Timber framed house

[sineaddurkan]

Hi everyone, I am researching a timber framed construction house build, any advise would be amazing, we are looking at the cost and I'm under the impression that by going down the timber frame route is considerably cheaper but reading people's build stories so far, it seems that it isn't that much cheaper! Has anyone finished their TF build that could give advise? We haven't even got our property up for sale yet ( we are relying on the sale to buy a plot ) so are in the very early, early stages. My partner said that the construction time alone for the TF is a good enough reason to go this route because it will save weeks on the build time. Does anyone have any options on this? I have 100's of questions but need to start with the basics! Many thanks 

[Kelvin]

Timber kits are dearer. Comparable stick build cheaper but slower. 
 

Timber kits are obviously faster to put up as you can get to weather tight in days. Ours is going to take 10 days including all insulation and windows fitted. However this is only an advantage if you can schedule all the follow on trades  immediately after the kit goes up. That’s not easy to do unless you’re using a main contractor. I’ve managed to do this but it’s been a fair effort to do and as we’ve just finished the groundworks my careful planning might fall apart at first contact. 
 

Also look at ICF and don’t rule out brick and block. 

[Dave Jones]

timber frames are utterly pointless unless you plan to have the whole build finished in 12 weeks.

 

Zero point paying over the odds to get watertight in a week if it then takes another 9 months to finish before you move in.

 

 

[Thorfun]

1 hour ago, Dave Jones said:

timber frames are utterly pointless unless you plan to have the whole build finished in 12 weeks.

 

Zero point paying over the odds to get watertight in a week if it then takes another 9 months to finish before you move in.

 

 

apart from the whole environmental and sustainability angle of course

[sineaddurkan]

2 hours ago, Kelvin said:

Timber kits are dearer. Comparable stick build cheaper but slower. 
 

Timber kits are obviously faster to put up as you can get to weather tight in days. Ours is going to take 10 days including all insulation and windows fitted. However this is only an advantage if you can schedule all the follow on trades  immediately after the kit goes up. That’s not easy to do unless you’re using a main contractor. I’ve managed to do this but it’s been a fair effort to do and as we’ve just finished the groundworks my careful planning might fall apart at first contact. 
 

Also look at ICF and don’t rule out brick and block. 

Thank you for the reply, the kit house companies that we’ve looked at said they would provide a complete service which included all the follow on trades and even provide kitchens and bathrooms, is this something you considered. There is so much to think about!

[jonM]

2 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

timber frames are utterly pointless unless you plan to have the whole build finished in 12 weeks.

 

Zero point paying over the odds to get watertight in a week if it then takes another 9 months to finish before you move in.

 

Having built / lived in both brick and block and timber frame I would always go timber frame as it is easier to get it well insulated and airtight. It's not impossible with brick and block just more difficult. Your objectives for doing the self build and your personal circumstances may well dictate which route is best for you. 

[Kelvin]

52 minutes ago, sineaddurkan said:

Thank you for the reply, the kit house companies that we’ve looked at said they would provide a complete service which included all the follow on trades and even provide kitchens and bathrooms, is this something you considered. There is so much to think about!

They call that turnkey. We didn’t look at that as it was too expensive. It’s undoubtedly the easiest way to do it as your handing more or less everything to them but at a price. However if it’s within your budget then it’s convenient. There are builders that will do the whole thing for you too. So you get a design done via an architect then go out to tender to a number of building contractors who then build everything for you which could be via any of the build methods. 
 

The first step before you do anything else is work out what your total budget is. Then get an idea what the going rate is for plots of land in the area you want. You’ll then know how much you have available to build. The hardest part of self-building is finding the plot of land in the first place. 

[ProDave]

2 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

timber frames are utterly pointless unless you plan to have the whole build finished in 12 weeks.

 

Zero point paying over the odds to get watertight in a week if it then takes another 9 months to finish before you move in.

 

 

Not at all.  My timber frame was stick built by a local building firm, so not quite a "kit house".  After their initial quick assembly of the frame, it then took me 5 years to complete it myself.

 

For me the main advantage of timber frame is almost the entire thickness of the walls can be insulation of some form or other. Vs Masonry where the actual bricks or blocks add little insulation.  So you can get a very good indeed passive house level build with masonry, the overall walls thickness will be more than it could be with timber frame.

 

A lot depends on what is normal where you are, in in this part of Scotland, Timber frame is normal so no problem finding a competent builder to do it right.

[Nickfromwales]

2 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

timber frames are utterly pointless unless you plan to have the whole build finished in 12 weeks.

 

Zero point paying over the odds to get watertight in a week if it then takes another 9 months to finish before you move in.

Complete and utter horse manure.

 

The internal fit is typically much longer with a masonry build. With a TF build you can be weathertight much, much sooner, and with staggeringly good results from insulation and airtightness, which are inherent from that type of build system. Masonry is a real pita to achieve the same with.

MBC leave you with all walls and ceilings battened out and ready to accept plasterboard, with all woodwork ( within sensible reason ) installed at 300, 400, or 600mm centres, meaning the internal fit is DIY'able with ease. Ask someone to dry-line their own build and you'll see less people able to DIY that volume of work / have the necessary skill-set.

 

MBC PH TF or Nudura XR35 ICF for me.

[Nickfromwales]

1 hour ago, sineaddurkan said:

Thank you for the reply, the kit house companies that we’ve looked at said they would provide a complete service which included all the follow on trades and even provide kitchens and bathrooms, is this something you considered. There is so much to think about!

