Materials and approval

[Russell griffiths]

Hope this is in the right place. 

So im thinking of importing some of the materials for my build. 

I will add bits as I think of them,what I would like to know is what type of approval do I need so I can use them, I don't mean planning approval, I mean do they have to have BBA to be used. 

The first item I'm thinking of is roofing sheets we have planned on having a raised seam metal roof, what does a metal sheet have to comply with to be used and how can I find out information on this. 

Confused as usual with the over complicated way things are done in our country. 

Cheers russ. 

[PeterW]

I would say the answer is “it depends”....

 

There are lots of materials out there with very tight manufacturing standards that are far in excess of the UK BBA requirements, and lots of countries sign up to stuff like TuV etc. Bringing those materials in shouldn’t be an issue as they have a provenance and MIs that should help with their approval. 

 

When you get into more obscure materials from countries without any recognisable standards, or where you are using a material for something it’s not normally used for such as making your internal walls from Siberian yoghurt pots, then you are into having to do a lot more proving that they will meet a standard and do a job. The good news is that the Approved Documents are just one way of proving adherence to the Building Regulations that are in the statutes. You will need to work with an engineer and the BCO to make sure that you understand how this all works together. 

 

But it if it makes you feel better, look around at how many stone cottages with thatched roofs and lime plaster walls are still standing 300 years on - let’s see you find a kite mark or spec for a lump of sandstone ..!! 

 

  

[ADLIan]

Compliance with relevant British Standard, harmonised European Standard (CE mark), BBA (or similar) or European Technical Approval normally acceptable routes to show compliance/acceptability . Mainland European countries all have their own version of BBA but BCOs often reluctant to accept these. See Approved Document 7 of the Regs for mor info.

 

Ian

 

 

[Russell griffiths]

44 minutes ago, ADLIan said:

Compliance with relevant British Standard, harmonised European Standard (CE mark), BBA (or similar) or European Technical Approval normally acceptable routes to show compliance/acceptability . Mainland European countries all have their own version of BBA but BCOs often reluctant to accept these. See Approved Document 7 of the Regs for mor info.

 

Ian

 

 

So what do I actually look up to see what certification a roof sheet needs. 

And if I buy sheets over here will anybody actually want to see where these sheets came from. 

[Jeremy Harris]

5 hours ago, Russell griffiths said:

So what do I actually look up to see what certification a roof sheet needs. 

And if I buy sheets over here will anybody actually want to see where these sheets came from. 

 

There are loads of ways of demonstrating compliance, but you often need to do a fair bit of work to track down enough information to keep BC happy.  Bear in mind that, as mentioned above, what we loosely refer to as the "building regulations" are really the Approved Documents that suggest some ways that the building regulations may be complied with - the Approved Documents are not the regulations, just guidance, in effect.

 

For example, for structures, then Approved Document Part A gives guidance based on standard details that are known to be OK, but equally you can use very non-standard details (like our passive slab, that sits on load-bearing expanded polystyrene) and show that this meets the regulations themselves.  In that case demonstration of compliance with the regulations was by a structural engineer's report, plus the specifications for the EPS, concrete floor and steel reinforcement.

 

When designing light aircraft (a hobby job I had for a time) I constantly had to battle a similar problem.  The UK CAA has a set of regulations, and a set of guidance documents, that are exact parallels to the way the building regulation system works, but maybe a couple of orders of magnitude more comprehensive.  I regularly had to show that materials and components imported from other countries, that did not have a recognised UK CAA or EASA (the European equivalent of the CAA) approval were OK.  Sometimes this was easy - for example AISI material specifications ( the US standard) often had a near-enough direct read across to European or UK standards.  An example would be that the common US structural light alloy, 6061-T6, was accepted as being equivalent to the far more common in the UK 6082-T6 alloy.  Sometimes I had to go back to basics, and compare tests showing material properties undertaken in another country with tests that would be more normal in the UK.  The most challenging job I did was convert all the data for a Hungarian aircraft design (before Hungary was in the EU) into the equivalent UK spec - it involved a fair few hours translating Hungarian to English and convincing a UK CAA surveyor that the materials used were equivalent to UK materials.

 

I doubt that there will be any significant problem if you are importing building materials from anywhere within the EU, as they will almost certainly have some form of specification and certification that can be read across.  There are a lot of agreements in place to accept certification from other countries as being equivalent to BBA.  For example, the Irish certification scheme, NSAI is almost always accepted as being OK in place of BBA certification (just as well, as our entire house and garage only carries NSAI certification for all the structural materials!).  You may need to provide evidence to show things like this, though - our building inspector wasn't aware of the read across from NSAI to BBA, for example, until I pointed it out.

Edited November 12, 2017 by JSHarris
typo

[curlewhouse]

From a conversation I had yesterday with the engineer of the firm who are overseeing our warranty,  I'd definitely talk to your BCO first  before parting with your cash once you've identified which you want to import- a throwaway remark I was told yesterday during a prolonged conversation (covered in another thread) was that if for example I'd got our SIPs panels from Sweden they'd (the warranty firm) "just walk away", having come across some unsatisfactory ones presumably.

[Ian]

@Russell griffiths

What approvals are you going to need exactly?

 

I would say that there's a bit more scope for the use of innovative or unusual materials within the Building Regs system than there is if you are having to satisfy the requirements of a warranty company or mortgage company surveyor, however when it comes down to it I'd agree with @curlewhouse - the only way of guaranteeing compliance is to appoint your BCO early on in the design process and then open a dialogue with them about the materials you would like to use.

 

Normally it doesn't cost any extra to appoint a BCO early in the process but I'd be upfront with them if you think that you will need a lot of input from them at the design stage - after all you will need their cooperation in the process and if they haven't budgeted for the required time they may not work with you in the way that you need.

 

[Ian]

On 11/12/2017 at 11:00, Russell griffiths said:

So what do I actually look up to see what certification a roof sheet needs. 

And if I buy sheets over here will anybody actually want to see where these sheets came from. 

The easiest way to prove compliance with UK Building Regs is if the product has a BBA certificate.

 

From my experience of dealing with building regulations in England and Wales since the system was taken out of the monopoly of Local Authorities, there is a vast difference in the approach that individual Approved Inspectors take. Some Approved Inspectors are 'by the book' and some are very flexible in their approach and open to the use of different approaches rather than strict compliance with the Approved Documents (as @JSHarris said the ADs are simply a short cut to compliance and are not the actual regulations).

 

With my own self-build my BCO didn't even ask for details of the simple metal roofing (not standing seam) that I specified, although as it happened I wouldn't have specified a system that didn't have a BBA certificate.