Opinions on best way to drop a ceiling

[Thorfun]

All our GF rooms have 2.6m ceilings with posi joists at 300mm centres with about 150mm gap between them. In our TV room I want to drop the ceiling by about 150mm to allow space for ceiling speakers and to add extra insulation to reduce noise to the bedroom above and to also make the room feel more ‘snug’. I also need to fit Led strip around the ceiling and so was thinking of double boarding and leave a gap for a channel around the out of the second layer of plasterboard. Hope that all makes sense. 
 

I’m after opinions on how you would do the drop ceiling and, if possible, why you’d do it that way detailing the thinking and reasons behind that decision. 

Edited May 18, 2023 by Thorfun
Typo

[nod]

Mf is quick and easy to use Lightweight and very strong 

The acoustics  are far better than wood

[MortarThePoint]

I'd recommend the Gyplyner system. It would be very easy to install. You could use the GL6 brackets to create up to 120mm void link. Longer brackets are available too.

 

PB screws to GL1 track, lengthened using GL3 connectors. GL8 around the perimeter. GL12 is another option for the brackets.

 

Also worth Googling "Gyplyner ceiling" for more info and videos.

 

I compared suppliers and BG are more expensive but their dimpled finish makes it much easier.

 

I'm using this system with AH185 (GL2) brackets. Travis Perkins carry all the BG bits but brackets were expensive so I got those ones from Minster. I'm screwing to concrete soffit (HCF). Plasterer wasn't familiar with this system so was a little nervous of whether it would be level. I've screwed (TechFast) each bracket in place on a 3mm packer to allow adjustment, but only a couple of brackets need tweaking thanks to using a laser level during installation. I've gone a bit OTT with GL1 @ 400mm centres and brackets around 900mm centres. I think the limit is 600mm X 1200mm, so I've made a lot of extra work for myself.

Edited May 19, 2023 by MortarThePoint

[Conor]

Metal all the way

[Dave Jones]

stud it. timber is sustainable.

[Thorfun]

4 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

stud it. timber is sustainable.

How would be the best way to timber stud a 150mm drop though? What timber would you use?

[Pocster]

@Thorfun you know what I’m going to say ….

[Dave Jones]

8 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

How would be the best way to timber stud a 150mm drop though? What timber would you use?

 

ledger plates on wall, noggins of the joists to support it.

[Pocster]

14 minutes ago, pocster said:

@Thorfun you know what I’m going to say ….

Suspended ceiling benefits :

 

Lightweight 

Easy to install 

No plastering

No painting

Access to pipes/cables 

Easy to add sound proofing 

Easy to add and move lighting 

Easy to add ceiling speakers etc.

Probably cheaper than ‘traditional’ ceiling 

 

What’s your problem ?

[Thorfun]

7 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

 

ledger plates on wall, noggins of the joists to support it.

my concern with a ledger plate is there are 2 x external walls in that room which have 80mm PIR and 25mm battens inside the TF. so the fixings for the ledger board will need to be extremely long to give the required depth into the TF. also the TF is only 140mm deep so that would limit the depth i could fix to and would worry about the depth of fixing to hold the ceiling.

[Thorfun]

2 minutes ago, pocster said:

Suspended ceiling benefits :

 

Lightweight 

Easy to install 

No plastering

No painting

Access to pipes/cables 

Easy to add sound proofing 

Easy to add and move lighting 

Easy to add ceiling speakers etc.

Probably cheaper than ‘traditional’ ceiling 

 

What’s your problem ?

looks like an office block? 😉

[Dave Jones]

20 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

my concern with a ledger plate is there are 2 x external walls in that room which have 80mm PIR and 25mm battens inside the TF. so the fixings for the ledger board will need to be extremely long to give the required depth into the TF. also the TF is only 140mm deep so that would limit the depth i could fix to and would worry about the depth of fixing to hold the ceiling.

 

the joys of a shed build!

[Pocster]

56 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

looks like an office block? 😉

Extra benefit 

[Pocster]

56 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

looks like an office block? 😉

Seriously . With correct lighting ( not office style ) it looks ok . You get use to it and tend not to look at the ceiling anymore than you would in any house . Lots of positives; visuals no , not the best .

[MortarThePoint]

2 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

stud it. timber is sustainable.

 

I think that is debatable and timber would certainly take a lot longer, be heavier, give less void and be less performant acoustically. It is also likely to be more expensive.

