Nickfromwales Posted October 3, 2016 Posted October 3, 2016 55 minutes ago, Onoff said: I can't see her not wanting this lot boxed in! Wonder if its worth chucking in that spare Geberit wall frame and getting a wall hung WC. Working round this one I'm having to virtually hug it, and you realise how often kids "miss"! Point #1, it's not the wife who'll want it boxed ? Point #2, cracking idea to put the other framed bog in there. Many birds one stone. Shall we extend the 2020 finish to 2022?
Onoff Posted October 3, 2016 Author Posted October 3, 2016 If I methodically CAD everything maybe even beyond:
Nickfromwales Posted October 3, 2016 Posted October 3, 2016 Turn the cad off and get a spanner out I really need to get cad fluent, but then I'd spend more time drawing the damn things than actually out earning dollars. I design most of my installs the day I turn up to fit them tbh. I just look at the space for an hour or two and work all the crossovers etc out in my head and then draw a few lines and mark locations of things so I can recollect what's going where when I'm underway and then just go for it. I see the job in layers in my head so I can put timbers in, board, lay clips etc, and allow for insulation / brassware accordingly and usually it goes in first time. Usually.
Onoff Posted October 3, 2016 Author Posted October 3, 2016 I'll often CAD it & THEN draw it physically on a board/big piece of card! All a bit tight next to this existing cistern. Showing what I think are some minimum spacings between fittings. I suppose I could turn the PRV thru 90deg? Its where to put the outside tap..... Maybe thinking about this the WRONG way. If later on this cistern comes out I need to think about just getting the MDPE connected even if a bit rough. I guess I could even feed the cistern and basin via a flexi for now?
Nickfromwales Posted October 4, 2016 Posted October 4, 2016 As long as water gets to them then what the hey Don't forget, if you go for an UVC or have to G3 the install, you'll need a secondary PRedV ( multiblock ) which will come supplied. That HAS to be with the cylinder for G3, even if you have one at the stopcock. They'll also want a NRV ( single check ) on the hot outlet to stop any unwanted mixing of pressures at mixer taps / showers etc from back flow, ( as a failsafe against the secondary PRedV ( at the stopcock ) failing ). Part of that multiblock would be a 5 or 6 bar cold mains blowoff, and also a TPRV, so make allowances for running a 22 or 28mm D2 discharge pipe if your going to need a path through the house to get it to ground level outside.
Onoff Posted October 4, 2016 Author Posted October 4, 2016 3 hours ago, Nickfromwales said: As long as water gets to them then what the hey Don't forget, if you go for an UVC or have to G3 the install, you'll need a secondary PRedV ( multiblock ) which will come supplied. That HAS to be with the cylinder for G3, even if you have one at the stopcock. They'll also want a NRV ( single check ) on the hot outlet to stop any unwanted mixing of pressures at mixer taps / showers etc from back flow, ( as a failsafe against the secondary PRedV ( at the stopcock ) failing ). Part of that multiblock would be a 5 or 6 bar cold mains blowoff, and also a TPRV, so make allowances for running a 22 or 28mm D2 discharge pipe if your going to need a path through the house to get it to ground level outside. Erm.....is some of that in Welsh? Lots of Googling now, G3, D2, TPRV...multiblock...but I'm OK with NRV & UVC!
Nickfromwales Posted October 4, 2016 Posted October 4, 2016 TPRV. Temp and pressure relief valve. D2. Discharge pipe work AFTER the tundish. G3. Certification for sealed hot water systems with volume of 15ltrs or above. Multi block aka control group Focker out. .
Onoff Posted October 4, 2016 Author Posted October 4, 2016 Tundish? Getting there figuring all this tight space out. Still like the idea of the outside tap at "full" available mains pressure. Showing below the MDPE stop cock 50mm above the floor then a Yorkshire T coming off to a Pegler isolating valve and out though the wall to the outside tap. This will however sit it just above the angled soil pipe and I think only about 8" up from the DPC so about 350mm off the ground. That soil could later go vertical down outside on the wall. Then PRV above the T. I've now to add another T above the PRV to tap off a line for the feed to the bottom fed cistern and along the bottom to the basin. BUT is's tight for vertical height Any hard and fast rule about butting compression fittings together i.e. little if any copper showing? Thinking to do away with the solder T after the MDPE stop cock and use a compression T to feed the Pegler isolator / outside tap. I could then get rid of the 25mm bits of copper either side of the Yorkshire.
