Joinery question. how best to make stick-build frameworks.

[saveasteading]

Im shocked I don't know this.

I've been knocking up a simple enclosure for a site toilet that will become a garage toilet, on an existing slab.

4 x 2 stud in 2.4m lengths. then osb facings.

 

 

When i make it with a base and head plate , and verticals, I end up with a panel that is 2.4 + 0.05 = 0.05 + 2.5m high

then onto that goes a 2.4m board that doesn't reach the ends. 

this is an increased issue if the frame is erected on a sole plate.

I've got gaps.

 

It seems a nonsense to cut the ends off standard studs.

 

The same will apply with plasterboard except that it is available 2.5m long......but not so competitively priced perhaps.

 

Are there any tricks?

 

 

[JamesP]

Verticals are 100mm shorter to allow for base and head plate horizontals. 

Is that right?

 

[G and J]

  On 31/01/2025 at 21:22, saveasteading said:

Are there any tricks?

Expand  

I speak (well, type!) as a keen woodworker and someone who has just put a deposit on a panelised self assembly timber frame package, based on 2.4m x 2.4m panels. 
 

The panels we are getting go up in price if the exceed 2.4m in height.  Basically they work to the sheet material with the studs cut to suit. 
 

I think that the trick is to accept that approach.  Work to the tightest restriction.  

[ProDave]

Be careful "making to panel size"  for some weird reason OSB is still available in imperial size, but don't build to that or you will curse when you try and plasterboard it as that is only available in metric.

[saveasteading]

Tempting as it is to premake panels on the floor or bench (the structural ones with osb) it wastes a lot of doubled up timber. So studwork must be the way and use a simple hopup for fixing boards. Probably worth buying or hiring a self feed screw gun.

A lot of pre-thought needed  too, on osb or plasterboard sizes if therd will be lits of cutting and cursing.

 

I've watched stud wall specialists, metal and wood, working with ease and speed, but not thought this size thing through before.

I have moaned at the amount of stud cutting waste but they, of course, are doing what suits them. A new stud or board every time whereas we on BH will find an offcut to use whenever we can.

 

I still need to know the best method for constructing the stud. A sole plate is essential levelled.  There won't be any floor above to connect to. Studs flop all over until the header goes on. We will have a builder doing this, but not one with this expertise.

[JohnMo]

I just bought longer timber (4.8 and 5.4) cut to suit. Found very little waste by the time you make noggins etc.

[SimonD]

  On 31/01/2025 at 21:22, saveasteading said:

Im shocked I don't know this.

I've been knocking up a simple enclosure for a site toilet that will become a garage toilet, on an existing slab.

4 x 2 stud in 2.4m lengths. then osb facings.

 

 

When i make it with a base and head plate , and verticals, I end up with a panel that is 2.4 + 0.05 = 0.05 + 2.5m high

then onto that goes a 2.4m board that doesn't reach the ends. 

this is an increased issue if the frame is erected on a sole plate.

I've got gaps.

 

It seems a nonsense to cut the ends off standard studs.

 

The same will apply with plasterboard except that it is available 2.5m long......but not so competitively priced perhaps.

 

Are there any tricks?

 

 

Expand  

 

As @ProDave says the standard off the shelf boards from BMs and most TMs is usually 2.44 x 1.22m unless you order in specifically 2.4 x 1.2. Although often assumed this is just a remnant of imperial measures, it's a function of being able to square off and remove the factory edge from things like sheets of plywood as they're rarely square or in good condition.

 

I had a carpenter in recently to do some work for me and he had never heard of trimming and squaring up plywood sheets when I told him to make sure it was done. Only when doing so did he realise how out of square they were - which would have ruined the finish.

 

Additionally, are you using 4 x 2 carcassing which is regularised or are you using 4 x 2 cls? The finished sizes of these are different!

 

Personally, I just trim the sheets and studs where needed - the losses are marginal on 2.4 cls.

 

Joined up thinking all this stuff does not represent 🤔

[JamesP]

I was surprised how little waste when using 4.8m and 3.6m CLS C16 / C24.

A few dumpy bags of off cuts left from tonnes of timber.

Final finished  sizes needed to be considered 50mm X 100mm = 38mm X 89mm.

I used wafer head screws and did purchase a Senco DS5525 for fixings, heavy but helps.

One of the more enjoyable parts of the build.

 

[saveasteading]

@JamesP it's almost a shame to hide that frame behind boards. Did you prefab any of that?

 

I'd bought 2 lots of 4 x 2 (excuse the shorthand. One lot was dressed as carcassing, the other sawn and  tanalised for shuttering. The latter was cheaper and seemed better quality, so I will note the advice on finished dimensions.

[JamesP]

I made the frame in sections on some workhorses.

Worth spending time on getting it all square and vertical.

Have fun.

[Iceverge]

I hope in the afterlife that I can go and stick frame nice buildings at my leisure in a summer meadow.

[saveasteading]

  On 01/02/2025 at 19:54, JamesP said:

made the frame in sections 

Expand  

That looks tall and heavy. How did you get it in position? 

That ladder also looks very high and precarious...I used to do that but no longer.

[JamesP]

@saveasteading

I used a extension on the bucket to lift Glulam ridge in position and some Genies to lift the 10.5m Steel for kitchen ridge.

Otherwise it was all lifted by my Dad,on ladder and myself, 74 and 54 at the time.

I did purchase some Kwikstage scaffolding to fit roof and cladding.