Glazing Deluxe consultants?

[Alan Ambrose]

Anyone heard of / used Glazing Deluxe / Paul Elliott to source their windows?

 

I saw these guys yesterday at the London Homebuilding show yesterday. They claimed they were consultants and able to get better prices by going direct to the window manufacturers. 

[nod]

Sounds like a FB scam 

[JohnMo]

Get prices from them and others, pretty sure their service doesn't come free.

[craig]

1 hour ago, Alan Ambrose said:

Anyone heard of / used Glazing Deluxe / Paul Elliott to source their windows?

 

I saw these guys yesterday at the London Homebuilding show yesterday. They claimed they were consultants and able to get better prices by going direct to the window manufacturers. 

It’s possible but you don’t generally don’t get better deals by going direct. You might if they deal with the end consumer but they all tend to use official suppliers and do not deal with the consumer.

 

Consultancy work is something I’m currently looking into but theres a lot of things to be considered.

 

They’re just suppliers at the end of the day.

Edited September 21 by craig

[-rick-]

My completely uniformed first thought on this is this consultant is just a window supplier without offering any guarantees.

 

They can source the windows and then leave the installation up to you (maybe they point you at an installer but aren't going to take any liability for the job the installer does).

 

Are they going to come measure? Take responsibility if the order is wrong?

[nod]

We had a ridiculous quote from Rational 68 k supply only 

Then out of the blue they came back to us at around 50k Someone could easily argue that this is a genuine discount Take a 5k fee and they’ve saved you 13k 

Trade discounts can be pretty high

Or volume purchases more than trade 

It’s when something goes wrong 

The middle man won’t be interested 

[Mr Punter]

I think there is a lot of value in measuring, specifying, scheduling, unloading, distribution at site, protection, installation and warranty / snagging.  Perhaps an extra 50% on the basic delivered to site window order value.

[saveasteading]

21 minutes ago, nod said:

around 50k

Would it be possible to tell us what that equates to on £/m2 of window ?

It's always interesting and a good starting point in a costing exercise.... and I am out of date in my wbb.  (Wee black book).

[nod]

28 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

Would it be possible to tell us what that equates to on £/m2 of window ?

It's always interesting and a good starting point in a costing exercise.... and I am out of date in my wbb.  (Wee black book).

From memory Theres about 60m2 of glass Plus Velux es Not included in the quote 

As I stated Rational  and the other big player started off ridiculously I didn’t even ask what there supply and fit price was 

 

The door I posted recently over 100k 

All the 5 meter Ally trims had to come off before I could install the lighting strips as they where nowhere near straight Turned out they where stuck on with silicone 

Most window fitters are rough 

Better to pay your joiner to put them in or do it yourself 

 

 

[craig]

Velfac/Rationel are notorious for suddenly knocking 5/10/15k off a price. 
 

To me, it’s taken the piss to see what they can get away with and completely dishonest imho. I’m not saying it’s them directly but give the best price that you can in the first instance.

Edited September 21 by craig

[craig]

30 minutes ago, nod said:

Better to pay your joiner to put them in or do it yourself 

I disagree, your joiner and or yourself aren’t trained on the operational aspects and in my experience, it causes more heartache than paying an installation team.

 

It becomes an issue when the installation team/supplier takes on things and expect the install team to do it. Not necessarily having the knowledge or experience.

Edited September 21 by craig

[nod]

45 minutes ago, craig said:

I disagree, your joiner and or yourself aren’t trained on the operational aspects and in my experience, it causes more heartache than paying an installation team.

 

It becomes an issue when the installation team/supplier takes on things and expect the install team to do it. Not necessarily having the knowledge or experience.

and you really think your window fitters are trained 😁

Im on sites every day It’s all about getting them in as quick as possible 

[craig]

Yip, trained on product and factory approved and GGF standards on installation. The problem of chuck them in and worry about it later. 
 

I’m not saying you’re not capable, I’m just saying in my experience it’s an issue. Additionally, warranties can be void as a result of not using an approved installer.

[nod]

12 minutes ago, craig said:

Yip, trained on product and factory approved and GGF standards on installation. The problem of chuck them in and worry about it later. 
 

I’m not saying you’re not capable, I’m just saying in my experience it’s an issue. Additionally, warranties can be void as a result of not using an approved installer.

Most are subbies With less than a week’s training and don’t give a fly F##k about your job 

Window and door fitting isn’t a trade 

Most will learn as they fit 

 

These where fitted on a recent job Craned in by specialists 

Leaked and pooled in the middle 8k x 8 Blaming everything except themselves Never bothered to check the fall as they went Rea basic stuff I could post you examples all day 

 

 

[craig]

We both could post examples all day, don’t deny it but it is a trade but I do agree that there is a substantial amount of unskilled installers.

[G and J]

2 hours ago, saveasteading said:

Would it be possible to tell us what that equates to on £/m2 of window ?

Maybe not the highest u value windows at min 1.4, but hopefully good enough for us with what we intend to be a highly insulated, airtight house 🤞(and a woodburner, which we hope we'll get to use!) our measure, supply and fit contract for alitherm 400 (they manufacture and employ directly their surveyors and fitters rather than subcontract) is

 

£860 per m2 which include a 0.8 aluminimum front door, an aluminium personal door for the garage and 4m wide sliders.

 

Fitting due mid October, so we'll see how it goes, but so far so good

[nod]

1 hour ago, craig said:

We both could post examples all day, don’t deny it but it is a trade but I do agree that there is a substantial amount of unskilled installers.

Is it heck a trade 

[craig]

2 minutes ago, nod said:

Is it heck a trade 

We’ll agree to disagree.

Edited September 21 by craig

[nod]

Just now, craig said:

We’ll agree to disagree.

Come on Craig 

Please don’t tell me your a window fitter 😂

[craig]

No, I leave that to those trained and qualified to install and maintain the products. Everyone “thinks” it’s easy to do but it’s far from easy.

[Mr Punter]

1 hour ago, nod said:

and you really think your window fitters are trained 😁

Im on sites every day It’s all about getting them in as quick as possible 

 

I agree.  I have fairly recently had to pay out about £26k for leaky windows installed by an approved contractor.  I am still considering going after them for the money but it may cost a lot to prove.

[saveasteading]

2 hours ago, craig said:

in my experience it’s an issue

Agreed. As a main contractor I've had problems with window installation only a few times.

Hundreds done by specialists with no problems (or maybe they had issues but sorted them without me knowing).

One by specialist they had mismeasured a door. I changed the design and had the steel erectors enlarge the framing so that it would fit. This is simply a good relationship.

Same job, my mistake in not informing them of  a client chchange. They altered it without charge (I guess because of the favour, above.)

One Job had all sorts of issues.....because we thought our own guys could do it and we would save lots of money.  Mistake: its not easy.

 

Morals: perhaps a joiner could fit them relatively efficiently, otherwise specialist fitters only and a god manager for the measuring and ordering. I'm sure they add 20% or more but its worth it.

There are lots of risks and the costs of errors and bad workmanship are high.

 

One dodgy installer I met (and didn't use)  let out that he always allowed 20mm all round to make sure windows fitted, then loads of mastic.

 

Edited September 21 by saveasteading
clicked send too early