW said: As @Nickfromwales Out of interest, any chance of leaving the small return where the light switch is..?? It’s creating a buttress to the other wall and would simplify your installation somewhat as currently you’re going to compromise the whole of that other 100mm wall by removing bits of it less than 500mm from its end ... Yes, could leave that little stub in... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 Sorry - being obtuse ... Looking at that, the wall with the blue arrow isn’t structural above; it’s just done in block all the way up for ease. The stub I'm referring to is the old kitchen door one - only about 150mm but would mean not altering the structural integrity of the main spine wall. Make sense ..?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 May as well leave the stub wall TBH as a pillar will be wider, plus a pillar may need a footing if it's not a good thickness, reinforced, slab. That way you can fly the new pad over the stub and into the adjacent wall. Removng that stub may feck that wall right up if it's toothed in from one wall to the other too, thus knackering it up completely from a load bearing PoV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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