Hi, and welcome!

 

I would seriously consider having the "builder" do the building, and then have kitchen and bathroom fitters / installers do the 'nice stuff'. If all has gone well with the TF, then you should have enough marbles left in the bag to choose, and direct, your own downstream trades ( for these individual spaces ). Depends on your nerves / balls / confidence, but with support here you should be able to add your own input / signature to the rooms which need this type of personal input.

[Kelvin]

To give you some idea. My approach so far has been: 

 

Engage timber kit company. They’ll supply and erect the kit to weather tight so that includes windows and doors, external membrane, steel work and insulation. 

 

Engage various consultants for the technical design such as foundation, drainage (treatment plant and soakaway), private water supply etc

 

Install electricity supply. 

 

Engage groundswork company on a fixed price. He supplied all materials and brickies except the insulated blockwork I sourced them

 

I’ve then got quotes/tendered for every other element of the build from the roofing down. Kitchens, bathrooms, MVHR, ASHP, HA, electrical, plumbing, tiles, screed, joinery, plastering, garage, scaffolding, welfare etc, some on supply and fit and some just fit. It’s about 13 different companies/trades so far averaging 3 quotes per element and 5 contacts per element (not everyone you contact will quote)

 

It’s a fair degree of effort tracking it all and it’s taken me 12 months to get to this point from when we signed the kit contract and 20 months from when we first viewed the plot. It was 11 months from signing the contract to breaking ground which is almost complete. The kit arrives on the 17 April and will be up by the 27th. Two week buffer in case delays and first trades on-site mid May. We’re aiming for an October finish. 
 

I’m effectively retired so have the time. Other half still works so effectively my client 😂 Hats off to the folk that do all this plus actually build it and hold down full time jobs. 

Edited March 16, 2023 by Kelvin

[sineaddurkan]

On 15/03/2023 at 16:40, Kelvin said:

Timber kits are dearer. Comparable stick build cheaper but slower. 
 

Timber kits are obviously faster to put up as you can get to weather tight in days. Ours is going to take 10 days including all insulation and windows fitted. However this is only an advantage if you can schedule all the follow on trades  immediately after the kit goes up. That’s not easy to do unless you’re using a main contractor. I’ve managed to do this but it’s been a fair effort to do and as we’ve just finished the groundworks my careful planning might fall apart at first contact. 
 

Also look at ICF and don’t rule out brick and block. 

Thank you for the reply, the kit house companies that we’ve looked at said they would provide a complete service which included all the follow on trades and even provide kitchens and bathrooms, is this something you considered. There is so much to think about!

 

4 hours ago, Kelvin said:

To give you some idea. My approach so far has been: 

 

Engage timber kit company. They’ll supply and erect the kit to weather tight so that includes windows and doors, external membrane, steel work and insulation. 

 

Engage various consultants for the technical design such as foundation, drainage (treatment plant and soakaway), private water supply etc

 

Install electricity supply. 

 

Engage groundswork company on a fixed price. He supplied all materials and brickies except the insulated blockwork I sourced them

 

I’ve then got quotes/tendered for every other element of the build from the roofing down. Kitchens, bathrooms, MVHR, ASHP, HA, electrical, plumbing, tiles, screed, joinery, plastering, garage, scaffolding, welfare etc, some on supply and fit and some just fit. It’s about 13 different companies/trades so far averaging 3 quotes per element and 5 contacts per element (not everyone you contact will quote)

 

It’s a fair degree of effort tracking it all and it’s taken me 12 months to get to this point from when we signed the kit contract and 20 months from when we first viewed the plot. It was 11 months from signing the contract to breaking ground which is almost complete. The kit arrives on the 17 April and will be up by the 27th. Two week buffer in case delays and first trades on-site mid May. We’re aiming for an October finish. 
 

I’m effectively retired so have the time. Other half still works so effectively my client 😂 Hats off to the folk that do all this plus actually build it and hold down full time jobs. 

Hi kelvin, thank you so much for the reply, there is so much to consider and organise 

; we are going to the trade show in the nec Birmingham next weekend so hopefully will get some ideas there too but the information you have given is so helpful, so thank you for that! 

[Kelvin]

No problem. Buildhub is an invaluable resource for the self-builder and indeed anyone doing anything to their house. It is pretty likely most questions you have will already have been asked and answered so use the search function. A top tip is to use google to search the forum as it can return better results. 
 

There are a few books that are useful and worth getting: 

 

Self-Build Simplified by Barry Sutcliffe - walks you through all main things to think about

 

The House Builders Bible by Mark Brinkley - This is a more general book covering a wide array of items including renovations and extensions. 
 

 

[Thorfun]

1 hour ago, sineaddurkan said:

Thank you for the reply, the kit house companies that we’ve looked at said they would provide a complete service which included all the follow on trades and even provide kitchens and bathrooms, is this something you considered. There is so much to think about!

they offer the service but they charge handsomely for it. if you do it the way @Kelvin has and we did and how many others have on here by project managing after the TF company gets you to a watertight stage then you can save substantial amounts of money. but it can often take a lot longer and can be a lot of work managing it all.

 

everyone has to take their own journey but for us doing it this way meant we could build a bigger house. to pay a turnkey or main contractor would've meant a much smaller house for the same amount of money.