[Thorfun]

28 minutes ago, MortarThePoint said:

be heavier

this is of particular concern as I'm currently trying to find out about whether the Gypliner system is suitable for attaching to posi-joists. BG told me to talk to my posi manufacturer. Posis were designed by Wolf but they don't have load calculations, those would be with my TF company who have since gone bust. so it's looking most likely that I need a lightweight solution any way

[Pocster]

1 hour ago, Thorfun said:

this is of particular concern as I'm currently trying to find out about whether the Gypliner system is suitable for attaching to posi-joists. BG told me to talk to my posi manufacturer. Posis were designed by Wolf but they don't have load calculations, those would be with my TF company who have since gone bust. so it's looking most likely that I need a lightweight solution any way

Cough cough 

[Thorfun]

5 hours ago, MortarThePoint said:

I'd recommend the Gyplyner system. It would be very easy to install. You could use the GL6 brackets to create up to 120mm void link. Longer brackets are available too.

 

PB screws to GL1 track, lengthened using GL3 connectors. GL8 around the perimeter. GL12 is another option for the brackets.

 

Also worth Googling "Gyplyner ceiling" for more info and videos.

 

I compared suppliers and BG are more expensive but their dimpled finish makes it much easier.

 

I'm using this system with AH185 (GL2) brackets. Travis Perkins carry all the BG bits but brackets were expensive so I got those ones from Minster. I'm screwing to concrete soffit (HCF). Plasterer wasn't familiar with this system so was a little nervous of whether it would be level. I've screwed (TechFast) each bracket in place on a 3mm packer to allow adjustment, but only a couple of brackets need tweaking thanks to using a laser level during installation. I've gone a bit OTT with GL1 @ 400mm centres and brackets around 900mm centres. I think the limit is 600mm X 1200mm, so I've made a lot of extra work for myself.

this post is an absolute gem. thank you @MortarThePoint. i've read quite a bit about MF ceiling systems in the past and your post seems to make the most sense to me. i was previously getting very lost with all the GL numbers but your simple 'use this, this and this' description was brilliant. so thanks again.

 

i've looked in to the Gypliner system and watched a few videos and it seems really easy. so, once i've confirmed my posi-joists will take the load i'm going to be looking at using GL1 tracks, GL8 wall channels and GL12s for the brackets with the GL3 connectors. using the GL12s gives us up to 175mm drop potential and after discussions with SWMBO we're thinking to drop the ceiling down to allow us a full sheet of plasterboard on the walls. so that'll be approx 160mm drop and will give us 2.4m ceiling heights.

 

does anyone know if screwing the GL8 wall channels in to 25mm battens will be strong enough btw? or should i be looking at going through the 105mm make-up of the external walls and in to the TF? i have 180mm screws left over from attaching the PIR.

 

and any comments/concerns about this solution?

 

and sorry @pocster to not use your suggested grid system. 😉

[Thorfun]

1 minute ago, pocster said:

Cough cough 

don't worry, i've decided to go MF. just not grid.

 

[MortarThePoint]

Are the battens running vertically or horizontally and what is holding them in place?

 

I think you would normally treat normally have the brackets a fair distance from the GL8, but if you have them close by the GL8 won't be carrying much load. Look out for deflection heads etc though as the closer you have the first bracket to the GL8, the greater the effect of any differential movement.

[Thorfun]

10 minutes ago, MortarThePoint said:

Are the battens running vertically or horizontally and what is holding them in place?

 

I think you would normally treat normally have the brackets a fair distance from the GL8, but if you have them close by the GL8 won't be carrying much load. Look out for deflection heads etc though as the closer you have the first bracket to the GL8, the greater the effect of any differential movement.

battens are vertical (standard service cavity battens) and they're held in place by screwing through them and the PIR in to the TF beyond using 150mm screws.

[MortarThePoint]

14 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

battens are vertical (standard service cavity battens) and they're held in place by screwing through them and the PIR in to the TF beyond using 150mm screws.

The bottom of the batten isn't resting on something?

[Thorfun]

53 minutes ago, MortarThePoint said:

The bottom of the batten isn't resting on something?

nope as i've got a gap at 450mm high from the bottom batten for the ring main

 

Edited May 19, 2023 by Thorfun
added photo

[MortarThePoint]

1 hour ago, Thorfun said:

nope as i've got a gap at 450mm high from the bottom batten for the ring main

 

It's not going to end up supported by screed when the screed goes in?

 

Having GL1's and brackets near the perimeter walls looks sensible, but just check if there are deflection heads

[Thorfun]

1 minute ago, MortarThePoint said:

It's not going to end up supported by screed when the screed goes in?

 

Having GL1's and brackets near the perimeter walls looks sensible, but just check if there are deflection heads

not sure yet! but it's moot as there's a 50mm gap between vertical battens at 450mm above FFL (you can see that in the photos) so even if the bottom batten does rest on the screen to higher of the two vertical battens still aren't resting on anything. i can screw the GL8 through the battens and all the way to the TF. if i use 180mm screws that's a 75mm bearing in the TF plus it's going through 25mm battens. pretty sure that should hold it all!