eandg Posted January 29, 2023 Share Posted January 29, 2023 We plan to have UFH on ground floor only with towel heaters to upstairs bathroom and ensuite. Our ASHP contractor has suggested we should plumb in our towel heaters so they can also run off the hot water tank too - any views either way? Plumbers starting this week and hadn't specced for it but if it's worth doing we can get a bit more pipe ran. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonner Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 Not exactly run off the hot water tank but tee off the ASHP flow before any control valves. That’s what I have done and it works well because the towel rads come on whenever there is any demand from hot water or UFH. Even in the summer you need a bit of warmth and dry towels in the bathroom. I just turn them down manually when it gets too warm, maybe you could use TRVs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorfun Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 Wouldn’t electric towel heaters give more flexibility as they’ll heat when required rather than when the heating is on? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eandg Posted January 30, 2023 Author Share Posted January 30, 2023 33 minutes ago, Thorfun said: Wouldn’t electric towel heaters give more flexibility as they’ll heat when required rather than when the heating is on? It's second hand as it was my partner who spoke with him, but think he suggested they can be electric and plumbed in? Is it an either or? 42 minutes ago, Bonner said: Not exactly run off the hot water tank but tee off the ASHP flow before any control valves. That’s what I have done and it works well because the towel rads come on whenever there is any demand from hot water or UFH. Even in the summer you need a bit of warmth and dry towels in the bathroom. I just turn them down manually when it gets too warm, maybe you could use TRVs. Thanks - does that mean you need to run pipework from the heat pump (so separate to your main run from the tank)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorfun Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 1 hour ago, eandg said: Is it an either or? don't know! not got that far in our build yet. 😉 but i was going to simply go electric as it just seemed simpler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elite Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 You can get dual fuel ones, you just need to isolate from your main heating system when you're using the electric element Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eandg Posted January 30, 2023 Author Share Posted January 30, 2023 1 hour ago, elite said: You can get dual fuel ones, you just need to isolate from your main heating system when you're using the electric element Yes - plumber says it's a rubbish idea and you can't just tee off the pipework but need to run it separately. 2 hours ago, Thorfun said: don't know! not got that far in our build yet. 😉 but i was going to simply go electric as it just seemed simpler Indeed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelvin Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 We’re going with electric towel rails. Had them before and they are fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvin Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 We have a radiator for heating and an electric towel radiator for spring/autumn coolness. 90W is plenty for us on a timer.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Blobby Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 (edited) The towel rail in our bathroom is connected to the DHW feed and I really hate it. Its awful. We have the DHW on for several hours a day; who needs towels that hot? The bathroom is either too hot, or if we turn of the tap at the radiator, too cold. A TRV would probably help but its a crap rented house so we just put up with it. The shoulder months are the worst as you can imagine the bathroom is like a sauna and the rest of upstairs freezing cold. House we are about to start building will have electric towel rads. Maybe controlled by a PIR sensor. Edited January 30, 2023 by Mr Blobby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonner Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 6 hours ago, eandg said: Thanks - does that mean you need to run pipework from the heat pump (so separate to your main run from the tank)? You will have a flow and return from the heat pump and you need a circuit for the towel rads. This just needs to be connected before the control valves. No extra piping just different connection point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonner Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 1 hour ago, Mr Blobby said: The towel rail in our bathroom is connected to the DHW feed and I really hate it. Its awful. We have the DHW on for several hours a day; who needs towels that hot? The bathroom is either too hot, or if we turn of the tap at the radiator, too cold. A TRV would probably help but its a crap rented house so we just put up with it. The shoulder months are the worst as you can imagine the bathroom is like a sauna and the rest of upstairs freezing cold. House we are about to start building will have electric towel rads. Maybe controlled by a PIR sensor. Guessing you have a gas boiler? With an ASHP towel rads never get too hot and are always on, controlled by room and tank thermostats. I did consider electric and agree they could be a better solution for some. They are very slow to warm up so wouldn’t rely on a PIR sensor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorfun Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 Just now, Bonner said: They are very slow to warm up so wouldn’t rely on a PIR sensor. can you quantify 'very slow' please? and how does that compare to water heated towel rads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonner Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 1 minute ago, Thorfun said: can you quantify 'very slow' please? and how does that compare to water heated towel rads? The ones I had in the past were 300W and took about 30mins to reach temperature. Water heated, at least by an ASHP, are not faster to warm up but they always on. My point was relying on a PIR to switch on a towel rad may not work very well as you would be finished before it warms up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 5 hours ago, elite said: You can get dual fuel ones, you just need to isolate from your main heating system when you're using the electric element Now you have me concerned. We have ASHP with UFH downstairs and rads upstairs. It's set up as a single zone and the rads only every get slightly warm. The rooms are warm enough but our heating engineer put in a dual fuel one in our upstairs en suite for the towels. We were told just to switch it on when needed so we've effectively been using both at the same time for an hour each morning. What are the issues I could be causing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Blobby Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 (edited) 55 minutes ago, Bonner said: Guessing you have a gas boiler? With an ASHP towel rads never get too hot and are always on, controlled by room and tank thermostats. I did consider electric and agree they could be a better solution for some. They are very slow to warm up so wouldn’t rely on a PIR sensor. The OP asks about connecting up the towel rails to the DHW flow, not the central heating circuit, so will be hotter than UFH flow temps. It makes no sense to me because the times I want hot water are not the same as when I want to heat the bathroom towel rails. If I wash the dishes in the kitchen, for example, then heat is sent to the towel rails in the bathroom. Its bonkers. I take your point about the time to heat the electric towel rail, however, so we can always put them on a timer. The important part for me is that the towel rail control is completely seperate to heating the hot water. Edited January 30, 2023 by Mr Blobby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elite Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 9 minutes ago, Ralph said: Now you have me concerned. We have ASHP with UFH downstairs and rads upstairs. It's set up as a single zone and the rads only every get slightly warm. The rooms are warm enough but our heating engineer put in a dual fuel one in our upstairs en suite for the towels. We were told just to switch it on when needed so we've effectively been using both at the same time for an hour each morning. What are the issues I could be causing? I don't think it is a cause for concern, but your towel rail will be trying to heat everythinig else on that circuit 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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