Nickfromwales Posted October 4, 2016 Posted October 4, 2016 25mm stubs can go with the end feed tee, same as with compression. just solder the tee out of position, clean / file away the excess solder, cut back to required length and Roberts your Mothers Brother. That's what I'd do
Onoff Posted October 5, 2016 Author Posted October 5, 2016 8 hours ago, Nickfromwales said: 25mm stubs can go with the end feed tee, same as with compression. just solder the tee out of position, clean / file away the excess solder, cut back to required length and Roberts your Mothers Brother. That's what I'd do Cheers. I meant 22mm thinking about it! It's 22mm above the stop cock. I'm just not used to having fittings so close to each other! I might turn the outside tap feed so it goes up the side of the cistern then out the wall with a saddle bend to cross the feed to the cistern & basin (not shown). It'd put the outside tap at a more convenient height then.
Onoff Posted October 5, 2016 Author Posted October 5, 2016 This works..... Puts the outside tap about 2' above the eventual path level.
Barney12 Posted October 5, 2016 Posted October 5, 2016 Out of interest what cad package are you using with all those nice fittings?
Onoff Posted October 5, 2016 Author Posted October 5, 2016 23 minutes ago, Barney12 said: Out of interest what cad package are you using with all those nice fittings? It's called "Mauser Vernier Caliper V1.0".....
Barney12 Posted October 5, 2016 Posted October 5, 2016 OMG! I have this horrible feeling you are NOT joking
Onoff Posted October 5, 2016 Author Posted October 5, 2016 Each fitting is physically measured and drawn using AutoCAD 2010. Each one takes a few minutes. To do them in 3D takes longer.
Barney12 Posted October 5, 2016 Posted October 5, 2016 38 minutes ago, Onoff said: Each fitting is physically measured and drawn using AutoCAD 2010. Each one takes a few minutes. To do them in 3D takes longer. For ME to do this in any D would take forever 1
Onoff Posted October 5, 2016 Author Posted October 5, 2016 (edited) 7 hours ago, Barney12 said: For ME to do this in any D would take forever AutoCAD is just a big, blank piece of paper tbh. You draw everything at full size.....even if it's an aircraft carrier! You can download most fittings as pre done drawings tbh but it keeps my hand in. These were just quick, fag packet realisations tbh. They're near enough. A lot of people knock Acad but it's what I trained on. You could even plot your building plot gradients, heights and create a 3D releif. I think it's pretty intuitive tbh. It's only lines and curves after all. EDIT: Tbh I came up through AutoCAD LT98 then LT2000. Did a couple of years night school C&G then on full version 2000 & 2000i. Making the jump to 2010 was (is still) a steep learning curve for me. I even use it in "classic" mode. Main issue I'm having at the mo is creating legible JPEGS for inclusion in posts here. Really I want black backgrounds in my pics so the component colours stand out. Edited October 6, 2016 by Onoff
Onoff Posted October 6, 2016 Author Posted October 6, 2016 7 hours ago, Barney12 said: For ME to do this in any D would take forever If you want a taster of simple 2D CAD I've done a very short few page guide as a PDF using the completely free Draftsight program. PM me an email address or maybe one of the mods here can make it a sticky available for download?
Onoff Posted October 6, 2016 Author Posted October 6, 2016 Reckon this'll work alright, just laid loose at the mo:
Onoff Posted October 7, 2016 Author Posted October 7, 2016 I might whip the pan out for easier access. All that huggjng the pan whilst soldering is a right pita!
PeterW Posted October 7, 2016 Posted October 7, 2016 If it was me I would make that bottom tee with the drain off a compression tee and then you can just line the rest up and solder out of the way.
Barney12 Posted October 7, 2016 Posted October 7, 2016 On 06/10/2016 at 06:00, Onoff said: If you want a taster of simple 2D CAD I've done a very short few page guide as a PDF using the completely free Draftsight program. PM me an email address or maybe one of the mods here can make it a sticky available for download? I think that would be a great sticky. I've downloaded it and went cold and shivery! Feel free to drop me a copy 'my forum name at gmaildotcom'
Onoff Posted October 7, 2016 Author Posted October 7, 2016 52 minutes ago, Barney12 said: I think that would be a great sticky. I've downloaded it and went cold and shivery! Feel free to drop me a copy 'my forum name at gmaildotcom' Emailed just now!
Nickfromwales Posted October 7, 2016 Posted October 7, 2016 7 hours ago, Onoff said: I might whip the pan out for easier access. All that huggjng the pan whilst soldering is a right pita! Reminds you of the last time you came home pissed
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